RussB Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 (edited) I'm talking about trigger pull weight. With the innards smoothed up and a 12# rebound spring I have it set at 8#. My particular strain screw is trimmed to .335" from the shoulder to the tip. I'm using the factory mainspring. I have no ignition issues with 2 different Federal 22's or CCI Mini-Mags. I made another strain screw today (.320" long) which gives me a 7# pull, but I have to try it out... How low can you go with the factory parts? How about with the Miculek mainspring? How about with that cool looking Apex hammer? Edited February 28, 2014 by RussB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 (edited) 7lbs with federal bulk ammo is as low as I can go.... I can drop it down to 6 - 6.5 lbs, but ignition gets real spotty. 7lbs has been 100% for me. apex hammer, Bang inc main spring, 11lb wolff rebound spring, stock firing pin. I didnt notice THHHHHAT much difference going with the apex hammer, it helped a little - but nothing crazy. - Maybe 1/4 lb DA pull reduction over factor hammer Edited February 28, 2014 by alecmc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Gonsalves Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 6 1/2 runs 100% with Blazer and Winchester Dynapoints. Apex Hammer, Bent stock mainspring, cut down stock rebound spring, stock firing, polished internals. Never tried it with the stock hammer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussB Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 Looks like the Apex hammer is an important ingredient to get a sub 7 pound pull... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Looks like the Apex hammer is an important ingredient to get a sub 7 pound pull... Well... You can always experiment with the factory hammer first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Gonsalves Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 That was my plan, but received the Apex hammer as gift before I had a chance to re-work the stock one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowrider Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 That was my plan, but received the Apex hammer as gift before I had a chance to re-work the stock one. What were you going to do to the stock one? I've only honed and polished mine, didn't change any springs due to reliability worries. It's pretty smooth but hellaciously heavy and desperately needs re-springing. I just don't want to mess up the hammer and have to re-fit one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussB Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 What were you going to do to the stock one? I've only honed and polished mine, didn't change any springs due to reliability worries. It's pretty smooth but hellaciously heavy and desperately needs re-springing. I just don't want to mess up the hammer and have to re-fit one. After I made this thread, I did a search and came up with a lot of info regarding the 617. First off was that you cannot alter/lighten the hammer and expect reliability. Seems a rimfire round needs all the mass a hammer can deliver. The Apex hammer works because more weight is at the top in the area that contacts the firing pin...the thing actually LOOKS like a hammer! That makes me wonder how a .500" target hammer would work? It has a larger thumbpiece, which would add mass up towards the top of the hammer... The other info I gathered that a reliable 617 pull at 8# is the norm with factory parts and a reduced power rebound spring and trimmed strain screw. 7# is getting near the lowest possible but you often need aftermarket parts from mainsprings, extended FP's and the Apex hammer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussB Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 I was also thinking about a more consistent way to measure actual hammer power, that is getting a reading on JUST the hammer. That would eliminate the extra power needed to compress the rebound spring, rotate the cylinder and all the other things that occur. with the trigger held back, I measure 4# of hammer spring, which means I have almost 4# of "other" stuff going on at the same time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxshooter Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 I have yet to see a 617 that is 100% reliable with a trigger pull under 7 lbs. Maybe with high dollar Eley or other target ammo they might. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Same here. And I've handled a bunch of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzShooter Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 My trigger pull is 100 % reliable at 8 lbs. I have a cheap 22 with no cylinder and set at about 15 lbs that I practice with. Dry fire that 1000 times and an 8 lb trigger feels light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowrider Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 I don't know what mine pulls, but it's a damn site more than 7 or 8lbs. I have it apart right now and have added a Wilson 13lb rebound spring that I clipped two coils from. So do I: 1) Bend the factory main and use stock strain screw? 2) Use the factory main as is and shorten the strain screw? (don't want it to knuckle) 3) Add a Wilson main and set the screw length as needed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 (edited) Jerry *bang inc* main spring 11 lb wolff rebound spring stock firing pin apex 617 hammer federal bulk ammo 6.5lbs - 7lbs DA or so Edited April 1, 2014 by alecmc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowrider Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 Jerry *bang inc* main spring 11 lb wolff rebound spring stock firing pin apex 617 hammer federal bulk ammo 6.5lbs - 7lbs DA or so What about the strain screw? Shortened or no? I'm gonna have to suffer the stock hammer for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 Jerry *bang inc* main spring 11 lb wolff rebound spring stock firing pin apex 617 hammer federal bulk ammo 6.5lbs - 7lbs DA or so What about the strain screw? Shortened or no? I'm gonna have to suffer the stock hammer for the time being. I cant recall if I shortened mine or not. I know its Tightened all the way though. Start by experimenting by loosening it up to the desired weight. See if it works then cut it down to size...or just use purple or blue loc tite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWP Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 (edited) Jerry *bang inc* main spring 11 lb wolff rebound spring stock firing pin apex 617 hammer federal bulk ammo Same here, but factory hammer. 7.5lbs and it gets one light strike out of every 50, but I still think it's inconsistent brass, as I save them for later and hit them again and they still won't go off.I did not shorten my strain screw, but it's all the way in tight, loctighted, and I have grips on it that I can keep an eye on it. Edited April 1, 2014 by MWP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 7ish lbs seems to be as low as it goes. Can be more depending on your ammo choice, and some ammo will require more hammer fall so it's nice to have a strain screw (like a loctited with purple 222 8-32 socket set screw) that allows you a range of adjustment. I use a Wolff reduced power mainspring (which can require a slightly longer than stock strain screw) and a rebound spring (clipped) as light as possible while still giving an acceptable trigger return. DON'T "bob" or lighten the hammer. One FTF per 50 rds is ok for practice but not acceptable (to me anyway) for steel challenge. 1 in 200 is pretty good and I'm not sure you can expect any better from a rimfire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 I measured mine earlier today, just a hair over 6.5 lbs double action. I did all 8 stages of steel challenge this past weekend with it--. 200 + rounds, and only had one light strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 I measured mine earlier today...With what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 I measured mine earlier today...With what? a trigger pull gauge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 I measured mine earlier today...With what? a trigger pull gauge. Perfect answer. The more you post, the better your trigger pull gets.... A few more and it will be down to 5 lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 (edited) I measured mine earlier today...With what? a trigger pull gauge. Perfect answer. The more you post, the better your trigger pull gets.... A few more and it will be down to 5 lbs. That'd be a pretty sweet deal. I had thought it was set at 7lbs when I first did everything, went and checked today and it was at 6.5... Maybe it wore in, Do you think I'm lying or something ? Edited April 1, 2014 by alecmc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 That'd be a pretty sweet deal. I had thought it was set at 7lbs when I first did everything, went and checked today and it was at 6.5... Maybe it wore in, Do you think I'm lying or something? Simply wondering what kind (brand/type) of trigger pull gauge you're using. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted April 1, 2014 Share Posted April 1, 2014 Nothing fancy, I've got this one here: http://www.midwayusa.com/product/192807/wheeler-engineering-trigger-pull-gage?cm_vc=ProductFinding I did the trigger work and hammer install maybe this time last year, Had it set at 7 lbs and havent given it a 2nd look since, checked it today and it came back in at 6.5 lbs.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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