Need help with crimp

[seabee23]

I needs some help with crimping. I loaded some dummy rounds up last night, and when I cycled them through my gun (3 times), my AOL went from 1.55 to 1.50/1.35. Is this too much setback? I am using a G31 with a 9mm storm lake barrel. The bullets are 124gr plated. When I measure my crimp, it is within specs. I cannot crimp anymore because it begins to smash the nose. Am I doing something wrong? Thanks.

[G-ManBart]

I'm not sure if you had a typo on your measurements after cycling..."1.55 to 1.50/1.35", but if they're going from 1.55" to 1.35" I would be concerned. Sometimes when you load them long (like the 1.55"), you can't get quite enough bullet pull (neck tension) and they're all going to set back a couple of thousandths, but if you cycled them again, it wouldn't get worse. Additional crimp won't hold the bullets in place any better, and it's not an option from what you describe. It sounds like you need to try a resizing die that will help give you more neck tension. What resizing die are you using now? The standard Lee resizing die is probably the tightest of conventional dies, and the Lee/EGW U-die is .001" tighter than that. Either is an inexpensive possible solution. You may simply have to drop your charge and seat the bullets deeper, and closer to a normal factory OAL to prevent the setback (just having more case wall making contact with the bullet). R,

[GForceLizard]

When you drop the 1.155 OAL length rounds into your Storm Lake barrel do they touch the barrel rifling? If you can can't spin the round it's probably touching the rifling and that's not good. Consult your reloading manual and shorten up the OAL. You can try 1.140 and 1.135 OAL for starters.

Edited September 15, 2010 by GForceLizard

[seabee23]

Yes those measurements are correct. I know setback is bad, but didn't know if it was that big of a deal since I cycled them through three times. I decided to go with the 1.155 since it is between min and Max, and I looked at a Winchester fmj, and that is what it measured. Maybe I will do up anouther batch, and start at 1.135. Any help is greatly appreciated.

[STUS4X4]

When you drop the 1.155 OAL length rounds into your Storm Lake barrel do they touch the barrel rifling? If you can can't spin the round it's probably touching the rifling and that's not good. Consult your reloading manual and shorten up the OAL. You can try 1.140 and 1.135 OAL for starters.

I agree with GForceLizard you may need to have a gunsmith recut and polish the throat of you barrel.

Edited September 15, 2010 by STUS4X4

[seabee23]

By the way my resizing die is an RCBS. How close do you guys usually get to the minimum AOL?

[BMartens]

I would think that 1.155 would be a little long for the magazines?

No need to extend a chamber if the magazine won't allow a longer OAL.

[GrumpyOne]

I'm not sure if you had a typo on your measurements after cycling..."1.55 to 1.50/1.35", but if they're going from 1.55" to 1.35" I would be concerned. Sometimes when you load them long (like the 1.55"), you can't get quite enough bullet pull (neck tension) and they're all going to set back a couple of thousandths, but if you cycled them again, it wouldn't get worse. Additional crimp won't hold the bullets in place any better, and it's not an option from what you describe. It sounds like you need to try a resizing die that will help give you more neck tension. What resizing die are you using now? The standard Lee resizing die is probably the tightest of conventional dies, and the Lee/EGW U-die is .001" tighter than that. Either is an inexpensive possible solution. You may simply have to drop your charge and seat the bullets deeper, and closer to a normal factory OAL to prevent the setback (just having more case wall making contact with the bullet). R,

+1 But I think the real problem is the long OAL touching the rifling. Try cycling one of the long ones through the gun, but stop the slide before it it seats completely, then measure the OAL. This will let you know if the setback is being caused by the feed ramp or the rifling.

[seabee23]

Ok, I just got home and checked to see if the bullet is touching the rifling, and it is not. I guess I will try a shorter AOL and see if that makes a difference. Man this hobby can be frustrating!

[Sarge]

Measure a loaded rond and then push the nose pretty hard(lean on it a little)against your loading bench. Measure again. Ideally the measurement will not change. I will post a link to my own thread on this awhile back. I get setback with certain brands of brass only and have to use a u-die for it.

Found it! Lots of good info here: http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=103799&view=findpost&p=1181299

Edited September 16, 2010 by Sarge

[seabee23]

Thanks sarge! I tried to push one pretty hard (hard enough to put a dent in the wood). Could it possibly have anything to do with the guide rod spring being to stiff since it is the stock spring in a 31?

[GrumpyOne]

Thanks sarge! I tried to push one pretty hard (hard enough to put a dent in the wood). Could it possibly have anything to do with the guide rod spring being to stiff since it is the stock spring in a 31?

Doubtful. But who knows. Polish your feed ramp to make less friction on the way up to the barrel, see if that cuts it down.

[Sarge]

Thanks sarge! I tried to push one pretty hard (hard enough to put a dent in the wood). Could it possibly have anything to do with the guide rod spring being to stiff since it is the stock spring in a 31?

Not likely.

The round you just pushed, is it the same brand of brass as you are getting setback with? If not, try one of those. You sure there is no contact with the rifling? Take the barrel out of the gun and drop your rounds in it. They should plop in and fall right out. Try coloring the bullet with a sharpie and spinning it to see if that shows contact.

I can run my rounds through a mag into my gun several times with virtually no setback.

One thing is for sure a u-die will cure it for good. You can order one from EGW for $37 shipped or directly from LEE for $32 shipped.

[seabee23]

I am using all win brass.

[DWFAN]

I had set back issues using jacketed Montana golds/zero's and hornady xtp's until I switched to the Lee U-die. Win/FC/CBC were the worst. R-P and G** were the best at having no set back until the U-die. I think the issue was with my Hornady sizing die, but cant confirm since I only use the U die now.

[gng4life]

Yeah, I had the same problems until I switched my 9mm, 38 super, .40S&W, and .45ACP sizing die to the U-Die. That cured several problems I was having. One thing I really had to start doing is adding some One-Shot to the batch or it's really tough to keep the process smooth. Good luck...

[at_liberty]

I am wondering if you would get the same result with an FMJ RN. The plated bullets I have seen appear to have more arc to the ogive, which would mean the shoulder comes farther forward for a given OAL. I am betting that something like 1.135 OAL would work fine.

I noted in one post that you said you couldn't increase crimp without mashing the bullet. The bullet seating (OAL) when in the same die has to be backed away in proportion to moving the crimp farther in. If you meant crushing the bullet body laterally, never mind.

Edited September 16, 2010 by at_liberty

[G-ManBart]

One thing is for sure a u-die will cure it for good. You can order one from EGW for $37 shipped or directly from LEE for $32 shipped.

The list is only $29 from EGW...was shipping really $8 for you? R,

[Sarge]

One thing is for sure a u-die will cure it for good. You can order one from EGW for $37 shipped or directly from LEE for $32 shipped.

The list is only $29 from EGW...was shipping really $8 for you? R,

I made an error in my math. The die is $29 and shipping to my Zip is $7. Total $36 From Lee it is $27.98 plus $4 for shipping. Total $31.98.

Edited September 16, 2010 by Sarge

[seabee23]

Thanks for all the help everyone. I place an order today for a 9mm and 40 Cal U die.