Need help for a Night Match!

[steviesterno]

Hey guys,

I'm shooting my first night match in October (the Zombie/Halloween match in DFW) and I'm looking to tear it up. I've shot a bunch of daytime matches, but with this prize table (Chance to win night vision!!!) I really want to step it up and be competitive.

The match is NO AMBIENT LIGHT. Will be total darkness out in the sticks, so it should be pretty darn dark. There are also no divisions, and lights/lasers/dots are allowed on all the guns. I don't currently have an open gun, for what it's worth.

I have a pretty solid 3 gun set up, but I wasn't sure the best/cost effective way to get ready for a night match. So here's what I'm thinking:

General lights: Headlamp so I can see random manipulations and where I'm going, plus maybe a flashlight for walking around, glow sticks on me and in the bags for general stuff.

Pistol: I have 2 options. My 6" 40 2011 has a light rail and I can slap a TRL 3 on it, but it has no laser. My buddy has an M&P pro set up for 3 gun, and I have a set of crimson trace grips for that brand, so we can have it decked out. Not a caliber issue, but is it worth giving up the good trigger for a visible laser?

Rifle: I have a franken rifle, but the tube is currently a nordic aluminum tube with no rails. It has screw holes for rails, but I'm not sure I can find them. Have a trijicon TR24 so it will be glowing on it's own. I will mount a Surefire 6p in scope rings to it somehow, but not sure the best way to get rails. Also, is it worth it to get a laser? All shots are within 50 yards, but I don't currently have a laser to put on it.

Shotgun. I have another 6p in a tube mount I will steal from my HD shotgun. Any reason to do anything else to it or put a laser on it? I can't imagine, but I've never done it.

Sorry for the rambling, but my buddy and I will be sharing gear, so I'd rather get it right and we kick some butt. Jesse, you're not winning this year

[steviesterno]

Oh yeah, forgot to mention I do have a 10.5" SBR build in the works. It will have rails on it, so that might be a good idea? I'd have to switch out the scope and I'd lose my 18" and comp.

[wideerhunter]

I've shot a few night matches and I also shot last year's zombie match.

Headlamp: I only wore my headlamp for the 1st stage but found that it distracted my shooting and having both lights on a target washed them out.

Pistol: I didn't have a laser last year but I'm getting one for this year. While not too hard to pick up my M&P's fiber front sight, I think the laser is the way to go. Worse case, I'll toss it after a stage if it's not helping though I plan to do some night practicing as well.

Rifle: Use your 18" gun. Nordic makes rail sections that clamp on so just get a small one and clamp on your light. I don't think the laser would be useful on a rifle when you already have an optic on it.

http://nordiccomp.com/retail/shop/product-category/ar-15-10/rails/

Shotgun: I've never used one in a night match so I'm just clamping a light onto a nordic barrel clamp with rail. My front sight is a big fiber optic one so hopefully that will work!

My 3 other suggestions would be:

1. Bring enough food and Red Bull to make it shooting till 8AM.

2. Last year the guys with the billion power lights had problems with their light washing out the target and not being able to see the zombie's head.

3. Reloads that smoke a lot can block out your light and obscure targets. Much bigger problem at night.

[Chuck Anderson]

Laser on pistol and rifle yes, shotgun no. I found I spent more time aiming the shotgun to get the laser on than I needed to. I'm running lasers for sure on the rifle and pistol though. I watched several guys smoke me at the CT match last year with them. My ego tells me it has to be the equipment so I'm getting some. Not sure what ill do when I still get my butt kicked this year.

[rep70]

I have shot only one night match, so take this with a grain of salt. I would use a lower powered head lamp. I would put lasers on the Rifle and Pistol. Make sure your light mounts are sturdy, I saw a lot of lights acting up and coming loose.

The worst for me was the mental fatigue, I wasn't even finished with my first stage at my normal bed time. I shot my last stage in daylight, but I was mentally gone.

[MarkCO]

I'm with Chuck.

Shotgun: White light, WIDE beam, around 100 lumens. The 200+ lumen lights gave me too much scatter off the dust and smoke. The Crimson Trace CMR202 is light, low profile and 100 lumens, good choice. The laser slowed me down and was distracting.

Pistol: Last year I ran a white light. This year, the M&P has a CMR202 on the rail, CTC laser grips and night sights. Options are good and there are situations where all three of these are beneficial. The lack of a laser did hurt me on several stages.

Rifle: I ran a CMR201 laser and a TLR1 light on a suppressed 16" .223 with a 1-4 Burris MTAC. Keeping the laser, dropping the TLR1. I have not totally decided on the point light, but I am going for a focused beam light that will let me hit at 300 yards plus. I did not have enough light on the 125 yard targets. For the OP, inside 50 yards, a 200 lumen wide light would probably be fine. I am going to have the option for both a wide and focused light on my AR for night matches. The guys with the focused light were slow on the close hoser paper and the guys with the wide beams had more trouble on the longer targets.

I got a few of the hat clip LED lights and they worked well. You do want to be kind to the ROs and fellow shooters by not blinding folks with tons of white light. Something really bright for when you shoot, something in the medium range and then something fairly dim for re-set, getting ready etc. If you go cheap, it will break. Bring plenty of batteries!

[Chuck Anderson]

Another thing to mention. If you're using a mini red dot and a head lamp you may be in trouble. Depending on the model of red dot it may wash out. For me I was using a Deltapoint on my SG last year and the red dot just didn't light up the way I wanted with the headlamp shining.

[steviesterno]

Thanks for the help so far. It looks like I can order rails for my rifle, then slap a light and laser on. Just found a Crimson trace laser for cheap, so I'll try that and see how it goes. Still figuring out what to do with the pistol, though.

I don't think a trijicon will wash out with a headlamp, but that means I get to run around and try it later!

[Jesse Tischauser]

Chuck is spot on. Lasers baby! I'm gonna play with the shotgun laser some but I'm thinking my red dot and a flashlight will be adequate.

I didn't win last year either.

[sendit223]

I just used a Pelican flashlight in a Daniel Defense mount on my SG and it wasn't the reason I lost! It was rock solid and put out plenty of light.

You didn't mention it, but you should also think about wind direction and dust management. That surprised many of us last year at CT.

One other thing would be ready access to a light that could help you clear double feeds, etc. If your head lamp works for that then great.

[BuckeyeBoys]

Run the SBR and you wont need a light~! That muzzle flash will light up everything

[Fitzghan]

I’ve been looking for a night 3 gun match. Googled it and can’t find anything? Is there a website for this match and is it full?

Thanks.

[Doug H.]

I like red dot sights way better than lasers, especially since I shoot open. I have an STI with 90 deg mount and just ty-wrapped a Surefire to it. Thumb activates the light, works pretty slick for something I set up in 10 minutes. Red dot on shotgun (Aimpoint H-1) and rifle (Swaro 1-6 BRT). I did the ty-wrap thing with the shotgun light last year but had a twist activated Surefire that would sometimes turn off while shooting. This year I'm going with dedicated gun lights on the rifle and shotgun to stop that problem. Rifle has the Crimson Trace vert grip with green laser and white light. Shotgun will carry a Surefire X300 Ultra.

Headlamp didn't seem necessary to me last year and Chuck is right, it will wash out your sights or dot. I was dark behind my weapon light. The dust mentioned earlier is also a consideration. Bright light and dust makes for whiteout conditions which slows your pace (or at least your hits).

Good red light (or 2 )is a must, no white lights inside the lines as a courtesy to other shooters.

Here is the link to the CT match: http://www.crimsontrace.com/company/crimson-traces-midnight-3-gun-invitational/

Doug

Edited July 16, 2013 by Doug H.

[Jesse Tischauser]

At this point I'm only away of 3 of them.

North Texas Multi Gun did a mini major in May.

Crimson Trace is holding theirs in August.

Lone Star Protection is holding a Zombie Prepper night 3 match in October.

All of these matches have threads in the match announcement section.

[Classic_jon]

In the night shoot my club had I ran a TLR-1 HP on my carbine and have to say it works great. It is a *very* focused beam and with it mounted at the 9:00 position on my rail I was able to toggle it on with my thumb and use it as a thumb rest. It may only be 200lumens but with as focused as the hot spot is I see no issues with using it out to 200 yards. Make sure it is the HP model for the focused beam! http://www.streamlight.com/product/product.aspx?pid=251

I also have an X300 (regular, not ultra) for my pistol and it works well at shorter ranges. It has a nice hot spot but also illuminates out to the sides.

For a shotgun I would think something like the X300 would work well there too but I have no experience there.

For scoring, I bought one of the cheap plastic ball cap clip on lights from Cabellas that has a bunch of green LED's and tilted them to aim down with the hinge. Being able to tilt it down was a big help and kept the light out of peoples eyes. http://www.cabelas.com/product/Hunting/Lights/Headlamps|/pc/104791680/c/104743080/sc/104379480/Cabelas-Adjustable-Angle-Clip-Lights/1199597.uts?destination=%2Fcatalog%2Fbrowse.cmd%3FN%3D1100172%26WTz_l%3DSBC%253BBRprd1222216&WTz_l=SBC%3BBRprd1222216%3Bcat104379480

[steviesterno]

thanks for all the ideas and keep them coming! I found a crimson trace laser to mount on my rifle, and now I need to decide if I want to run an M&P with light and laser, my 2011 with just a light, or bite the bullet and get a light/laster combo.

Are the pistols going to have to start holstered? I didn't know if I would have to get all new set ups for this one match

[Jesse Tischauser]

thanks for all the ideas and keep them coming! I found a crimson trace laser to mount on my rifle, and now I need to decide if I want to run an M&P with light and laser, my 2011 with just a light, or bite the bullet and get a light/laster combo.

Are the pistols going to have to start holstered? I didn't know if I would have to get all new set ups for this one match

2011 with light laser combo. If your running irons a laser will be much faster.

If you can get a holster do it. They had provisions for staging your pistol but it was almost always an advantage to draw it earlier.

[MarkCO]

I did not get a holster last year...big mistake.

IMHO, I did not like the weight different having a light/laser on the M&P rail. That is why I went with the Laser Grips and the CMR 202 on the rail. The balance feels better to me that way.