remoandiris Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Hypothetical, but probably has happened during a Level 1 or while staff is shooting before a higher level main match; RO is running shooters. RO's unloaded gun falls from the holster. Does the RO or scorekeeping RO say STOP or does the RO allow the CoF to finish, and retrieve the gun after RIC? Of course the RO would clear everyone from downrange prior to having the scorekeeping RO retrieve the gun. 10.5 and it's sub paragraphs don't address competitors while acting in the capacity of an RO. Is the RO dual-hatted as an RO and a competitor? If so, it seems to me the RO or scorekeeper should immediately say stop, clear the competitor, move to the RO's dropped gun, scorekeeper clears it and places it into the RO's holster, then RIC. RO with the dropped gun gets DQd and the competitor who was stopped gets a reshoot. NROI's dropped handgun ruling from Jul 09 doesn't address an RO's dropped gun during a CoF, but does say once the gun is dropped, they are just like any other competitor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFlowers Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 At a Level 1, since the RO is typically a shooter as well, I would think you would ask another shooter who is working as an RO. Let's be honest, out of a squad of 12, in most cases you have 2 or 3 guys who will step up and RO, and you know who they are. Yes, this has happened to me. I was RO'ing a shooter and tripped over a spike that had been left sticking up. I knew at least a couple of people in the squad were experienced ROs and just asked one of them to deal with the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Taliani Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 RO with the dropped gun gets DQd and the competitor who was stopped gets a reshoot. What is the basis for this DQ? Are you saying you think the RO should/would be DQed because the gun is dropped during the course of fire (even though he is not the shooter)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztecdriver Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Hypothetical, but probably has happened during a Level 1 or while staff is shooting before a higher level main match; RO is running shooters. RO's unloaded gun falls from the holster. Does the RO or scorekeeping RO say STOP or does the RO allow the CoF to finish, and retrieve the gun after RIC? Of course the RO would clear everyone from downrange prior to having the scorekeeping RO retrieve the gun. 10.5 and it's sub paragraphs don't address competitors while acting in the capacity of an RO. Is the RO dual-hatted as an RO and a competitor? If so, it seems to me the RO or scorekeeper should immediately say stop, clear the competitor, move to the RO's dropped gun, scorekeeper clears it and places it into the RO's holster, then RIC. RO with the dropped gun gets DQd and the competitor who was stopped gets a reshoot. NROI's dropped handgun ruling from Jul 09 doesn't address an RO's dropped gun during a CoF, but does say once the gun is dropped, they are just like any other competitor. No. They are not. They are not handling the weapon and not responsible for it. The RO is not in the COF, the shooter is - the only person DQ'd for a drop gun DURING the COF is the shooter. The make ready command is given for a SHOOTER. Everything else happens OUTSIDE of the COF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CZinSC Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Provided the RO that dropped the gun didn't pick it up himself, it is not a DQ per 10.5.14 Retrieving a dropped handgun. Dropped handguns must always be retrieved by a Range Officer who will, after checking and/or clearing the handgun, place it directly into the competitor’s gun case, gun bag or holster. Dropping an unloaded handgun or causing it to fall outside of a course of fire is not an infraction, however, a competitor who retrieves a dropped handgun will receive a match disqualification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EkuJustice Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Typically at a level 1 match, if RO drops the gun wait till its done, he calls everyone back and has someone else on the squad (probibally whoever would be running the RO when he were shooting) retrieve the gun and place it in his holster. Alot of level 1 matches have more than 1 person running someone throughout the COF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKT1106 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 I would stop the COF and the shooter would get a reshoot to make sure safety procedures are followed. Remember our safety rules- Treat every gun as if it were loaded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mactiger Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Hypothetical, but probably has happened during a Level 1 or while staff is shooting before a higher level main match; RO is running shooters. RO's unloaded gun falls from the holster. Does the RO or scorekeeping RO say STOP or does the RO allow the CoF to finish, and retrieve the gun after RIC? Of course the RO would clear everyone from downrange prior to having the scorekeeping RO retrieve the gun. 10.5 and it's sub paragraphs don't address competitors while acting in the capacity of an RO. Is the RO dual-hatted as an RO and a competitor? If so, it seems to me the RO or scorekeeper should immediately say stop, clear the competitor, move to the RO's dropped gun, scorekeeper clears it and places it into the RO's holster, then RIC. RO with the dropped gun gets DQd and the competitor who was stopped gets a reshoot. NROI's dropped handgun ruling from Jul 09 doesn't address an RO's dropped gun during a CoF, but does say once the gun is dropped, they are just like any other competitor. No. They are not. They are not handling the weapon and not responsible for it. The RO is not in the COF, the shooter is - the only person DQ'd for a drop gun DURING the COF is the shooter. The make ready command is given for a SHOOTER. Everything else happens OUTSIDE of the COF. This ^^^^^ is the right answer. I would stop the competitor, get the gun retrieved and secured, and issue a reshoot. Troy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remoandiris Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 RO with the dropped gun gets DQd and the competitor who was stopped gets a reshoot. What is the basis for this DQ? Are you saying you think the RO should/would be DQed because the gun is dropped during the course of fire (even though he is not the shooter)? Yes, that was what I was thinking. The rulebook does not differentiate between a competitor's gun and an RO's gun. But, Troy clarified and I accept his interpretation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remoandiris Posted August 27, 2012 Author Share Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) deleted. Edited August 27, 2012 by remoandiris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Hypothetical, but probably has happened during a Level 1 or while staff is shooting before a higher level main match; RO is running shooters. RO's unloaded gun falls from the holster. Does the RO or scorekeeping RO say STOP or does the RO allow the CoF to finish, and retrieve the gun after RIC? Of course the RO would clear everyone from downrange prior to having the scorekeeping RO retrieve the gun. 10.5 and it's sub paragraphs don't address competitors while acting in the capacity of an RO. Is the RO dual-hatted as an RO and a competitor? If so, it seems to me the RO or scorekeeper should immediately say stop, clear the competitor, move to the RO's dropped gun, scorekeeper clears it and places it into the RO's holster, then RIC. RO with the dropped gun gets DQd and the competitor who was stopped gets a reshoot. NROI's dropped handgun ruling from Jul 09 doesn't address an RO's dropped gun during a CoF, but does say once the gun is dropped, they are just like any other competitor. No. They are not. They are not handling the weapon and not responsible for it. The RO is not in the COF, the shooter is - the only person DQ'd for a drop gun DURING the COF is the shooter. The make ready command is given for a SHOOTER. Everything else happens OUTSIDE of the COF. This ^^^^^ is the right answer. I would stop the competitor, get the gun retrieved and secured, and issue a reshoot. Troy It's what I would do as well. Seems like stopping everything when a gun is dropped is a very good rule and habit. It's the reason why, when a competitor drops his gun somewhere out of the sight of other shooters and staff that he will wait until somebody comes by and ask them to find an RO. Besides, I know I don't want my gun stepped on if the shooter realizes he missed a target and decides to move back uprange. Even if we don't trample it a gun laying on the ground is something that is going to have the shooter going WTF? if he spots it in the middle of his COF. Just a bad idea to leave it lay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProGunGuy Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 (edited) I have been seeing RO's bag up there gun lately while they take the timer. They must be reading these threads. Edited August 27, 2012 by ProGunGuy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laz2011 Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 I agree with Troy i would stop the shooter,secure the gun and give a reshoot.I would always lock my gun down in my holster. But now i might start to bag it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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