Co-witnessing a dot with irons

[EricW]

Anybody else find co-witnessing highly distracting? Yes, I can resort to a target focus and blur out the front sight, but the overwhelming urge is to retract my focus to the front sight and/or align the dot with the post. I've got a whactical 4-rail gas block on order, but I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing some obvious advantage.

What's the consensus rifle gurus?

[diehli]

I think it's good to be able to see the front sight (if you have both a front sight and a rear sight) when you're using the dot, but they don't necessarily need to be co-witnessed.

Good:

Not so good:

**edited to add the parenthetical part**

[Vlad]

I like to see my irons through the dot, but I'm new at this dot thing so take that for what is worth. However I like the irons to line up somewhere in the lower half, under the dot when centered.

Vlad

[Chris Rhines]

Not so much. I use offset iron sights mounted to my float tube, though, and I like that setup much better.

- Chris

[chp5]

The front sight is OK, but I don't want to see the rear sight. Just use flip up rears.

[rhino]

I'm no guru ... but I want my iron sights to have the same zero as my dot or scope. That they are "co-witnessed" is an artifact of that, but it hasn't bothered me yet.

Of course, sometimes when I use the dot, I am a heretic and lift my head and look over the irons. On my gun with a fold-down rear, I sometimes fold it down when I know for sure I'm going to be using the dot and I won't need it (like during a match).

[ErikW]

Not a problem for me. That overwhelming urge might tilt toward target focus when the SHTF or when you are competing.

[John Dunn]

I couldn't stand having my Aimpoint cowitnessed, with the big butt front sight post blocking out a huge field of view. I solved the problem by grinding off the front sight post and mounting the JP iron sight on the handguard.

For a "social" rifle I'd get Dave Lauck's mount where the irons are visible in the lower third of the Aimpoint, but the dot is fairly unimpeded.

Seems to be less of a problem with magnifying optics as the front sight is more of an obscure blur than a totally opaque obstruction, but I cut the front sight off my ARs with ACOGs mounted because the blur was irritating.

I now consider my back up to a failed optic (on a rifle without iron sights mounted) the thirty round mag.

[rhino]

For a "social" rifle I'd get Dave Lauck's mount where the irons are visible in the lower third of the Aimpoint, but the dot is fairly unimpeded.

That's the current preferred way of "cowitnessing" now. Most of the popular mounts like the Larue put the top of the front sight tower in the lower third of the glass. When adjusted properly, the dot will still sit on top of the front sight post when you look through the irons.

[kellyn]

I don't care for co-witnessed sights on a MATCH rifle. Too much to look at. And remember dots and irons work differently. With a dot you should be looking at a target with irons you should have front sight focus. By co-witnessing, you will naturally focus on the front sight or at least try to focus on the front sight and lose one of the advantages of having a dot in the first place.

[EricW]

I find the co-witnessing distracting enough that even for a working gun I wouldn't do it. I'd either go flip-down or better yet, simply have a pre-zeroed backup scope on a QD mount in my pocket. I was constantly pulling my head off the stock to get the dot out of the way of the front post.

As long as I'm not missing some secret of the Ninja, the A2 front's a goner. Of course as soon as I do it, I'm sure I'll get yelled at the first time I show up for a class...

[ranger]

I shot dots for years on Open Pistols and my personal flat-top AR15 with the front sight milled off. I always thought that the co-witnessed dot and front iron sight on an AR15 would be distracting.

However, I have been carrying an assigned M16A2 (traditional carrying handle and front sight issue M16) with a military issue Aimpoint (M68) mounted off the carrying handle in a manner that allows use of the iron sights and the Aimpoint simultaneously.

it worked a lot better than I thought. I qualified on the 300 yard "pop-up" range - once with both iron sights and once with the dot - and had no problem with the co-witnessing setup. I did not find the iron sights to be distracting or to block a lot of my vision.

That said, I look forward to drawing an M4 and using a back up rear sight but the front sight wil still be there.