tightloop Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 As I look at my own youth and do a mental comparison to what I see the youth of today doing and saying, sometimes it just really grates on me. We all want better things for our kids than we had, we want them to be smarter, better looking, etc., but we should also instill some old fashioned values in them as we raise them. I totally understand what it is like when you have both youth and enthusiasm, but the parents need to instill a little humility in them as they go thru that phase of their lives. I know it is hard to look forward and know that you are going to see the same folks as you go down that you did going up, but what they say in public now, should be tempered with that thought. It is also necessary to inculcate in them a sense of courtesy for those around them and appreciation for all the things their parents probably sacrificed so they could have all that they have now and can do all that they do now. Especially if what they do now is mostly an adult past time and they are still underage in the eyes of the law as well as the eyes of society. One can only hope that by being a good example they can see the inappropriateness of their words and sometimes their actions, even if they don't get that input from their parents; which would be the most logical choice. Kind of makes you want to slap their parents for not doing their job correctly, and then slap the kid for not being bright enough to pick up on their own faux pas...but then that might be deemed socially unacceptable or politically incorrect. Sigh... My parents didn't worry much about political incorrectness or what was socially acceptable or not when raising my bother and me, maybe getting back to some of that might not be a altogether bad thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGlock36 Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Amen Brother Loop. Paul Franklin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Double Amen. Poor parenting is one of the faultiest functions in American society today... and I see ghastly, outrageous examples of it wherever I go. I am (and have been for ages) DEEPLY concerned about the level of (il-)literacy in this country. It's liable to be our doom. On the other hand, I have been profoundly impressed with some young people's (young adults, in this case) level of concern, intelligence, courtesy and sense of respect for everything around them. Leadership in our country and our communities will, by default, fall to these individuals in short order. Those of us--at any age--who are honest, respectful and forward-thinking are the ones carrying the burden for the rest of the population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 tightloop: I wish you were the chairman of our local school board, Sig Lady the superintendent and Paul the principal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Dimaculangan Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 Triple Amen I'll admit that I have taken my parents for granted - but as I get older, I appreciate every single thing they do for me, and even I'm beginning to relate to them and the things they go through in life. My parents didn't have the luxury of growing up in the US like I did- nor did anyone ever introduce my dad to shooting IPSC @ a young age. The more i think about my achievements in life, it couldn't have been done without them. Ofcourse they will always have a more conservative perspective on life - growing up in the Philippines - but once I go off to college and live on my own - I think I would try to preserve everything they have taught me, from the language to family customs and etc. I owe them that at least =] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeeper Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 Lee, Does that mean that someday you will actually have to load your own ammo? At least you dont drive an H2 at 17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 Thank you, Ron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yeahyeah Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 I happen to be very proud of the way my son turned out, he isn't your classic church going kid, but you would be hard pressed to find an adult or kid his age that dosn't like him. He respects elders that diserve it, and not ones that don't, he is totally trustworthy and honest, thats more then I can say about a lot of adults I have run into. He's not perfect but...who is, don't blame society or the schools, its ALL on the parants. And I take full responsibility for any and all of his shortcomings. Jesse (my son) said to me once "I need a license to drive a car, but any a$$hole can have a kid". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 I always said when I was growing up, "I'm not going treat my kids the way my dad treated me." Now I find myself doing exactly what he did and saying exactly what he said. I reallized, at 25, that he did a pretty damn good job raising me and to raise my kids the same would not be a bad thing. BTW, I told him this not that long ago. My dad taught me to respect others, never do or say anything that you would not do or say infront of your grandmother and always do your best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 My grandparents, bless their hearts, taught me FAR more than my parents ever did....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 TL, I wish you could have met the kids off the soccer team I used to coach. They were the greatest kids on earth. Every one unique and special. Of course, this was in small town, which makes all the difference in the world. I think that there is hope: Parents of my generation have finally had enough. They've unplugged the TV, refuse to expose their kids to inappropriate role models, and have taken charge of their education. If my soccer kids were any barometer on the future, I think things will turn out alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimel Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 The generation currently in as Freshmen in college are the "Millenials" (I don't make up the names folks). They are an entirely different group of kids than what we saw for the past couple years. They are considerate, respectful, and willing to pitch in and help. They like the same rock and roll as their parent's generation (yippee!) and are actual fun to be around. They are also 100% better at following directions than the previous generation. I guess EricW's soccer kids made it to college. And yes, it does give me hope for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted March 21, 2004 Author Share Posted March 21, 2004 I am glad that there are some great kids out there, when I posted, I had just come back from San Antonio (read Big City) and was pretty steamed at some I encountered there. I realize it is all on the parents, but I feel that urban over crowding (or over population) lends itself to part of the problem too. Take a kid out in the country, hiking, camping, swimming, and it is tough to get into trouble. Let him loiter aroung the closest convenience store, drinking, smoking dope, hanging out with a bad element and it isn't brain surgery to see what is wrong with that picture. Being a parent is a tough thing to be. There are no manuals on what to do. Too bad lots of kids are born today cause their parents just wanted to "see what it was like to have one", or just did not care if they got pregnant or not. Children deserve the very best we can give them and it is dedicated adults like Ron Ankeny that help us to mold their minds and bodies to reach their full potential that deserve our admiration and support too. I don't want to withdraw my hate post, but I do feel a little more forgiving today than I did when I wrote it. Thanks for a place to get it out. Feel better now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 Kids simply need to be given (and taught) responsibilities VERY EARLY in their lives, and, IMHO need to be taught the value of money very early, too. Parents that keeping 'doing for' their kids and keep giving them everything they see-and-want are setting themselves up for a very bad fall... not to mention the lost valuable learning time the kids experience along the way. --->There's a poster at one of our malls that really makes a lot of sense: It reads (something like this): "Kids' minds are like jello. You'd better put lots of good stuff in it before it hardens." Talk about right on! It's never too early to instill values, responsibilities, respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 He respects elders that diserve it, and not ones that don't... Hmmmm... times have indeed changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 "inculcate" Wow you must be old to have learned that word at public school. I am home schooling my youngest to keep him away from kids, whose parents who I would not spend 10 minutes. I taught in the public schools and they are a disaster. Your children spend 8 or 9 hours a day with people, many of whom, have marginal education and level of commitment. Money is being burned in huge piles at most public schools. I also would ecourage young people to wait to have children. I was a parent at 19 and again at 36 and what a difference finishing growing up and knowing right from wrong makes. Nate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dunn Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 One of the big differences I see between my Dad's generation and my own is that todays parents seem to be overly child centered. I have colleagues that base their entire life around their kids activities, make huge sacrifices to put the kids in private schools, pay for music, dance, etc., etc. lessons. The kids get the idea (heck, they know with certitude) that they are the most important things on Earth. Is it any wonder that they get snotty, snooty, unappreciative and have a piss poor work ethic? My Dad let it be known that the stuff the adults were doing in the family was more important than kid stuff. That if we wanted a new bike, he'd drive us to the store after we'd mowed enough lawns to pay for it. That we had darn well better not interupt an adult when they talking, etc. I think the trick is to be child centered, but not to let the kids know it. SiG Lady (Valtro yet?) is right on about responsibility and the expectations that we should place on kids. I've witnessed able bodied teenagers sitting around watching TV while a work crew from church was busy re-roofing their house, and then whine and pout when instructed to pitch in. If that had happened when I was a kid, my Dad would have thanked everyone, sent them home, and then have had me roof the puppy solo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted March 21, 2004 Author Share Posted March 21, 2004 Nate Didn't learn inculcate in PS, my mom was an English major from Rice University. And yes, I am old anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 "Inculcate" is good. Some of us older adults actually used dictionaries as kids and read long books. Some of us also went to Catholic schools and behaved as the penguins expected us to... not to mention the level of literacy firmly instilled. There were no 'Dick and Jane' books in the Catholic Schools. None whatsoever. Thank God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MstngLX50 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 I'm 23 and feel compelled to speak on the matter of public schools in this country. I was so disgusted by the lack of education actually taking place that I dropped out when I was 17. The schools are no longer treated as a place of learning but more of a daycare so parents don't have to worry about their kids during the day, mine resembled a penal institution more than an educational facility. The only reason the administrators are concerned with student attendance is the money they receive from the state based on it. The standard tests are constantly being dumbed down to hide the fact that kids with no business in High School in the first place are actually graduating. You'd think that after leaving at the end of my sophomore year, getting a GED and enrolling in college I would be at some sort of disadvantage. Instead it was the best thing I could have done for myself. This isn't even that uncommon where I live. What did turn out to be uncommon in the eyes of the Texas Education Agency was the fact that I along with about 30 other "dropouts" were still on school records as attending students. In addition to the fraud being perpetrated by the district they added abuse of power and coercion to the list of charges. They approached my mother who teaches intermediate school in the district and told her in no uncertain terms that her job was at risk if I didn't widthdraw my sworn affidavit that I was no longer in any way associated with the districts educational facilities, and I use the term educational loosely. I didn't and many of those involved are no longer allowed on any school campus in the state of Texas, a few were brought up on criminal charges, and some still work there to this day. Where was the public outrage at the current state of education? For those of you with school age children I would strongly urge you to pay attention to what is actually happening in their schools. Dropping out is no longer for outcasts and misfits, it is becoming the only option left to those actively seeking an education. I was a National Merit Scholar in honors classes and found it to be entirely a waste of time for anyone not receiving a check from the state. Sorry about the length, but this is a particularly touchy subject for me. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted March 23, 2004 Author Share Posted March 23, 2004 Alan Glad to see that you are taking advantage of higher education. Dropping out is not the only other choice, there is private schooling or home schooling, both of which seen to do an OK job. We won't get into a debate about the penal aspect of your school, but suffice it to say, if the kids treated the teachers and administrators with respect and came to school with the intent to learn, the atmosphere probably wouldn't have resembled prison. That all lies with the parents providing the proper guidance and the kids having the proper motivation. I agree with the dumbing down of the qualifications to advance and graduate, it is pretty lame. The answer is to vote those folks off the School Board. Your statement that you were disgusted and dropped out at 17 leads me to question the involvement, or lack of it, in that decision by your parents; since by law you were not an adult at that time and could not make that decision by yourself. I understand that your personal closeness to the subject colors your view a bit, but having gone thru the public school system in Houston myself, and graduating from U of H, I can attest that it did not used to be as you describe. Try to get past it and move on while doing something constructive with your life and education. Best of luck with all you attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 As an 8-yr student of a suburban Catholic grammar school system, I attended a public school (third grade) only for a few weeks while the finishing touches were being put on our new neighborhood Catholic school campus. What I experienced in those few weeks led me to believe--even as a little kid--that the third grade student of a public school was operating at kindergarten level and doing NO substantial (at that time) solid subject studying at all. I was EVER so glad to be back in the parochial system shortly thereafter to return to the interesting reading texts, the spelling bees, the quiet discipline and the wider variety of "grown-up" academic subjects. Even though I was a goof-off personality in school, I still appreciated the intellectual stimulus; and we were constantly tested by the state and consistently scored at high school proficiency levels. The state pretty much left us alone because we exceeded their so-called standards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 I remember in college a poster that said something to the effect: "This new generation is surly, disrespectful and has no understanding of our sacrifices.... blah, blah, blah" In small print undernetah was the name of the greek scholar who wrote it and the date (it was written hundreds of years BC.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 As an 8-yr student of a suburban Catholic grammar school system, I attended a public school (third grade) only for a few weeks while the finishing touches were being put on our new neighborhood Catholic school campus. What I experienced in those few weeks led me to believe--even as a little kid--that the third grade student of a public school was operating at kindergarten level and doing NO substantial (at that time) solid subject studying at all. I was EVER so glad to be back in the parochial system shortly thereafter to return to the interesting reading texts, the spelling bees, the quiet discipline and the wider variety of "grown-up" academic subjects. Even though I was a goof-off personality in school, I still appreciated the intellectual stimulus; and we were constantly tested by the state and consistently scored at high school proficiency levels. The state pretty much left us alone because we exceeded their so-called standards. Glad your experience was a positive one. My wife is a recovering Catholic and her history with their schools is more like a horror story than a panacea. My next door neighbor also was a devout Catholic and sent all his kids to catholic schools (at least, initially). One of them came home with a beating everyday and was labeled as "incorrigable".. It turned out he had dyslexia and ADHD (attention defecit hyperactive disorder) so the beatings and humiliation were not helping him much. He pulled his kids out of there and they turned out OK (not in prisoin and working). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 bountyhunter: Yeah, there are little quotes from the time of Aristotle about the youth of "today". When I discuss the changing demographics of student populations, attitudes of kids, parenting, etc. with other educators, we are very careful about comparisons with times gone by because educators and education has also changed. The big difference is when I was a kid, all authority figures were treated with dignity and respect no matter what I thought of them. Sure we cussed the teachers behind the bleachers or in the locker rooms, but never in the hall and we for darn sure didn't disrupt class by arguing with a teacher in class. In today's world, many kids are openly defiant, rude, and self absorbed. I think the root cause is we (education) threw the "bums" out of school 15 years ago and now the bums are breeding baby bums. The baby bums have few social skills. Of course other schools suffer from the opposite problem. Kids who were born into old money and have everything given to them on the proverbial silver platter. I see that type of problem even in Wyoming when I get around the stomping grounds of the rich and famous folks in places like Jackson. I have stayed in the profession simply because there are still a lot of really good people in this world. The best and the brightest are still on par with scholars anywhere on the planet. We still have parents who value education and they instill that value in their kids. We still have kids with high moral values who respect everyone around them. There is hope. However, I can tell you, based on 27 years of teaching in public schools, kids today (in general) are kind of a pain in the ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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