Modified SP01 for IDPA ESP and USPSA production

[DoeNuts]

I recently acquired a stock SP01 and wanted to tune for use in both USPSA (Production) and IPDA (ESP) matches. I know there is a lot of folks who are pretty much experts on competition rules, so please help of you can.

I want to make the following modifications to my SP01 via CZ Custom Shop:

Hammer/action tune

Short reset trigger

FO front sight

LPA adjustable rear, to include slide milling (I prefer adjustable sights).

Thoughts ?

I called CZ Custom Shop, and they indicated that the slide milling would make the pistol illegal for IDPA. Is that true? It seems to conflict with the rule I copied and pasted below, but I am sure they know way more than me.

"8.2.2.2.1 Sights may be changed to another notch and post type. Slides may be machined to accept different style sights."

Any help would be appreciated.

Edited June 3, 2015 by DoeNuts

[eerw]

SP01 because of all steel long dustcover cannot be used in ESP...

8.2.2.3 ESP Excluded Features and Modifications (Non-Inclusive list):
8.2.2.3.1 Steel dust covers and rails over 3.25” (82.6 mm) (as measured from the rear of the slide stop pin to the most forward portion of the dust cover or rail) are not permitted.

UNLESS ....

8.1.1.2 .... Any firearm that can be used in SSP can be used in ESP or CDP, depending upon the cartridge used.

so has to meet SSP rules.

So no slide milling, so large safeties and has to have DA/SA capability.

Edited June 3, 2015 by eerw

[DoeNuts]

Awesome. Appreciate the help.

So, if my goal is to have a modified CZ for both USPSA (prod) and IDPA (ESP), I need to either:

A) continue with my SP01 mods and find a rear sight that doesn't require milling (probably won't be windage and elevation adjustable), or

B )Sell off the SP01, pick up a 75 B, and have all of the above mods performed ( to include milling).

Correct?

Edited June 3, 2015 by DoeNuts

[bigmatt]

There is a thread here in the CZ section on page two basically saying many people have broken adjustable sights and often just went back to a fixed rear. If you got a fixed rear/fiber front you might need to do a little tweaking to zero, but once done you are done provided you don't change up the load you shoot.

[2MoreChains]

Option A: Look into the HAJO rear sight that CZC offers. Its adjustable for height, for windage just drift the sight in the dovetail. I think that one is compatible with the stock dovetail (no milling required).

Option B: If you sell the SP-01, look at getting a 2014 SP-01 Shadow Custom #91030. That one comes from CZC with a fixed competition rear sight that uses the Shadow dovetail, which makes it legal for IDPA SSP (which would then make it legal for ESP) and is also kosher for USPSA Prod. I have one of those and it has a trigger that is muy bueno than the stock SP-01.

Option C: Sell the SP-01 and get a CZ-75 Shadow (non FLDC). Then you can do whatever you want to the rear sight since milling the slide for a different type of sight is legal for IDPA ESP as well as USPSA Prod.

Hopefully you're not from CA where the Shadow is not on the state's approved list...

[brisix]

Awesome. Appreciate the help.

So, if my goal is to have a modified CZ for both USPSA (prod) and IDPA (ESP), I need to either:

A) continue with my SP01 mods and find a rear sight that doesn't require milling (probably won't be windage and elevation adjustable), or

B )Sell off the SP01, pick up a 75 B, and have all of the above mods performed ( to include milling).

Correct?

You also have option of the 85 Combat with all the trigger goodies plus it comes with a adjustable sight. If you wanted to mill it for the LPA sights it would still be ESP and USPSA Production legal. If I went the no dust cover/rail option I would go the 85 Combat.

http://czcustom.com/CZ-85-Combat-PolyCoat-9mm.aspx

Edited June 3, 2015 by brisix

[Quack]

Would the CTS LS-P be legal for ESP?

[GeneBray]

Comments that follow are for USPSA Production.

First, if not certain check with NROI BEFORE making the change.

I believe the CGW short reset trigger has a set screw that is visible from the pistol's exterior, and therefore is considered an external modification and is illegal. With regard to the rest, rear sight should be okay so long as the milling is limited strictly to that necessary to install the sight. Don't think there is an issue with the front sight.

Several rules look like they cover what you want to do (bold is mine):

Rule 21 Authorized modifications (Strictly limited to these items and their stated guidelines)

Please note that, during a match, a shooter may be required to demonstrate that their gun is in compliance with Division rules by identifying a specific rules clause or published interpretation which authorizes any disputed modification. If the shooter cannot identify an authorizing rules-clause or publishedinterpretation, the RM shall rule that the modification is PROHIBITED for Production use and shall move the shooter to Open Division.

Rule 21.2b Milling of slide — only as required to insert sights

Remains in effect – a slide may be modified specifically for the purpose of installing sights, and for no other purpose.

Rule 21.6 Exchange of minor EXTERNAL components

Sights, firing pins, firing pin retainers, pins, extractors and ejectors MAY be replaced with OFM or aftermarket parts. Any other components which are externally visible may ONLY be replaced with OFM parts which are offered on the specific model of gun or another approved gun from the same manufacturer except as specifically clarified below. Examples of external components which may only be replaced with OFM parts include (but are not limited to): magazine releases, slide stops, thumb safeties and
triggers

.
The Vanek trigger, much like the Speed Bump trigger, has an external modification that makes it illegal for Production division. The Speed Bump trigger has the travel screw mounted to he rear of the trigger and is visible externally, the Vanek trigger, has relocated the pivot pin about 3/16” above the factory specs, and has filled in the original hole with a black material that is still visible on inspection.

Special Notes/Clarifications:
• Barrels are considered “external parts” and are subject to specific restrictions in 21.4 and associated rulings.
• A factory/OFM magazine release which extends only the length of the magazine release may be used. A magazine release which provides a larger surface area (paddles, buttons) may only be used if it is an OFM part
available on an approved model of gun.
• Externally-visible parts from “custom shop” guns will only be considered “OFM parts” if the custom-shop gun is on the NROI list of approved Production guns.

Rule 22. Specifically prohibited modifications and features

Please note that the absence of an item in the list of prohibited modifications MAY NOT be construed to mean a modification is allowed. A modification is only allowed in Production Division if there is a rules clause or interpretation which specifically declares that it is allowed in the Division. Removing or disabling firing-pin blocks or any other factory safety mechanism in Production division is specifically prohibited.

Special conditions (these are notes following the numbered rule section of the Production Division appendix):

— Unless specifically authorized above, modifications are prohibited. Except for Item 7, revolvers are subject to all restrictions above.

— UNLESS a modification is SPECIFICALLY authorized in the rules or SPECIFICALLY authorized in an official, published NROI interpretation, it is considered a PROHIBITED MODIFICATION.

Hope this is helpful.

[brisix]

The only part of the CGW short reset trigger that is illegal is the reach reduction kit, since it changes the external appearance on the pistol in battery. I have David leave it out of my SP-01 tactical to stay legal. The only external set screw I am aware of is over travel screw on the 85c trigger. Which is legal since that is a OFM part off a legal pistol.

CTS LS-P is legal for ESP since it does not have the full length dust cover. You can put a magwel or covert to SA if you wish and be legal for ESP.

Edited June 4, 2015 by brisix

[gng4life]

There is a thread here in the CZ section on page two basically saying many people have broken adjustable sights and often just went back to a fixed rear. If you got a fixed rear/fiber front you might need to do a little tweaking to zero, but once done you are done provided you don't change up the load you shoot.

Yes, that was the HAJO sight everyone was complaining about. I was about to order one when I saw those posts and decided to stay with fixed for now. There was something from the vendor saying they were aware of the issues with the HAJO sight and they are correcting it. Not sure if, when or how but after the track record I was reading, I would wait to see if it really is fixed. Since I don't shoot IDPA anymore, I might just have the LPA/Kensight milled in.

[valerko]

I really like option B. Might just order that and get rid of Target version.

[himurax13]

I have heard about the HAJO problems but I use Loctite on the screws and I used a taller Dawson front sight so that I wouldn't need to raise the sight very high. I believe problem occur if you need to raise the Hajo sight at or near its max adjustment.

As far as a fixed rear goes, CZC has a HTAC rear sight that fits in the Factory Shadow dovetail and it has a ledge for racking off your belt/holster. It also seems to be a perfect match for the 6.5mm front sight.