Box to box movement

[John Dunn]

I noticed on a tips segment of a recent shooting show (either Shooting USA or Sighting In with Shooting USA) that Doug Koenig was entering a box (moving to the right) with his right foot first. Matt Burkett teaches in his videos to move into a box from the right left foot first.

Obviously, both are very capable shooters, with a different approach.

I've been using the method Matt teaches, because it feels smooth. To be honest, I can't remember how I used to get into the boxes, because I never paid any attention to it prior to watching the video.

So, how are you guys doing it? Left foot, right foot, or who cares as long as you move into the box gun up and ready to shoot?

[ktyler]

John

I recently watched Matt's videos and realized I do it the same way he demos. I experimented with both to figure out why I did it that way.

What I learned if moving right and put my right foot in first:

-had a tendency to over shoot the box, couldn't absorb the speed well enough

-the foot would slide causing me to lose balance (Mostly gravel bays around here)

-my set up was slower because the sights were moving around more

What I learned if moving right and put my left foot in first:

-I had a lot more control/balance

-my entry foot never slid out from underneath me

-My set ups were better/smoother

-I could run harder at the box because I was able to bleed/absorb the speed better

Either way might work better for some, but this is what I found after trying both

Ktyler

[Jake Di Vita]

With me at least, I don't care how I get into boxes. The 2 main things I'm looking out for is no shuffle steps and shooting as soon as my trailing foot is in the air on the way to the box.

I don't really think it needs to be more complicated than that.

[Guest Larry Cazes]

I also have only recently started paying attention to how I enter boxes or even open positions. Do you guys set the gun up on target before entering the box and then glance down at the box to gauge when you are in it? I feel like I am almost never ready to index and shoot when I hit the box but I notice that the guys who consistently win are there every time. I suspect that I burn up a huge amount of time going into and getting out of positions.

[Jake Di Vita]

In my case, I look to where my lead foot is going to go. As soon as I am about 3 steps away I start throttling down and bring the gun to high ready. As my first foot is going into the box my eyes go to the target and I bring the gun out and get a sight picture (or the closest thing that I can). As soon as the trailing foot is in the air, I shoot.

[spook]

I'm with Jake on this one. Doesn't matter how, as long as it's smooth. Doug does is one way, Matt does it another way. I say, learn both ways and use when neccessary

[j1b]

How I enter a box really is dependent on what needs to happen in that box. It depends (for me) if the targets are 15 yards, or 5 yards. It matters if there is wide movement, or clustered target groups. It matters to me how long I will be in the box and if I need to get out quickly.

During walk-thru I generally have an idea of how I want to enter the box and then I try and execute while shooting. But for me it isn't a cookie cutter approach and it does indeed vary.

In some regards I guess I'm siding with the group of "I don't care how, as long as it's smooth and I see what I need to" but that's a little off for me because I do plan it during walk-thru - it just changes depending on situation.

JB

[Guest Larry Cazes]

At our local match last week, since it was raining we setup simple max 18 round stages, and one of them would make an excellent drill for movement into and out of boxes. The first array was 3 paper at about 10yds with a starting box, all of this array had top be shot from the box. Then setup laterally, 3 more paper at 15yds with cover so that you had to move 3-4 feet to the side to see them. Then continuing laterally in the same direction, 3 more 10yd targets that had to be shot from within a final box. I prefer more freestyle field stages but this brought to my attention my lack of conscious ability to effectively move into boxes and be ready as soon as I enter the box. I suspect that I will be more comfortable stepping into the box with my leading foot, if moving right stepping in with the right foot.

[Flexmoney]

Movement into (and out of) shooting positions is where a lot of matches are won and lost.

It's a vital skill. If you haven't worked on this much...

[MattBurkett]

There are actually many specific reasons I enter boxes to the right with my left foot.

1. No chance of over running the position.

2. Easier to set the body angle for better target acquisition/transition.

3. Smoother and seems to cause less damage to the knees.

4. If you lose footing with your left foot going in, you still have a foot to work with and save the entry.

5. If you point the left foot at the first target or most left target coming in, you will automatically position the stance for optimal structure.

6. Rolling the heel in allows you to start shooting on most targets when the other foot is just off the ground outside of the position.

Remember that whatever level you come in at (heightwise) you stay at and leave at. Don't go into a position and stand up! That is an easy .25 lost.

Remember to have the gun up and ready at least a step or two out of the position. That is the number one mistake people make.

Either left foot or right foot can be fast even almost identical in the amount of time they take, but, I have found that consistency is the key to the movement on multiple surface types.

Take care,

Matt

PS Thanks for getting the videos!

[Bear1142]

John,

I enter using the outside foot, irrespective of which side I'm moving too. While I appreciate Matt's talent and skills, I have to disagree with his style. Getting your hips squared to the target in the fastest possible manner will increase the stability of your shooting platform which will help your be more accurate and manage the recoil of the gun better. Getting your outside foot in the box first will allow you to do this. Also, you never want to make a direction change off of your inside foot. Using your inside foot (entering with your left foot, moving right) will increase your chances of slipping or losing traction. Watch any football game. If you see a player lose traction on a direction change and fall down. 9/10 times he made the cut on his inside foot and lost traction. I'm not saying Matt is wrong, it's just a different style. Try them both out and see what works for you.

Erik

[Ron Ankeny]

I think some of the more "explosive" shooters really need to take care not to over run the box, twist an ankle, or end up off balance. Some of the really quick guys throttle back before the box then step in gently, Ron Avery comes to mind. Others are still moving pretty hard as they step in and they use Matt's technique (or Barnhart's) for the reasons he listed. I just try to remember to get the gun up and shoot when I get there. It's an individual body type and style thing.

[old shooter]

For a long time, I didn't pay much attention and used either foot. I found myself sometimes inconsistent and decided to commit to one way. I watched Matts DVD and liked his way, so I stuck with that. I am faster now, but the 2 things that made it faster for me were putting my left foot down with my toes facing the target I was getting ready to shoot, and not standing up in the box.

Mike

[John Dunn]

It may not be fast, but I think a good skid and a cloud of dust should receive style points!

[eric nielsen]

I once spent months working on Ron Avery's way - same as Doug's way. But a lot of buddies told me that I spend extra time tap-dancing around just outside the box.

Then I spent months working on Matt's way. It's less stressful most of the time and I like it better for winding up in a solid stance.

My 2cents worth is: work on both ways, then you won't have a tendency to spend an extra step outside the box, ever. Like Jake says.

You can set up lateral drills where the steps work out real nice one way. Then adjust your starting point by one step, keep the same ending point. Now you'll need to switch to the other technique.

Do that for moving left & also moving right & pretty soon you'll also get a real good idea where you want your "ready" position to be, how you want your hands to come together on the gun, and so on.

Work within your own body mechanics, don't just clone one GM shooter. Try out several ways. Then a few months later try them all again - question your conclusions.

[Flexmoney]

I don't know that one foot is faster than another...but I plan to try it all out (again).

Most important to me has been to sluff off the speed a step out, then to easy into position...ready to shoot.

[Guest Larry Cazes]

All great suggestions guys. In the last 2 matches I've shot since this thread started I have shaved quite a bit of time relative to other much better shooters than me that I shoot against regularly by concentrating on these things.