Reamer

[Braxton1]

A No-Go gauge is only going to tell you when you've gone too far on the chamber depth. If the slide closes on a No-Go, we have a problem (especially if you've gone significantly past that dimension.

The slide should close on a Go gauge, but there's only 0.022" before we get into "too far".

Also, you'll need to remove the extractor so that it doesn't interfere with what you're trying to feel.

[brian45acp]

If max length is .756 It means my chambers are all short it it won't chamber.

I'm sort of undecided here. I could buy better brass but I don't think that will fix this 100%. Any time I get one slightly over .754 it's going to prevent the barrel from locking up and jam the gun. On the other hand why arent more people talkin about doing this? All my CZ are the same and brass at .756 won't chamber unless I slam it in there and the the slide sticks to eject it.

I'm considering buying once fires nickel brass so that I know it's all good quality. I would have to buy all the crap along with it to start tumbling again but I don't so much mind that of its the best option.

I guess what I need to understand is if there is any harm in altering the chamber? I could consider only doing this on my competition guns which are 2 of them. My carry guns will be function tested and see very light use. Since I carry premimium duty ammo I know it works just fine.

Edited June 24, 2015 by brian45acp

[Toolguy]

You could buy a brass trimmer and trim all the brass to the same length before loading. Then you know they are all the same and will all work. It's much easier just to trim the barrel once though.

[brian45acp]

Yeah that's what I figured.

I honestly think this would increase reliability and actually be a good idea even on my CCW gun.

I still don't know about this no go thing. Is the link I put what I need? You mentioned one allows slide to close the other doesn't. So I need 2 types of these?

http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/measuring-tools/headspace-gauges/go-no-go-gauge-sets-prod26876.aspx

Do you think removing 5 thousandths is still necessary to get these gauges? I'm just finish reaming a tiny bit until the longer brass clears and that's all.

Edited June 24, 2015 by brian45acp

[Toolguy]

You don't absolutely have to have the gauges if you understand the concept of how they are used. You can use empty brass of known lengths as gauges. It is just a way to tell how deep the chamber is.

[brian45acp]

I'm just trying to understand what it will do for me. My plan is to make a turn of the reamer and check until the longer brass will chamber and barrel locks up. We are talking like 3-5 thousandths is all. If these gauges are of good use I don't mind getting them but I fell like one will tell me my chamber is good with the no go and the other go will tell me a perfect OAL is good. I pretty much already know this.

Maybe if I understand how to use them I can see the benefit.

[Toolguy]

You want to go about 5 thou. past your longest brass. Then you're set. That's all there is to it really. Quite simple.

[Aircooled6racer]

Hello: If you are going to reload then you will need to ream the barrel. As stated above you can use the brass you are using as a gauge. CZ do have short chambers if you reload and the throat is short if you load a little longer. Make the barrel fit your reloads not the reloads to the barrel. There are places that will rent you the reamer if you do a search. Tap wrenches can be bought even at Sears etc. Hope this helps. Thanks, Eric

[DWFAN]

If your gun goes into battery on the go, you're good to go (for most brass)

If your gun goes into battery on the No Go. You arent good to go. That means your chamber is cut too deep.

If you only buy 1 gauge, buy the Go. You can add tape to the gauge to get it to the length you want, or as said before, use a pc of brass that you have measured.

Edited June 24, 2015 by DWFAN

[brian45acp]

I think I follow you guys. Now that I identified this issue I measured the brass and know which ones will fit and which won't. I simply plan to take the longest one I found which is .758 and ream my barrel to just chamber it. With the advice you guys gave me a few thousandth past that should be perfect.

These gauges I don't see telling me much. A piece of brass at .758 that just chambers is still a short chamber vs a glock. I suppose the no go would confirm I didn't go too far. I like doing things properly and perfect so it seems these may be good tools to have. My buddy was saying to use the back of the calipers as a depth gauge to the headspace and barrel hood. If I know a start and and finish I know I increased it just a little like 5 thousandths and I'm good.

So how long is the go gauge? Is it short or long? In other words if it were say max length .758 that would be helpful as I could use it to just fit plus a little and the check with the no go that I didn't to too far. And to confirm, the advice was to remove my extractor? I am not sure how it stays centered and cuts evenly. I figure I would understand once I get it in hand. I want to be sure I do this right.

Any thought on doing this to my CCW gun or not?i figure these chambers are so short it would be a reliability increase to assure all my ammo feeds. New ammo seems to be fine but I do practice with my reloads.

It's funny that cz must use min length chambers and glock max. The cz is so sensitive to brass length and either I'm crazy or have figured this out to where others haven't. I hear propel ream their cz barrels often but many don't. I imagine its all what type brass you are using. I love using once fired and leaving it behind. No more tumbling and picking it up. If I bought new brass it all stretches with resizing so at some point my same issues would return hence I think reaming is the best choice.

By the way I can't thank you all enough. It's awesome to have help from real people and not the average forum idiots like the other forums. Thanks so much for this help

Edited June 25, 2015 by brian45acp

[brian45acp]

I want to be sure I have this down and there isnt a learning lesson at the end, lol.

1) extractor out and place barrel in a vise facing vertically

2) attach the T handle

3) oil the heck out of the reamer and throat then drop it into place

4) I was told to back turn it just a smidge then clockwise so that it would bite in. While holding both ends with 2 hands make 1 full turn. So if handle is at 3 and 9 I turn it until one side makes it all the way around and is back to where it started

5) the weight of the tool for pressure but not much more then that

6) make a turn then measure the depth with my calipers or selected brass as a test fit

7) use the go and no go to confirm all is happy and good

8) use my longest brass piece in the chamber and slip it up the breech face to lock the barrel into the lugs.

9) confirm with my calipers my start and finish is about 5 thousandths or what ever amount may be needed

How can it remove a perfect amount so that there isnt some material left at the start and end point. In other words it bites in and as you turn it removes metal back to the starting point and you stop. At the point you stop I dont know how it could be a perfect flush circle and not have a high spot.

[Steve RA]

SAAMI specs are max length of 0.754 so if any of the cases are over that length, they are out of spec. If the chamber isn't that long, or a few thousandths longer, it is out of spec.

[Toolguy]

First of all - never turn a reamer backwards. That dulls the cutting edge. As you are turning the reamer, you will be able to develop a feel for whether it is cutting or not. You will probably need to put a little down pressure to make it cut. At the end you can turn it a few times with no down pressure (not going deeper) to make sure you have a smooth finish.

While you are cutting and measuring you can figure out how much pressure it takes to make it cut by turning a few turns with only the weight of the tool, measure depth, turn it a couple of times with light pressure, measure depth, couple turns with a little more pressure, measure, etc. It probably won't cut much one turn at a time, but you do want to sneak up on it to begin with until you develop a feel for what is going on. By the time you do 2 or 3 chambers you will be an old pro.

Be sure to clean the oil & chips out good before each check. Brake parts cleaner is your friend for this. Hold the barrel over a waste basket (preferably outside) for the brake parts operation. When finished, empty the watse basket into a trash can to avoid a fire hazard. Any brake cleaner left in the waste basket will quickly evaporate, making it safe to take back inside.

[brian45acp]

good tips. I like the idea better of light pressure to get it going then more to begin the cut and finish with light to smooth it out

Any risk in the thing not sitting perfectly flush? They are said to have a pilot but I am not sure how that works but I sure hope it keeps it from cutting at an angle.

Steve RA: Thanks for that. I think my barrel is right at the limit. I am not sure I can measure it because the brass sticks above the barrel hood so it wont give me an accurate chamber length reading. All I know is with several pieces of brass I measured them all and as soon as I get to .755 it starts feeling gritty to lock the barrel up and beyond .755 it just wont go. This of course with the slide off and just slipping the barrel forward out the end and then the brass under the extractor and then pulling the barrel back onto the brass. At that point when the brass is not in the chamber I try to press the barrel up into the lugs and it wont lock in.

OK guys I think I got this.

Last question: Ream the barrel on my ccw CZ? I figure once I figure out how to do this right it could only aid in reliability. I havent had any factory ammo hand the slide up but since CZ chambers seem to be exactly at the minimum length for maximum brass length bad things could happen if 1 round happens to be over .754

[Steve RA]

One thing that hasn't been discussed is the lede, or throat, after the chamber ends. If the rifling comes to an abrupt shoulder, vs a gradual taper, it will have a definite effect on the configuration and seating depth of various bullets you might choose to use. I like a fairly long taper to mine so I have as large as possible a choice of bullets and can also seat fairly long.

So you might consider that as well in your choice of reamers.

[brian45acp]

I figured I would get the Manson reamer. What did you have in mind?

And to be sure I am buying the proper tool I am getting the finish reamer from Manson. I understand a throating reamer tapers the rifling so I am guessing that is a separate tool. My issue is the length of the brass so I think my choice in a finish reamer is correct. I did have to shorten my OAL for my particular JHP but I dont really mind that. In other words I wouldnt be reaming my barrel if it was something in my reloads I could change instead.

I saw a post from a guy using a brand new manson reamer who scratched his rifling. Any tips on how to avoid messing up. I know not to turn it backwards and use very light pressure and even lighter pressure and I come up on the final turn to finish it off.

Edited June 25, 2015 by brian45acp

[DWFAN]

My Manson appears to have a nice taper. I used it in my CZs to lengthen the throat without making the chamber longer. It was much longer than whatever CZ uses.

Edited June 25, 2015 by DWFAN

[Guest]

Just as an FYI - Beven Grams (Grams Engineering - he has a page in the forum vendor section) will do throat reaming, and I think finish chamber reaming, for a very fair price. Less than you can purchase a reamer. Giving him a call and asking might be worth your time.

The advice on this thread is good (toolguy knows his stuff), but if you have any doubts you can send your slide and barrel to someone who has a lot of experience and get it back done right, and it could be throat reamed if you wanted, too.

I only mention this because a while ago there was a nice fellow who was asking a lot of the same questions and bought a reamer, reamed his barrel, and reamed it way too much and had to buy a new barrel (can't find the thread now, but he had pics and it was way over reamed). Not saying you are going to do that, but it takes some finesse and is easy to mess up.

Just something to consider.

[brian45acp]

Yes I am with you and still havent entered my credit card to check out of Brownells, lol.

I may do that but I hate to send off my top end and especially several of them. I would have Cajun Gun works do the job if it came to that. I am still wanting to confirm if I need to ream or not. Many CZ guys say dont do it so I want to know what brass they are using and how they havent had this problem.

DWFAN:

How could you throat but not change head space using a finish reamer?

[DWFAN]

CZs are short throated enough that the reamer should cut the throat before it gets to the end of the chamber.

With a soft touch, you can tell what you're cutting, and if it's changing headspace. Light enough pressure and it won't cut the chamber deeper.

Edited June 25, 2015 by DWFAN

[Toolguy]

The Manson finish reamer has a good throat on it so one tool does it all for most applications. The pilot is on the end and rides on the rifling ahead of the chamber. You cannot get it crooked unless you push hard to one side while turning the reamer.

[Steve RA]

I'd go with the Manson.

[brian45acp]

Some pics to determine for certain this will be resolved with reaming and not something else. Cz guys saying it's my ammo but 4 CZs same result. Factory brass is .748 on duty ammo and chambers the failed round .755 wont

[Steve RA]

One way you can do it is to load your favorite bullet configuration so it fits in your tightest magazine with thirty or forty thousandths to spare ( for feeding purposes). Cut your chamber & throat to match the cartridge using the Plunk and Turn test. That way you should be able to load about anything you want. Then cut all your other chambers to match the test cartridge.

Edited June 26, 2015 by Steve RA

[brian45acp]

Here is pic of nickle brass duty round at .748 there should be 3-5 thousandths clearance head space for brass at spec. Spec is .754 to .756 so chamber must just be short.

I found something else odd. After chambering a bad round from slide lock and letting it slam in after it seems to fit. It's almost like the head space of the barrel straightened the mouth of the brass or something.

Edited June 27, 2015 by brian45acp