gans

I’m not arguing your point here, but this doesn’t mean a California customer can’t send you their registered frame and have you build it up. Federal Law might not recognize a frame as a gun but California law does. When we buy stripped AR lowers from a vendor or bare STI/single stack frames from other people, we go through the same dealer registration of sale paperwork process as if it were a complete gun. In the case of STI or single stack frames, during the transfer process the frame is also registered as a handgun. In the case of a California customer sending you a frame plus parts to build up, the process is the same as a Nevada or Kansas customer. That California customer, just like a Nevada customer, would then need to pay the excise tax when they sell the gun. That’s unfortunate, but it’s still the customer who would be liable for any violations of state regulations. Plus, I’ve never seen any threads on a trubore. The point is that either the gunsmith or the customer with the frame will become the manufacturer. The manufacturer must be registered with CA DOJ. You state that CA considers the frame as the manufacturer. Where is that in their law? How would they test it for function or safety for certification? What caliber and length barrel is a frame? I am missing a lot, please explain more. The trubore barrel is not threaded and doesn't apply.

Gary, thanks for posting. I, too, was hoping to have you do some work at some point in the future. Re: the roster, you don't need to be on it as you're not producing a new gun with a new serial number. The roster is only for newly manufactured guns. Per the ATF, the serialized portion of the firearm (the frame) is the firearm. In order for a CA resident to have a frame, she would have to go through the registration process (whether purchasing it through a private party transfer, obtaining it through an intra-familial transfer, or coming into the state with them as a new resident; there are some exceptions that are unimportant, but do not affect the fact that you are not producing a new firearm) and it would be that person's gun/frame, not yours. You are simply a gunsmith, not a seller or manufacturer of a firearm, and have temporary possession (not ownership, like if you were selling the frame). Any frame that would be sent to you would not need to be re-registered to re-enter the state and could be sent directly back to the owner in CA (following the ATF guidelines for interstate shipping of firearms, as you would for any other resident). Re: compensators, I went through this with the CA DOJ many years ago. The statute you cited describes certain features that will lead a pistol to be designated an assault weapon, which are illegal in CA. The text reads: The important part of that is what's underlined: "capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer." I described a compensator to the DOJ folks as both a flash-enhancer and a loudener. More importantly, however, I pointed out that on cone-comped guns, the gun is not capable of accepting anything as removing the comp makes it essentially useless. The DOJ person I spoke with said, in essence, no problem. An overzealous prosecutor might be able to make a case with a threaded bull-barrel, where the owner has removed the Loctited-on comp and reassembled the gun, but what you would have sent would not be "capable of accepting" anything. It'd be the owner's ass on the line, not yours. HTH. You're still legally able to provide CAliens with your services, if you're so inclined. Disclaimer [since I'm a law student]: the above is not legal advice. Consult an attorney (whether private or CA DOJ) for legal advice. ... A frame is registered, but it is not a gun. Once a gun is built, federal exise tax must be paid on it. If the gunsmith builds it and sells it, they are the manufacturer and they pay for it. If a customer buys the frame and has it built, then they are the manufacturer and pays the tax when they sell it. That is federal law. Please let me know where CA state law differs. As far as comps go, I used to pin and weld the pins in place. But, that was not good enough. When a gun was tested for certification, they screwed the comp off and the threads were destroyed, but they rejected it any way. I am not interested in consulting with an attorney. Let CA change their laws.

Hopefully Mr. Natale can post here and explain his policy. It makes no sense to limit one’s market if there’s no legal requirement. I used to think the worst enemy of the California practical shooter would be government regulation, but now we have to deal with arbitrary self imposed policies of gunsmiths (Gans) and manufacturers (STI). I would think that someone who’s business relies on his customers’ ability to buy guns would be more supportive of those on the front lines of the gun control war. ... I am not on CA Roster of Handguns Certified for sale in CA. So, I am not allowed to build guns for CA residents. Also, I am not allowed to install compensators on threaded 1911 barrels. PC 12276.1(a)(4)(A). If I missed something, let me know. It seems that those are CA laws and not my policies, that are the problem.

I used the existing serrations. It checkers at 20LPI. I reduced the depth of cut at the bottom where the mag well is beveled because it is too thin there. Gary ***

The internal slide lightening that reduces the most weight, can be see on an older Colt National Match slide. The bore of the slide is machined larger between the barrel bushing and back to just in front of the locking lugs. It is used with a standard barrel and a barrel bushing. As the slide cycles, the barrel is supported by the bushing at the front and the bore of the slide at the rear. In my opinion, it is not a good idea to machine the bore larger if a bull or coned barrel is used. These barrels are not supported (like a bushing) by the slide at the front when it cycles, only at the rear. If the bore is machined larger, the support at the rear is reduced and binding can result.

I made some comps with only side ports back in my experimenting days. They reduced the recoil some, but didn't do much for the flipping. Best to stick with ports on the top. They reduce the flip and recoil as well. Bleeders can be added on to the end of the comp to bleed off some of the remaining gas which would reduce recoil some, but now extra weight is added to the barrel/comp which in turn slows the cycling down some.

Never had to, that I can remember. You did not state what brand of parts you are using though. After fitting 100's of STI slides and frames (sometimes Caspian also), the parts are over size and need to be machined down to fit. Usually the bottom of the slide and the sides of the frame need to be machined for fitting.

Lighten the slide appropriately so that you are getting reliable ejection of at least 3-5 feet and use some good tuned mags.

The first thing to do is to fit the barrel correctly. You might be able to get it to work with a .508 measurement. If that doesn't work, cutting the frame for the Para cut will fix it, like what has been mentioned. Another option is to just add a little weld on the back of the existing barrel to take up the play.

Good luck w/ that It'll be interesting to see how quickly baffle erosion sets in... Maybe we need a wager... I have a feeling it will be like the batteries in my surefire. It will be great for a while, then all of a sudden it'll start to disappear. Kidding aside, I wonder if you could coat an aluminum comp in something (besides anodizing it) that would be heat resistant? Duracoat? That Ionbond stuff? You can have it Chromed. I had White Wolf Custom Refinishing in Florida do some aluminum parts. Gary

GentlemanJim is correct. There is a step on the 9mm slides. I believe that STI just used the 38 super slide dimensions and didn't bother to move the ejector cut out for the 9mm breechface. The step can cause problems depending on the fit up of parts. I would use the 38 super slide, but you need to measure the breechface to make certain that it is in tolerance. I just sent a super slide back because it was wide enough to feed a 40 round into it.

No complaints from these customers. Some are in law enforcement/training as well.

Stockton' The following is only my experience and others may have different results, so take it for what it is worth. Barrel ports can work, but they may act a bit different than a comp. Since the ports are back closer to your hand, they help to keep your hand from rising up. The comp works more towards the front of the gun to keep the flip down. The two work together to create a flatter shooting gun. There have been some good layouts of barrel ports with mixed results. The better setups will result in a really flat shooting gun. The recoil will be straighter back into your hand. However,your grip can cause the dot to move sideways. And you need to be concerned with the added pressure, the 38 super is more forgiving than the major 9. I use 3/16" ports to get any kind of usable gas flow. Straight up, not angled. 2-3 for major 9. I would not put a port at the front near the comp pivot point, it can crack off there and accuracy problems can result. I would keep the port back atleast a 1/2" so that the gas flow doesn't disturb the bullet as it leaves the barrel. The attached pic is a gun that a customer wanted built. I am now building him a second gun exactly like the first to use as a backup. I guess that he thinks barrel ports work. In conclusion, I would shoot some ported guns first and get a feel of how they work for you. I would not just install them and assume that you will just get the results that you want. The way that the gun is set up and the loads can have an influence the results also. There should be a time when you know if you need them rather than searching a forum for opinions. Gary

Ah Yes, the days of pin shooting. Where the 45acp didn't have enough of pressure to work a comp any bigger than 1 port. Unless you were a competitor and had the money to get serious. I don't think that barrel ports will do much with that light of a load. A small 1-2 port comp will help some, but you have to decide if the cost is worth the small amount of performance.

I think that the owners use them mostly for varmint hunting and playing around. Yes, it is a 10mm necked down to a 224 bullet. Your not dealing with a very powerful cartridge. 40-45gr. bullets at 2200-2400fpm. Less than a 100pf. The recoil is a bit different because of the slower burning powder. Sort of feels mushy. I don't know if a comp would work very well, it might slow the slide down too much. I'm not sure it even needs one. The owner of the last one that I built, left the end of the barrel plain. I think that he is going to play around with something different.

Something a little different, just for the fun of it.

224 BOZ is a 10mm necked down to .224.

You can look at a Colt National Match slide. The bore is machined out larger and some smaller cuts elsewhere. They will not add up to as much of a weight reduction as what can be had by machining the outside. It all depends on what you want.

Sorry Venry, but I believe that some of the larger 4 port comps can be made to shoot flatter than the standard 3 port ones that are out there. As I said, they will push down on the barrel and slide harder and cause more friction which will slow the slide down more. That is why the slide needs to be lightened up more. It doesn't have anything to do with making the comp work. I find that an efficient coned 4 port comp works nice with slide weight of around 10oz. Recoil spring runs between 9-12lbs. I don't know if you consider that a rubber band or not. I agree that it takes a balance of components to build a fast flat shooting gun. Maybe I just see things a little differently, as most of the customers I receive usually request that type of a gun to be built. Respectfully, Gary

I think you underestimate what a shooter is willing to pay if there is an advantage to be had. If someone/manufacturer designed a comp that performed appreciably better than the other comps on the market, I would wager that we shooters would purchase those comps even if they were much more expensive. How many of us have magazines that are twice as expensive as a stock mag so they can have another round or two available at the beep even though it probably wouldn't make any difference for most stages? You might want to clarify what you mean by a better comp. If you are referring to a more efficient/flatter shooting comp, they are out there. The problem is that they require extensive slide lightening which is quite expensive. Therefore, most shooters are complacent with the average set up.

You can't find anyone selling 3 port comps??? Interesting. As Flexmoney alluded to, case capacity and powder burn rate have an influence. Also to consider are the weights of the slide and comp/barrel and the size/efficiency of the comp. Some of the current smaller 3 port comps are designed to be used on slides that have not been lighten very much. You can expect a bit more flip from them. A comp with 3 big vertical ports or a 4 port will be more efficient and shooter flatter, but it will also push down on the slide more. That will slow the slide cycling down more, so the slide should be lightened more to compensate for it. 5 ports??? Some of the comps with 4 big vertical ports are so efficient that they push down on the slide so much that even a lighten slide will barely cycle if it cycles at all.

I installed one earlier this week. The barrel/comp weighed 9.0oz. The slide weighed 10.2oz. It came out OK.

Most builders will use the classic cut slide because it weighs less. Most feel that the standard dust shield looks best with it and is lighter. The classic slide with a long dust shield will add a little weight up front, if that is what you want, but it seems to look a bit odd to most and may need some dressing up. You should be able to build a fast and efficient gun if you follow some basic facts. 10.0-10.5oz. slide weight 8.0-8.7oz. comp/barrel weight medium size comp, 3-4 vertical ports (depending on caliber used) Good luck, if you are going to try and change the basic facts with personal opinions or voo-doo.

Depending on how bad it is, you might try freezing it. That might help getting it off.

Before the extractor is blamed for the breakage, look at the clearance pocket in the rear of the barrel. If the front of the extractor is getting hammered against the barrel because there is no clearance, that can break the extractor. If the extractor is a bit long and was not fitted correctly, it can hit the barrel. Also, as the hood wears; the slide will move forward as well as the extractor and may start hitting the barrel even though it may of had clearance to start with. Always good to check the clearance. A standard extractor is more forgiving as it is a bit springy. An Aftec is more ridgid and is more likely to break at the weakest point if it gets beat on.