doc38 Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 I am having cylinder binding issues on my new 625 JM. I have narrowed it down to moonclips, case dimensions. Everything else is right. What kind of brass and clips do you fellow use? What dimensions is standard for moonclips? what happens is very similar to a high primer, but it usually involves the case head. Some primer pockets aren't deep enough and I just trash them. THe case heads that bind do it asymmetrically, I.E. not all the way around. It looks like a high spot on the case head. I am using the same range pick ups I use for my 1911. If I buy 500 rounds of new brass, what brand do most folks use? By the way, NO issues with new factory ammo. Also, zero issues with for sure once fired, small primer pocket brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Hmmm... and you eliminated endshake correct? what's the gap between forcing cone and cylinder face? How about chamber reaming? Is it a 625-8 ? They are pretty notorious for having out of spec cylinder chambers and need to be reamed out. I've never had issue in any of my revolvers with mixed headstamps and regular old ranch moonclips or tk custom clips Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 If it's a 625-8, have the chambers reamed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) It could be bent clips. But, if you're using used brass fired extensively in a 1911 you can check the brass for burrs on the rim, swelled case heads or warped rims. These things can cause binding. If you find a case with a warped or burred rim try taking a file to it and smooth it out. If it then loads and works good, you've isolated the issue. I've had a similar issue when I used Top Brass brand cases, their specs on the rim/extractor groove were too tight and would bind up. But the issue showed up in trying to load the cases into the moon clip. I just couldn't get more than 4 into a clip. Most brass though will work fine with Ranch, Wilson or Hearthco Moon Clips. Try laying a moon clip on a flat surface and make sure it is laying flat. If it isn't it can bind. Then check some brass for obvious burrs, then load a moon clip. If it binds try removing cases 1 at a time to see if you can isolate the issue. I'm curious though, I've never seen any cases with too shallow of a primer pocket. When a primer won't seat it's either operator error or a really dirty primer pocket (and even then you can get them to seat, they will just look flattened) or a crimped primer pocket that has resulted in a crushed primer. I will use range brass for practice, but for my revolver I usually buy a thousand new cases and just re use them for the revolver. Since you always get them back they last forever. When they start splitting at the case mouth I roll the whole batch over to my 1911 match ammo and shoot and leave them on the range. As for rough chambers had a buddy who had a brand new 4" 625JM that wouldn't seat anything well due to rough chambers. But if you aren't having issues with factory ammo, doubt if that's the culprit. Edited January 2, 2014 by pskys2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 My 625 is a -8 model and I'd had a couple of issues but in my case it's been a high primer every time. I'm checking those more diligently now so hopefully the problem will be resolved. For those of you that have recommended cylinder reaming - can you give some more details such as ream to what diameter? How can I tell if my cylinder needs to be reamed? I'm trying to avoid the following conversation: Me - Mr. Gunsmith I need my cylinder reamed on my 625. Mr. Gunsmith - Sure thing but why? Me - Because alecmc and Carmoney said so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alecmc Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) Zach, If your loaded moon clip does not " THUNK " straight down with no resistance at all, you probably need to be reamed out. Out of spec chambers you'll notice that the moonclip will seem to hang up and not seat all the way, or need to actually be pushed in to go all the way down. Try this by very lightly inserting your moon clip and see if it gets hung up and wants to stop before seating all the way. like this : Edited January 2, 2014 by alecmc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Virtually all 625-8 cylinders have undersized chambers. Clymer makes a finish reamer that is made specifically for .45 ACP revolver cylinders. This tool will ream the chambers to proper SAAMI industry spec. Most regular gunsmiths will not know anything about this, nor will they have the proper reamer. Send the cylinder (no need to send the whole gun) to somebody who specializes in revolvers......or buy the reamer and do it yourself. It's hand-turned, no machines required. All you need is a little cutting oil, a T-handle, and a padded vise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Zach, If your loaded moon clip does not " THUNK " straight down with no resistance at all, you probably need to be reamed out. Out of spec chambers you'll notice that the moonclip will seem to hang up and not seat all the way, or need to actually be pushed in to go all the way down. Try this by very lightly inserting your moon clip and see if it gets hung up and wants to stop before seating all the way. like this : Alec, I've seen this a time or two. Guess I need to get my cylinder reamed then. Thanks for the photo they really are worth 1000 words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckaroo45 Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Had the same issue on my -8. On advice here I rented a reamer from a place in Idaho and did it myself. It's as said above, cutting oil, T handle, a padded vise and patience. It was easy to tell which were tight. Don't try to do it in one pass. 1-2 turns, remove, clean tool and cylinder, relube and a couple more turns till you feel it bottom out. TA-DA! You'll be pleased how well it works afterward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I'm packing the cylinder up tonight and shipping it off tomorrow to get them reamed, polished, and chamfered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ty Hamby Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I'm packing the cylinder up tonight and shipping it off tomorrow to get them reamed, polished, and chamfered. Smart! just get it reamed and be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueOvalBandit Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Mr. Gunsmith - Sure thing but why? Tell him to hit one chamber with a reamer and he'll see why, I was scared I had the wrong reamer I took so much metal out. Not to mention you could feel how out of round the chamber was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doc38 Posted January 6, 2014 Author Share Posted January 6, 2014 I have reloaded since I was 14 years old ( 31 years ago) . Never had issues like this before. As near as I can tell, I will be fine if I just pay more attention to primer seating. GO figure, I got by with poor pistol priming all these years. As far as reaming cylinders goes I am not against it, I just don't think it is necessary in my case. CHAMFERING, on the other hand...I may well just look into the whole thing for that alone. I will say this, the surface finish inside the cylinders, throats and the forcing cone isn't what I am used to seeing in Smith and Wesson products in the past. I only shoot lead bullets so I need as smooth an internal finish as possible. I have hand lapped barrels on Smith revolvers ( and others) and found them tight just past the forcing cone. They should get smaller closer to the muzzle if they change dimensions at all. Lapping them "straight" or a few ten thousandths bigger right ( choke boring) past the forcing cone usually stops chronic leading. If I could get the chambers reamed round and polished slick, throats polished, and the forcing cone cut to the longer angle and cleaned up and polished, all for about $20 or so..... I guess I will be doing some work on the darn thing myself. To tell the truth, tinkering on the revolvers is about as much fun as shooting them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Doc, you asked a question, several people gave you the answer, and now you want to second guess our response? (sigh) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Doc, you asked a question, several people gave you the answer, and now you want to second guess our response? (sigh)+1 The chambers need reamed. Period. The icing on the cake is having them chamfered at the same time. Or you can screw around with mickey mouse "fixes". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doc38 Posted January 11, 2014 Author Share Posted January 11, 2014 I apologize. My command of the English language isn't all that good. Reading back over my post I guess I didn't make it clear I goofed and got some primers high. Also, I have found the brass I have been using is pretty dinged up on the case head. My 1911 has no real ejector issues, but some of the brass I have has come from friends with other types of pistols and lower quality 1911s and there are some pretty serious dings on the case heads. not a problem with a 1911 because it headspaces on the case mouth and I seldom see max length brass. Plenty of slop in most auto chambers. The chambers on my revolver aren't tight. The loaded rounds drop right in, no problem. About half the case heads are beaten up so badly they won't clear between the moon clip and the frame. I got new brass and paid attention to make sure the primers were all fully seated, no more problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeAZ Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 (edited) Deleted Edited January 11, 2014 by mike NM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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