asimonp79 Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Hello all Well Over the last 4 years of shooting CZ TS 40 SW I broke more than 8 Slide stops ( lost count after 5-th) Since I write down everything I shoot, I can make sure that slide stops can break whenev it wants, with whatever ammo it wants. Like after 4000 rounds and it can break after 600 rounds, I replace Recoil springs with heavy 18 pounds one a year, and use SPRINCO recoil reducer I shoot only factory LOAD from companies of MAGTECH ( 40B), S&B, Winchester. All of them 180gr bullets. Now it snaps right in two in all cases. So lately I used Aftermarket Slide stop that matches the TS body- unfortunately nothing lasts in this world. here it is - it had 2530 rounds of 40 SW through it, and another 700 9x19. all Magtech or SB factory load. It had a crack and I imiidatly removed it from my pistol- you see where the crack is. Any mechanical professionals here? Who can say what is wrong? Now I have the original SLIDE stop that is broken right in two- adding pics as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pivoproseem Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 You might consider going in the opposite direction with your spring weight, to a 12lb spring. It's not the forces during recoil that is killing your slide stops, it's the slide slamming forward. I've never broken a slide stop in a CZ, but something with yours is not right. I'd certainly mount the barrel in the frame with the slide stop through the barrel "kidney" cutout, just like it would be if installed in the slide. and check for anything unusual. Are you running recoil buffers in the gun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 So you shoot CZ TS 40 SW as well? Can you tell me what ammo do you shoot? Handloaded or factory? And what springs setup do you use? I do not shoot with recoil buffers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Shocking! I have never broken a slide stop on any of my TSs (one in 40, one in 9 and one custom 9 major Open gun). The Open gun has the most rounds through it, I'd estimate ~8-10K of 115gr bullets doing 1,450-1,575fps. Granted the compensator dissipates a lot of energy, but those are some high energy loads and I've never used a spring heavier than factory (I've gone all the way down to 8#). So I'm with pivo, try a lighter recoil spring and see what happens. With factory 40 ammo I would use a 12# or 10#. Edited January 10, 2015 by kneelingatlas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgardner Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 I've put over 3000 rounds of 180 PF through my Tac Sport in 40 and the slide stop is polished but not gouged as yours appears to be. Do the holes through the frame have sharp edges or burrs on them. Check the kidney that it rides in under the barrel for burrs on the edges too. Any sharp edge can make a groove which can start a crack to form. I ran the original spring in it until 500 rounds ago and I replaced it with the flatwire 19 pound spring. Now my brass stays within 6 feet instead of 15 to 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Apparently Iasked the same question here: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=145503 Edited January 10, 2015 by asimonp79 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 Shocking! I have never broken a slide stop on any of my TSs (one in 40, one in 9 and one custom 9 major Open gun). The Open gun has the most rounds through it, I'd estimate ~8-10K of 115gr bullets doing 1,450-1,575fps. Granted the compensator dissipates a lot of energy, but those are some high energy loads and I've never used a spring heavier than factory (I've gone all the way down to 8#). So I'm with pivo, try a lighter recoil spring and see what happens. With factory 40 ammo I would use a 12# or 10#. guys If I use lighter recoil spring - won't it damage my barrel? I mean during the recoil the barrel gets low and back, finishing at the rear end of the kidney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 So I took apart my TS took my current slide stop that I used for 800 rounds of S&B 180gr ( been in my bag as " competition only slidestop") - you can clearly see the marks Took my new "all black slide stop" and pictured them You can see the slide rubbing and hiting one surfice Now I also examined the " kidney"- it is nice and no bures ( I mean after 15K rounds and 100K dry slide-racks all burres would be gone- right?) here some more pics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endall Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 From my experience the lighter recoil spring shoots softer and does slam the barrel back softer. Try a 16 pound spring. If it feeds okay it is good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 You might consider going in the opposite direction with your spring weight, to a 12lb spring. It's not the forces during recoil that is killing your slide stops, it's the slide slamming forward. I've never broken a slide stop in a CZ, but something with yours is not right. I'd certainly mount the barrel in the frame with the slide stop through the barrel "kidney" cutout, just like it would be if installed in the slide. and check for anything unusual. Are you running recoil buffers in the gun? Ok, so I assembled the barrel and the slide stop ( and took pics from each side)- here are the pics of the slidestop, from slide slamming forward, and slide slamming backword What do you say? Is it what you think it is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 So after givin it a thinking I placed 3 slides stop one near otehr- NEW, 800 rounds and cracked. I assembled them one by one and see that the slamming is happening at "1 o clock", and the crack is " 1 o clock " as well adding more pics. So what do you say guys- lighten them springs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jody Waring Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 I have at least 5,000 rounds of major PF ammo through my TS with a few thousand practice loads just below major PF and I have no wear on my slide stop at all. I am still using the original factory spring. I'm going to start experimenting with different weight springs, with and without buffers. I would try a lighter spring between 12-14 lbs and see what happens. Personally, I don't think I have heard from anyone breaking that many ever. My Shadow broke one so far but it has a lot of rounds on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgardner Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Image 1380 and 1381 have peening on the upper rear part of the kidney. It's hitting hard there as it goes back into battery. There is a small burr that is pushed up in that region too. Are you using a good lube (grease) in that area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 I have at least 5,000 rounds of major PF ammo through my TS with a few thousand practice loads just below major PF and I have no wear on my slide stop at all. I am still using the original factory spring. I'm going to start experimenting with different weight springs, with and without buffers. I would try a lighter spring between 12-14 lbs and see what happens. Personally, I don't think I have heard from anyone breaking that many ever. My Shadow broke one so far but it has a lot of rounds on it. May I please see a picture of your slide stop? No ware after 7000 rounds is very good. Just want to see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 Image 1380 and 1381 have peening on the upper rear part of the kidney. It's hitting hard there as it goes back into battery. There is a small burr that is pushed up in that region too. Are you using a good lube (grease) in that area? Just want to verify Are those 2 areas hittign the SS at the recoil/go down process? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgardner Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Image 1380 and 1381 have peening on the upper rear part of the kidney. It's hitting hard there as it goes back into battery. There is a small burr that is pushed up in that region too. Are you using a good lube (grease) in that area?Just want to verify Are those 2 areas hittign the SS at the recoil/go down process? The area of concern is the one you highlighted to the left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huskerlrrp Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 (edited) I'm not a handgun designer/engineer but I am an edumacated and practicing Mechanical Engineer for automotive safety components. I'm kind of echoing what's been said, but for whatever it's worth.... To confirm what "mgardner" is seeing, you might try inspecting the broken surface of the slide stop. It could very well indicate where the crack is propagating from (front or back). Sometimes you need a loop, or a microscope to see the beach marks though. Do a Google search on Beach Marks Failure Analysis and check out the articles and images to see what I'm talking about. From the pictures (I can't really tell), it looks like the crack is at the rear (barrel muzzle as forward orientation). Since you have a couple stops you can easily develop a pattern. Based upon your wear marks of the slide stop and the peening of the barrel cam, it's more likely happening in the forward slide motion. My guess is that there are some tolerances on the barrel working against you. This is indicated by the peening of the rearward surfaces of the "kidney". It may be worth having someone at Cajun Gun Works or CZ Custom looking at. The issue might be as simple as some light material removal and polishing in this area, or a new barrel? Just a guess...I'm a tinkerer...not a bonafide gunsmith. Also, for what it's worth, I run a 13lb spring in my CZ, but I have lightened the slide by @ 33 grams (IIRC). I can also run a 12 lb, but I can track better with the 13 lb (based upon the Bill drill exercise to determine muzzle rising or dropping during rapid fire). Ammo is @173 PF 180gr bullets. Edited January 11, 2015 by huskerlrrp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 (edited) All right. So this what hitts during slide going forward. What can UI do with it- smooth it with file or just oil it? Edited January 11, 2015 by asimonp79 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pivoproseem Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 I would also pay attention when you rack the slide slowly and look for any slight rotating motion in the barrel, that would indicate some asymmetrical forces being applied to the slide stop. If I were to make a guess, there is some tolerance stacking that has caused the back part of the barrel kidney to be under too much stress when in battery??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 Hello So after reading the huskeyrirp I decided to take some pictures of the "belly" that is beeing created I can not ship the gun to CZ custom or any otehr shop in USA- I do not live in USA, but thanks for trying to help And yes, I put some grease on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endall Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 The bending direction of the pin makes it appear to be happening when the slide is traveling back. At least that is how the problem looks to me. The hammering may be the stacking of tolerances mentioned. I have never broken a slide stop. In any gun. Should not happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 The bending direction of the pin makes it appear to be happening when the slide is traveling back. At least that is how the problem looks to me. The hammering may be the stacking of tolerances mentioned. I have never broken a slide stop. In any gun. Should not happen. Well I searched down the net. Looks like well known issue http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=193036 http://www.hipointfirearmsforums.com/forum/f277/excam-tararmi-ta90-cz-75-clone-9mm-310417/ http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=48112.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunsen Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 First thing is you need to switch to a lighter weight recoil spring. I also follow it up with 5K rounds on a match slide stop. After the 5K rounds I switch to a new one for match and the old match one goes for practice. Happens about twice a year. Always have a couple of extra spares. some I have seen cracks on but never a full breakage and always reliable with this system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asimonp79 Posted January 11, 2015 Author Share Posted January 11, 2015 Thanks Will try that. I was very scared that with light recoil spring my slide/barrel may crack ( during recoil the sharp hit rearward) But if so many people say that they run factory ammo with 13 lb recoil spring- than I do something wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgardner Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 I'm looking at the peening and thinking that the timing of the lockup is in question. Maybe as the metal moves itself in the kidney the problem will disappear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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