Zak Smith Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 I just started loading for my SV, and am still experimenting with combinations. I started off with 4.9gr Titegroup with a 180gr MG JHP, at 1.230". This chronod at just under Major, with a SD of about 35. Next, I pumped it up to 5.3gr TG. The average went up to about 935, with a SD of 25 or so. Switched to WSR primers. The average went to about 960fps with an SD of only 6 (!!) for a 15 shot string. I'm still getting primer flow into the firing pin recess, but this load doesn't feel very hot at all. It looks like the primer dimple is being "pushed out", and some of it shearing off. If this same PF (172) can be met with Clays safely, then using slower TG should be safe also. The max listed by Hodgdon in 10mm for a 180gr SIE JHC is 6.0gr TG with an OAL of 1.260". -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 Who cares why. It looks like a great excuse to go to SR primers in 40. My SD's with TG and SP primers are huge too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 Man... you've got a slow barrel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 Thats a long load. Sure you are not getting close to the rifleing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 4, 2004 Author Share Posted August 4, 2004 I just tried seating a dummy to 1.270" (40 thou longer than my load). It drops in to and out of the barrel with ease. At 1.230", I should be very far from the rifling. -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Snyder Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Are you loading 10mm or 40? Is this for an open gun or limited? I load 40 for both my open gun and limited and have not had the problems that you described. I also load a pin load for both of my 40's which is way above the 165 PF and I use Federal SR primers and have no primer flow. In my limited STI with a 6" barrel I load 165gr West Coast RNFP bullets with 5.9grs of VV-N-340 with the OAL at 1.176 with Fed.Small Pistol primers and it chrono's at 1060fps which comes out to a 174PF and have no primer flow and the gun shoots extremely flat. I tried the 180's and did not like them. The PIN load for my open STI was a 180gr Berry's flat point over 9.3grs of VV-N-105 with Fed. small rifle primers and the OAL is at 1.180 which Makes somewhere around a 198PF and still no primer flow. I have been experimenting with the 165gr WC bullets and loading them with 9.8grs of VV-N-105 with Fed small rifle primers and the OAL is 1.176 and they also are making somewhere in the High 190's PF with no primer flow. I think that you might want to go with a slower powder and seat the bullet to a shorter OAL and see what happens. The other thing that you could do is buy an EGW oversized firing pin which should be a tighter fit in your firing pin hole as that is what is a major part of primer flow. The way that you have described the flow will eventually lead to a stuck firing pin just when you don't want it! Just my 2cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 4, 2004 Author Share Posted August 4, 2004 .40SW, 5" SV Limited. Schuman bbl (NOT AET). TG is close in speed to N320, which tons of people use for Limited Major. I'll try backing down a bit and varying the OAL. Hopefully the batch I have will get me through RM3G. -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny hill Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Zak, try loading the rds. at about 1.180 w/ 4.7 of tightgroup w/ 180 bullet w/ .418 crimp. If your barrel timeing is correct, you should not get primer flow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slughammer Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 What kind of firing pin? I found the TI pin in my 9 x 19 (minor pf steel gun) was too light and resulted in primer flow. A switch to a steel pin and the problem goes away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 4, 2004 Author Share Posted August 4, 2004 sh, No idea. My guess is stainless, but I haven't even removed it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Zak, On your SD observation - try your 15 shot comparison a half dozen or more times... be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Merricks Posted August 5, 2004 Share Posted August 5, 2004 Zak, Read the threads on the XL firing pins. That will help you out on the primer flow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin c Posted August 5, 2004 Share Posted August 5, 2004 Benos definitely has a good point. For me, ten shot strings on the same lot of ammo (MG's over N320, WSR's) vary quite a bit, and the swing between any two strings can be suprising, and that goes double for comparison with an entirely different load altogether. That being said, my match load above averages the lowest ES's and SD's of any load I've used in .40 so far (but still can vary). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 8, 2004 Author Share Posted August 8, 2004 I tried this load: 180gr MG JHP, 5.1gr N320, 1.200", CCI #400 SR primer. v_avg = 923, sd = 19.6. Still saw the wierd primer effect. The 180gr MG JHP is only about 12 thou longer than the West Coast FP 180gr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.40AET Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 I tried this load: 180gr MG JHP, 5.1gr N320, 1.200", CCI #400 SR primer. Zak- You are running the same gun setup as I am. Now you have almost duplicated my old load. I have been running 4.9-5.0g N329 with slightly higher velocities. It has been a great load that I intend to keep using. I switched to WSR primers and had to bump up .1g of powder to get the same results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 9, 2004 Author Share Posted August 9, 2004 .40AET, Well, I scanned the Enos-sphere for 180gr MG & N320 loads a couple night ago and decided to try that one as a mild baseline. I wanted to rule out "too hot load" as a cause of the primer shearing. The load I've liked shooting the best so far is 5.3gr TG with the SR primer. I'll test a same-PF equivalent with N320 and see which one I prefer. But I've got to get this primer issue worked out first. -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 17, 2004 Author Share Posted August 17, 2004 I loaded a bunch with the CCI SR primers, 5.0gr N320, and 180gr MG JHP at 1.200". Same primer effect. Switched to WSR on the recommendation of some local guys, loaded it with 5.2gr Titegroup at 1.230" again, and maybe 1 in 20 primers had the flow effect. Conclusion: WSR are harder than CCI SR. I also had no misfires with the WSR, where I had about one per 50 with the CCI SR. I have a Limcat XL firing pin coming tomorrow, too. Only bad thing with the WSR is that they have HUGE velocity S.D.-- like 80fps. Whereas my CCI SR w/ 5.3gr TG had a SD of about 12. No idea. -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 17, 2004 Author Share Posted August 17, 2004 S.D. problem solved ?! The fail-safe nut on my 650 powder measure was loose again. I bet that was causing the wild fluctuations in velocity. -z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slughammer Posted August 18, 2004 Share Posted August 18, 2004 Hopefully the new firing pin makes the problem go away. Using loads that are well within pressure limits should not cause problems with any standard pistol primers. FYI : I checked the weight of 2 firing pins the other day. A TI pin weighed 30 grains and a stainless pin weighed 60 grains. Switching to the steel pin in my 9 x 19 allowed me to go from shearing Winchester primers to using Federal without any problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.40AET Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Zak-If you don't mind, could you post the next set of test results, I'm really curious. A. Primer hardness- I have always heard that CCI primers have the hardest cup. We did a poll on primer hardness some time back and I seem to recall most of us (BE included) agreed 1)CCI hands down hardest 2) Winchester & Remington in the middle and 3) Federal the softest/easiest to set off In addition to that, most Glocks will not consistantly ignite CCI primers, put the same round in any 1911 and you would not have a problem. The CCI's also seem hotter than the Winchesters. B. Please let me know what your results are with the Limcat XL firing pin. I couldn't find the thread, but I do remember reading that the interchangable breechface would not accept every firing pin. I have experienced some primer flow. It has been kinda on and off with no consistant pattern. I know that other Limited shooters are loading with more N320 than I am, but I cannot pin down the reason for the primer flow. It doesn't cause any problems, so I keep going with what I'm using. C. How to "Downgrade" your new Dillon powder measure You should read this if you are having problems with the powder measure. The downgrade makes the measure a lot more dependable and super smooth. Thanks for the input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Smith Posted August 22, 2004 Author Share Posted August 22, 2004 The Limcat XL firing pin did not fit in my SV. Dropping it in without the spring worked fine, and the diameter fit in the breech face looked good. With the spring (removed from the original SV firing pin), it wouldn't go in far enough to get it under the firing pin stop. I shot 5.3gr TG with WSR at 1.230" at RM3G and it worked perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.40AET Posted August 22, 2004 Share Posted August 22, 2004 The Limcat XL firing pin did not fit in my SV. Thanks Zak, that narrowed the field down to 2 choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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