Mlussoro Posted September 6, 2014 Share Posted September 6, 2014 I've heard rumors that the gold team open gun can't handle major loads ? And large frame gun has feeding issues and if you can find a small frame gold get that one.??? I'm at a loss here I found a few gold teams for sale just don't wanna pull the trigger so to speak on a 2000 dollar mistake Any help suggestions!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted September 6, 2014 Share Posted September 6, 2014 The trouble with the V12 is that the comp only has two small ports, so they compensate (pun intended) with 12 holes in the barrel; the 12 holes in the barrel bleed off a lot of gas behind the bullet, slowing it down and requiring 6-10% more powder for the same velocity. This is the real reason the 9mm Gold Teams have barrel issues, because they are fed a steady diet of ammo which would make 180-190PF in a gun with no holes! 38 super is a lower pressure round, so it's not as hard on the gun, but that kind of juice in 9mm would tear up any gun. The feed issues were caused by the "old style" mags with the spacer in the front, the new style work fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mlussoro Posted September 6, 2014 Author Share Posted September 6, 2014 Do I have to run major in open ? To compete? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted September 6, 2014 Share Posted September 6, 2014 Unlike Limited, SS or Revolver you don't get more rounds and since Open guns tend to shoot flatter at Major PF I don't think you'd pick up any time on the splits, but if you're a "mostly As kind of guy" it won't hurt too much. Is your Limited 9 or 40? If it's 9 I suggest you just slap a dot on it give Open minor a try. The gun will certainly handle better without a comp and with 115s and fast powder like Clays the dot jumps out of the glass, then right back to the same place pretty fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saratoga Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 You can always build yourself a open minor, here is one with a 1911 small comp. This was made from a small fram stock, were the bull barrel was machined down to accept a 2011 cone comp and the cone on the comp was machined to match the slide. Works actually very well with factor Magtech ammo but better with slow powder ammo. IN the same way you can build a open major with a 2011 comp as well. Just find a good machinist. You should not be afraid of small frame open majors, with the right loads they live very long. Holes or no holes. An open gun that is shot much will need quite much attention anyway no matter what the concept. (Just changed a cracked titanium comp on a friends 2011) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeerBaron Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 Yeah I would not be worried about running a 9mm major gold team. some of the early V12 guns had problems that I understand were mainly down to the way the barrel kidney was cut. this kidney affects the timing of the gun and the way the barrel and slide unlock at the lugs. with it not being cut consistently some people ended up with barrel lugs getting damaged. that's not just a 9mm problem either. is there a reason you don't want to run 38 super though? as atlas said with all the barrel ports you have to accelerate that bullet up to major PF speeds in a very short amount of unported barrel (like 2 inches from end of chamber to the first barrel ports). so to do that you need to run a load that in a regular trubor for instance would run about 185pf! it's not a direct comparison though as lots of gas is getting bled off, but it is still a fairly hot load. having said that my gold custom V12 with 10.4gn of 3N38 is fine to shoot. spectators find it pretty loud, but it's not a very 'concussive' load so I don't mind it at all. as saratoga says open guns take a beating. regardless of it's configuration you need to take care of them. there's no problem shooting 500 rounds or more out of my CZ shadow production gun between cleaning. my open gun gets cleaned ever 200 rounds. basically after every time I shoot it. You also need to ensure with the tanfog open guns that you get plenty of oil or grease onto the barrel lugs and the cone. I use slide glide as it stays put. with the heavily cut up slide it's easy to dirt to get in and for lube to fly out. you need something that sticks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mlussoro Posted September 11, 2014 Author Share Posted September 11, 2014 Limited is a 9mm right now atlas.. And as far as not wanting to shoot 38 super because components are hard to find and honestly I don't have time to reload I just buy factory ammo and shoot lol hence why I shoot 9mm . What about big stick mags ? Are they even available ? Think it's kind of a waste if not.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted September 11, 2014 Share Posted September 11, 2014 (edited) What about big stick mags ? Are they even available ? Think it's kind of a waste if not..Talk to george76904 he and his dad are making them last I heard.Oh and if you're not reloading don't bother with a comp, it won't do anything with factory ammo. That's not an exaggeration either, you really can't tell the difference. Edited September 11, 2014 by kneelingatlas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saratoga Posted September 11, 2014 Share Posted September 11, 2014 Big sticks are are available from both Tanfo and CZ, so in your part of the world that would transfer to EEA and Angus Hobdell i believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted September 11, 2014 Share Posted September 11, 2014 The one I got from george76904 is working great. It ran flawless with only an 11 coil spring in it, and now with the 13 coil its still running perfect. I've only ran about 500 rounds through it though so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mlussoro Posted September 11, 2014 Author Share Posted September 11, 2014 Nealio got big sticks? Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted September 11, 2014 Share Posted September 11, 2014 Yeah I'm "experimenting" with open... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mlussoro Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 Did you throw a base pad on it? What was your cap? I'm gonna order a few of these from eaa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 I wouldn't waste my money on those EAA ones. Mine holds 29. I use an extended basepad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeerBaron Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 What about big stick mags ? Are they even available ? Think it's kind of a waste if not..Talk to george76904 he and his dad are making them last I heard.Oh and if you're not reloading don't bother with a comp, it won't do anything with factory ammo. That's not an exaggeration either, you really can't tell the difference. agreed. factory ammo in an open gun is a waste of time. for starters it will be almost impossible to find factory 9mm that would make major in a gold team but they are just the wrong powder for an open gun. you 'may' be able to find a commercial reloader who will load a major pf recipe for you but I've heard many won't do 9mm major for some reason. plenty seem to do 38 super major loads. even still you really want to do some experimenting of your own and pick the load that suits your gun and you. probably half the battle of a good running open gun is the load. you can't just copy someone elses and expect it to give you top performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trgt Posted September 12, 2014 Share Posted September 12, 2014 (edited) ... agreed. factory ammo in an open gun is a waste of time. for starters it will be almost impossible to find factory 9mm that would make major in a gold team but they are just the wrong powder for an open gun. you 'may' be able to find a commercial reloader who will load a major pf recipe for you but I've heard many won't do 9mm major for some reason. plenty seem to do 38 super major loads. even still you really want to do some experimenting of your own and pick the load that suits your gun and you. probably half the battle of a good running open gun is the load. you can't just copy someone elses and expect it to give you top performance. One of the vendors here, BlamTec, has loaded 9 Major for me, but had to get new 9mm brass to him for that, his concern seemed to be there was too much risk for a commercial reloader to do 9 Major with used cases. Edited September 12, 2014 by trgt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mlussoro Posted September 13, 2014 Author Share Posted September 13, 2014 So while we are on topic.... The gold teams I am looking at come with 2 barrels 1 with popples in barrel the other with out? I'm assuming I should be able to load major in the non ported barrel correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 So while we are on topic.... The gold teams I am looking at come with 2 barrels 1 with popples in barrel the other with out? I'm assuming I should be able to load major in the non ported barrel correct? The comp only has one small port, so shooting major through it would be pretty harsh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mlussoro Posted September 13, 2014 Author Share Posted September 13, 2014 I'm asking questions because I'm trying to understand so bare with me here, so obviously people use this pistol and must mod it to compete correct? Almost not with it but here's the shitty part, I'm familiar with tang I know the inner workings and honestly if I do go to the dark side my other option is the 2011 platform which is fine other than having 2 different guns that feel totally different I'm screwed lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 (edited) You can definitely compete in major with the 38 GT right out of the box and the issue with the 9mm is not being competitive, but durability shooting Major. If you keep it right around 165-170 you should be fine with most of the popular powders, but if you want a safety margin for major matches, you'll be limited to just a handful of powders and need careful load development. I think it is possible to shoot tens of thousands of 175-180 pf 9mm through a v12, but like I said, you'd most likely be using a case full of hard to get/expensive VV powder and it would be pretty violent. ETA: this is all just my conservative speculation and you might be fine for 100k rounds using 8+ gr of Autocomp. Edited September 13, 2014 by kneelingatlas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted September 13, 2014 Share Posted September 13, 2014 You could also probably just send a 9mm Limited to Rich at Canyon Creek and have him build you a custom Open gun for about the same price... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickB Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 I saw many a 9mm Major open gun blow up back in the mid 1990's with 175 PF loads. Not a route I would choose... Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingman Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 Buy a standard barrel and build your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 I saw many a 9mm Major open gun blow up back in the mid 1990's with 175 PF loads. Not a route I would choose... Mick 10 fewer PF, more powder options, 9 major is a different animal today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeerBaron Posted September 14, 2014 Share Posted September 14, 2014 So while we are on topic.... The gold teams I am looking at come with 2 barrels 1 with popples in barrel the other with out? I'm assuming I should be able to load major in the non ported barrel correct? The non ported barrel is for minor/steel loads. The fully ported/comped one is your major barrel. You can shoot major out of the non ported barrel but it'd be a waste. Out of the box with the major barrel and a good load they are a competitive gun. Very flat. A little violent but personally it's a non issue for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now