Switching Gears....

[Forrest Halley]

Hello All,

I am a beginning revolver shooter and I have gotten quite carried away with the multiple games/disciplines one can play/compete in with a 625 4". I am shooting in an area that is most frequently holding IDPA matches with a few USPSA and ICORE events a month. Holding all equally fun and exciting, it appears to be three different paces with two different rule sets. My problem is two fold: trying to manage the different effective paces/shooting tempos of each and the different rule sets. I am looking for methods that more experienced shooters use to transition between the three/two no matter how simple or complex. Initiating reloads out in no man's land and attempting to speedload the gun dropping live shells on the ground are my latest and greatest achievements. Speedloading or dropping partial moonclips does not seem to be of any benefit as the rounds were ALREADY IN THE GUN not 2 or 3 seconds away. Thoughts and comments are appreciated publicly or privately.

Regards,

Forrest Halley

[Peter F.]

Hey Forrest, I too am trying to get into the revo game. I would suggest you try and get tight with some other revo shooters in your area. Luckally for me I know a couple great revo shooters and they have been alot of help to me. Today I went and watched a friend shoot an Outlaw Steel match with his revo and saw the discipline it takes to shoot the revos efficently. Best of luck to you. Hopefully I will be in your shoes in a month or so. Peter.

[Bubber]

Hello All,

I am a beginning revolver shooter and I have gotten quite carried away with the multiple games/disciplines one can play/compete in with a 625 4". I am shooting in an area that is most frequently holding IDPA matches with a few USPSA and ICORE events a month. Holding all equally fun and exciting, it appears to be three different paces with two different rule sets. My problem is two fold: trying to manage the different effective paces/shooting tempos of each and the different rule sets. I am looking for methods that more experienced shooters use to transition between the three/two no matter how simple or complex. Initiating reloads out in no man's land and attempting to speedload the gun dropping live shells on the ground are my latest and greatest achievements. Speedloading or dropping partial moonclips does not seem to be of any benefit as the rounds were ALREADY IN THE GUN not 2 or 3 seconds away. Thoughts and comments are appreciated publicly or privately.

Regards,

Forrest Halley

Hey Forrest, to me it is all the same goal. Hit A's as fast as you can. Non A's cost you more in IDPA than USPSA and in ICORE a non A costs even more. In most IDPA matches, I have only shot two, it is spelled out for you how to engage the targets and other critera is required ie; reload form cover shot and such. In USPSA and ICORE it is more of a technique thing, in what works best for you in where you reload, stand and engage the targets. All are fun. In reloading before you are empty; If you can do away with a standing reload and reload while moving that 2 second reload is used to get to another position to engage targets and will not be on the cloc, sort of. I shoot mostly ICORE and USPSA mostly becaus ther are only 4 weekends in a month and on the fifth weekend when it falls I am shooting Steel. And if you have not been welcomed to the Froums yet...Welcome to the BEnosverse. Have fun later rdd

[mjts]

I've also just recently got into the revo game, shooting ESR in IDPA. I also shoot in USPSA but mostly in Production. For me, revolvers are better suited to IDPA since the stage round counts are usually lower (18 rounds max). The problems that can arise are if the IDPA stages are not revolver neutral; breaking the stage into 6 shot arrays can be challenging. A lot of the USPSA matches that I'm shooting will also have motion targets (drop turners, swingers, ect.). In a IDPA match, it requires some additional thought in ammo management. Other than that, the fundamentals are pretty much the same.

Mike

Edited April 26, 2010 by mjts

[Forrest Halley]

Hey Forrest, I too am trying to get into the revo game. I would suggest you try and get tight with some other revo shooters in your area. Luckally for me I know a couple great revo shooters and they have been alot of help to me. Today I went and watched a friend shoot an Outlaw Steel match with his revo and saw the discipline it takes to shoot the revos efficently. Best of luck to you. Hopefully I will be in your shoes in a month or so. Peter.

Peter,

Thank you for your response. My problem is that only in ICORE do I get to shoot with a decent competition pool of people shooting revolvers. I say people shooting revolvers and not revolver shooters because several are discouraged with the lack of competition in IDPA revo classes and lost brass does make it difficult on SSR shooters. Therefore they only shoot the wheel in ICORE. I have already learned that I need to be more efficient with my shots and their placement. This is a theory and goal that I do not always succeed in practicing/achieving. I do not know why my shoes are at all desirable at this point, but I can tell you that reloading and diligent/responsible dryfire combined with as much live fire as you can afford got me a long way from where I started. I have only one Master to be encountered so far at a match, but I have seen that I can learn something from any and all revolver shooters. If you have any questions about my journey as a revolver shooter I'd be happy to trade stories. Good luck to you as well.

Forrest

[John Z Sr]

Welcome. I shoot revo in all 3 games, 2 of which I favor far more than 1, for numerous reasons. Please notice the word "games". Treat them as such and you will have more fun, in my opinion. If you enjoy SHOOTING at lots of targets as fast as you can hit them, USPSA is the game, but not as many revo shooters, if you want to shoot with all revo shooters and shoot at lots of targets as accurately as you can, ICORE might be for you, IDPA, well shoot some matches and you decide. Best of luck, be safe and have fun

[John Z Sr]

Oh yeah, 4" 625 is my favorite as well!!

[Forrest Halley]

Hey Forrest, to me it is all the same goal. Hit A's as fast as you can. Non A's cost you more in IDPA than USPSA and in ICORE a non A costs even more. In most IDPA matches, I have only shot two, it is spelled out for you how to engage the targets and other critera is required ie; reload form cover shot and such. In USPSA and ICORE it is more of a technique thing, in what works best for you in where you reload, stand and engage the targets. All are fun. In reloading before you are empty; If you can do away with a standing reload and reload while moving that 2 second reload is used to get to another position to engage targets and will not be on the cloc, sort of. I shoot mostly ICORE and USPSA mostly becaus ther are only 4 weekends in a month and on the fifth weekend when it falls I am shooting Steel. And if you have not been welcomed to the Froums yet...Welcome to the BEnosverse. Have fun later rdd

Bubber,

Thanks for your welcome and input. I would like to get a bit more technical into the actual pace of shooting for each discipline. For example in IDPA I am running and 12 shot stage in the mid 9's to mid 11's from concealment. For ICORE it's more than double that I guess because I am feeling the greater focus on accuracy and I just don't have the familiarity/trust with the gun/shooter to gas it. We need not go there with USPSA on the 12 shot stages because I am still handily hitting the no shoots like it's my job. However, it appears that as long as you can hit the A's half the time you can haul and hose and make out quite well. The no shoots and the failure to engage seem to be the real killer penalties here. For the sake of argument out of a speed rig I think I should be shooting a 12 shot stage in about 6 to 8 seconds to keep with the tempo of the discipline. I haven't had a good steel match yet so I can not even guess about that tempo.

What I am really looking for is preparation techniques whether mental or actual drills to get ready for the rules and pace of the different disciplines. Before IDPA I do X....before ICORE Y....anything that fixes the shooter in on that discipline....shifting gears so to speak. I am having a hard time with this transition, my actual shooting is ok without the mental malfunctions.

[Forrest Halley]

Welcome. I shoot revo in all 3 games, 2 of which I favor far more than 1, for numerous reasons. Please notice the word "games". Treat them as such and you will have more fun, in my opinion. If you enjoy SHOOTING at lots of targets as fast as you can hit them, USPSA is the game, but not as many revo shooters, if you want to shoot with all revo shooters and shoot at lots of targets as accurately as you can, ICORE might be for you, IDPA, well shoot some matches and you decide. Best of luck, be safe and have fun

Thanks. I play all the games just for the comraderie and they each offer different physical and mental shooting challenges. As I am predominated by IDPA in my area I am learning to love what is available and trying to figure the best tempo for each and how best to "lock in" to that particular game beforehand. Thanks again and yes I love my 625JM 4". It's so fast and functional...took me a while to get used to the grips, but now I am hooked as the others squeek badly when I try to roll them.

[hopalong]

Forrest and Peter,

First of all welcome to the forums and Revolver shooting in particular.

Next question. Where are you in relation to the rest of the world. (where do you shoot?)

and now to answer your question (Maybe)

Like Bubber said. It is all a matter of hitting A zone(USPSA), -0(IDPA), or A-ring/X-ring(ICORE) as effeciently and fast as possible.

there isn't much difference between the shooting, it is how you're allowed to tackle the stages is the biggest difference. (I'll leave that alone as it gets into the political/ this type shooting vs that type that isn't allowed on the forums).

What you need to learn is to pick a spot on the target and shoot at that spot instead of an area of the target. That to me is the best and simplest advice I can give you.

IF you want to get into a large pile of revolvers in one spot you can go the the IRC in JUNE (ICORE NATIONALS) or the Memphis Charity Challenge in November (USPSA match) or the IDPA Nationals. Those 3 matches are the biggest congregation of revolvers in their respective disciplines. (The cheapest to attend the the MEMPHIS CHARITY CHALLENGE).

If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. Lots of good help around here.

Hopalong

[Forrest Halley]

Forrest and Peter,

First of all welcome to the forums and Revolver shooting in particular.

Next question. Where are you in relation to the rest of the world. (where do you shoot?)

and now to answer your question (Maybe)

Like Bubber said. It is all a matter of hitting A zone(USPSA), -0(IDPA), or A-ring/X-ring(ICORE) as effeciently and fast as possible.

there isn't much difference between the shooting, it is how you're allowed to tackle the stages is the biggest difference. (I'll leave that alone as it gets into the political/ this type shooting vs that type that isn't allowed on the forums).

What you need to learn is to pick a spot on the target and shoot at that spot instead of an area of the target. That to me is the best and simplest advice I can give you.

IF you want to get into a large pile of revolvers in one spot you can go the the IRC in JUNE (ICORE NATIONALS) or the Memphis Charity Challenge in November (USPSA match) or the IDPA Nationals. Those 3 matches are the biggest congregation of revolvers in their respective disciplines. (The cheapest to attend the the MEMPHIS CHARITY CHALLENGE).

If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. Lots of good help around here.

Hopalong

I am located in Mathews, VA and currently shooting all over the state in the various disciplines. I am hoping to go to the IDPA Indoor Nationals next year when my skills are a little more solid. I think I will have to check out this Charity Challenge as a speed/reality check on the way. Thanks for your tips and advice.

Forrest

[jar]

The pace for all of the sports is the same. When your sights confirm that a shot will hit the A-zone/-0/whatever, break the shot. Don't focus on speed, focus on seeing the sights and calling good shots. Try doing a search on here for 'visual patience'.

[Peter F.]

Forrest and Peter,

First of all welcome to the forums and Revolver shooting in particular.

Next question. Where are you in relation to the rest of the world. (where do you shoot?)

and now to answer your question (Maybe)

Like Bubber said. It is all a matter of hitting A zone(USPSA), -0(IDPA), or A-ring/X-ring(ICORE) as effeciently and fast as possible.

there isn't much difference between the shooting, it is how you're allowed to tackle the stages is the biggest difference. (I'll leave that alone as it gets into the political/ this type shooting vs that type that isn't allowed on the forums).

What you need to learn is to pick a spot on the target and shoot at that spot instead of an area of the target. That to me is the best and simplest advice I can give you.

IF you want to get into a large pile of revolvers in one spot you can go the the IRC in JUNE (ICORE NATIONALS) or the Memphis Charity Challenge in November (USPSA match) or the IDPA Nationals. Those 3 matches are the biggest congregation of revolvers in their respective disciplines. (The cheapest to attend the the MEMPHIS CHARITY CHALLENGE).

If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. Lots of good help around here.

Hopalong

I am in Prairieville, LA about 10 minutes from Baton Rouge and 1 hour from New Orleans. I know some great revolver shooters. Some of whom have shot with and are good friends with the Jerry Miculek. I am still on the hunt for the revolver I want. Whenever I get it I am going to be going in head first. Already have been training with some A class and Master class shooters. I have been getting some great pointers from everyone I have talked to.

[John Z Sr]

I see you are in VA, not sure where Matthews is, but if the Raleigh, NC area is not too far for you, please join us, we shoot at least 1, mostly 2 matches per weekend between USPSA, ICORE and IDPA. Not too late to try and get into the Carolina CUP this year. Best IDPA match going, in my opinion, and the current USPSA National REVO champ will be coming up and shooting with me again this year. The venue is "The Range" in Oxford, NC ('bout 1/2 hour north of Raleigh), we also shoot a 7 stage USPSA match the first Saturday of the month at "Sir Walter" in Creedmoor, NC (same area) and always have an "A" class revo and most times a "GM" in revo, not to forget a bunch of great talent in all other classes. This match is on a par with any Level 2 match I've ever shot, and we get it once a month. "Caswell Ranch", right up by the Va. border, hosts an ICORE match every month, please consider shooting with us

[glockwerkes]

Welcome to the Benosverse!

We who live in the round gun world have to stick together. Although not directly to your original post, but if you want to get a little deeper into the USPSA pool, consider this a personal invitation to join us at the VA-MD Section Championship next month. I'm putting together a REVO squad for the Saturday AM slot. We have some bottom feeders with us, but there's still an open spot and would love to have another wheelgunner. It's at Fredericksburg, and here's the link:

http://www.vamduspsa.com/index.html

The stages will be a bit more challenging than your typical monthly match. If you have any questions, feel free to send me a PM.

[Forrest Halley]

I see you are in VA, not sure where Matthews is, but if the Raleigh, NC area is not too far for you, please join us, we shoot at least 1, mostly 2 matches per weekend between USPSA, ICORE and IDPA. Not too late to try and get into the Carolina CUP this year. Best IDPA match going, in my opinion, and the current USPSA National REVO champ will be coming up and shooting with me again this year. The venue is "The Range" in Oxford, NC ('bout 1/2 hour north of Raleigh), we also shoot a 7 stage USPSA match the first Saturday of the month at "Sir Walter" in Creedmoor, NC (same area) and always have an "A" class revo and most times a "GM" in revo, not to forget a bunch of great talent in all other classes. This match is on a par with any Level 2 match I've ever shot, and we get it once a month. "Caswell Ranch", right up by the Va. border, hosts an ICORE match every month, please consider shooting with us

According to Mapgenius your range is about four hours away from me. 7 stages sounds like a worthy drive. As far as the Carolina Cup I will have to stay pending on at this point. I would like to see some GM clas shooters and learn. I'll definitely consider it thank you sir.

Forrest

[Forrest Halley]

I am still looking for methods that more experienced shooters use to transition between the three/two disciplines no matter how simple or complex. Initiating reloads out in no man's land and attempting to speedload the gun dropping live shells on the ground are my latest and greatest achievements. Speedloading or dropping partial moonclips does not seem to be of any benefit as the rounds were ALREADY IN THE GUN not 2 or 3 seconds away. Thoughts and comments?

[Bubber]

I am still looking for methods that more experienced shooters use to transition between the three/two disciplines no matter how simple or complex. Initiating reloads out in no man's land and attempting to speedload the gun dropping live shells on the ground are my latest and greatest achievements. Speedloading or dropping partial moonclips does not seem to be of any benefit as the rounds were ALREADY IN THE GUN not 2 or 3 seconds away. Thoughts and comments?

It will all dependent on what is required at the next shooting location. If 5 hits are required and you have less than 5 shots left in your revo you will have to do a reload somewhere. If you do this reload while moving and can get to the next spot ready to shoot have you not saved 2 to 3 seconds over a standing reload? If there are more than 6 hits required and you have enugh rounds in the revo plus the 6 on the reload it would pay to carry them over. So it is the stage design that will dictate if you need to dump or carry. Dern Stage Designers... later rdd

[Blueridge]

I hate dropping live rounds on the ground, and I cannot remember ever doing it (unless I had a round that failed to fire from primer strike, or the stage had mandatory reloads). I have watched a number of revolver shooters drop live rounds during stages as part of their plan. I prefer to reload when I have to, as that decision works for me. I have found that reloading on the move and quickly getting to the next position then reloading works about the same for me. Switching between IDPA and USPSA is a mental change for me, and I have found that switching with revolver to enhanced service revolver is easier for me than switching from production to stock service pistol.

[Northern Xtreme]

In IDPA all of your reloads have to be done behind cover, so that pretty much takes the thought out it for you, therefore I shoot the gun dry before reloading since it takes more time to try to put away the unfired rounds.

But in USPSA like Bubber said, if you can reload on the move the reload hasnt added any time to your stage.

If you are heading from a four shot array to a six shot array, it only makes sense to reload while moving to the six shot array so you can shoot it as soon as you arrive without doing a time consuming standing reload.

If you are heading from a four shot aray to an 8 shot array, then you might want to just run there shoot the two shots left, and then do a standing reload which you will have to do anyways.

Sometimes it is easier to break a stage down in reverse order from finish to start. Usually whatever gives you the fewest standing reloads will be the quickest way to run the stage, especially with a revolver.

[Boats]

Forrest,

Guy told me long ago I could improve my match standing by not making mistakes, Shoot the same just don't screw anything up. Rifle sports that's missing a switchback, shooting on the wrong target etc. Sooner or later you need to learn how to hold the rifle but big gains can be made by not shooting bad shots, Action pistols it's important, more rules and shorter time to think about it.

IDPA It gave me a fit for a while. I ended up making some flash cards for the key rules that drew procedurals, then added a few critical match strategy items. If you break the differences down, and I only know IDPA and ICORE, there are not that many. Ended up with a dozen or so that rode in my cars cup holder. It helped me tremendously friend of mine has the cards now and same thing, he is making few mistakes in the COF.

Pace is another thing. On the one hand ICORE is demanding accuracy wise, however trying to push my IDPA faster I am finding it's still important. Seems to me a key pre match routine is to fix the pace I intend to shoot the array. I still fall back into going too fast with Auto Pistols and taking too long with Revolvers but it's starting to come together.

On local matches I hear some good ICORE work is being done at Cashwell Ranch. Carolina cup very good revolver shooters shoot but way the range is spread out unless you are in there squad you are not going to be able to "go to school" on top level shooters. Blackwater last year Ron squaded a bunch of us together however given the shooting house lay out it's still hard to watch the other guys. Important to me since I was at the bottom of the squad skill wise. It's a totally different set of problems compared to other matches. Seems to me Blackwater is perfect for Revolvers lots of cylinder fulls with cover to reload before the next targets.

We ought to get a car load of Revolver shooters to drive down to Cashwell.

Boats

Edited April 29, 2010 by Boats

[John Z Sr]

Would love to see a group from Va. come down for our ICORE match at Caswell Ranch, the stages are always great and we always have a fun time, please join us

[Forrest Halley]

Would love to see a group from Va. come down for our ICORE match at Caswell Ranch, the stages are always great and we always have a fun time, please join us

How many points are you willing to spot us? This could be negotiated...

Edited April 30, 2010 by Forrest Halley