moverfive

This is not a problem. The Palms are used for DATA COLLECTION. The correctness of the division in the Palm is irrelevant, since the division for the competitor stored in EzWinScore is the one used for preparation of results. Ditto for power factor. I'll have to check to see if the lastest update transfers SS, but it really isn't necessary. .....for us it was a problem initially because only using EZWin was not a realistic option. So transfering the registration back and forth between EZWin and Excel was causing a naming issue.....if I remember correctly, it was transfering Single Stack as Limited 10 along with transferring Limited 10 as Limited 10. But again, I was able to create a simple work-around in my coding within Excel.

We are using it and it is a great system. And depending on the number of shooters you typically have and your match schedule, there could be some problems that may require a little 'outside assistance.' Specifically - match registration for each competitor, to include squadding, must be done within EZWin. And in our case where it is not uncommon to have 70 - 80 competitors, trying to register AND squad at the same time within EZWin is not an easy or desireable task. But we were able to solve this problem using a heavily modified Excel spreadsheet that is included with the software package. We created a standard match registration for all shooters and all divisions for which they may shoot (for us that is approximately 600 shooter numbers). We then handle the actual registration and squadding within Excel in a MUCH more user friendly environment. Once registration is complete, I push the actual registered shooters to the computer and sync with the Master Palm.....the whole process after all shooters are registered takes maybe 15 minutes to have the Palms ready for the squads. Because our club runs four matches (both a morning and afternoon match on Saturday and Sunday) and because of the large number of shooters we typically have, our situation is a little different from what a lot of clubs that would use this system. Therefore, our initial learning curve took a little longer because we were having to constantly modify our Excel software to get everything working in the way we needed to match our specific situation. But even with that extra time, it took us three local matches (three months since we only shoot once a month) before we were up and running 100% on this Palm software. As for the reliability, the whole scoring system is as reliable as the Palms you are using. For that reason, we write the summary information on a scoresheet in order to have a paper backup. Plus maintaining a paper backup helps in keeping the shooting order of the squads. But once all scores have been entered, I take each squad's Palm, beam the scores into the Master Palm, then sync the Master Palm with the computer, and then upload the scores into EZWin - hit calculate results and scores are done! I literally can have scores posted within 15 minutes of the last shot fired. The only problem with the Palm and EZWin is Single Stack division. The latest version does not recognize this division when transfering information back and forth from the Palm. Again, I fixed this issue via my Excel software but I also think that Rob is including a fix in the next maintenance release. The cost is definitely prohibitive to many clubs, but once you do have the program - YOUR SCOREKEEPER WILL LOVE YOU! When I first saw just how thick 80+ scoresheets look like AND knowing that the scorekeeper had to enter six stages worth of scores for each - almost 500 stages worth of data, the money was worth it. The accuracy of the scores and the speed of the results was definitely worth some money to us.

Hey Bill, I just forwarded the file with the data I used to write the spreadsheet. Hopefully that will give you some ideas as to how to make something work for a 3-gun version.

The only real manual part about the process is simply exporting and then importing the text files into Excel, verifying the column headers, and then copy-paste into a data area for each division. After that - pivot tables, vlookups, and a variety of other formulas take over. The trick is simply creating all of the whiz-bang calculations off the format of the data to be imported. Once you have data within Excel, you can literally produce just about ANYTHING you want. Heck, I think if you wrote enough formulas, we could probably find coordinates to Jimmy Hoffa's body. Seriously, I do this on a monthly basis for our local club since we track year-end results using two different scoring methods (match points and points earned for type of finish) and that process for all divisions only takes about 10 minutes. Using this variation for the sectional match, I took a little longer since this was the first time to use it and I wanted to take a little extra time to verify the output......but I doubt the whole process took more than 20 - 25 minutes.

William C. Hill, Jr 901-755-4196 william.hill@adintellico.com

As for the speed of the six inch versus the five inch - with the lightened slide I have, I am able to shoot the six inch with 0.11 - 0.13 second splits and maintain the same pattern on a 10-yard target. Those times are no different than what I do with a five inch. However, the difference that I am seeing (literally) is that the front sight of the six inch tracks SOOOO much better than my five inch. So while the five inch might actually have a quicker cycle, because of the greater amount of movement of the front sight, the splits are the same as the six inch's. And because of the better sight movement, I seem to be able to flow through targets very similar to when I am shooting my open gun. To some degree, the real difference between the six inch and the five inch may come down to what you are more used to/what fits your particular shooting style. Since I am primarily an open shooter, the way my six inch gun shoots is closer to what I used to shooting. .......and to clarify - I have only started running with the gun and I use 165gr JHP's. While I seem to have found a 180gr load that seems to work fairly well, from what I have seen, I would not take anything other than a 165gr to a real match. So I can see where those that shot a heavier slide and/or a heavier bullet would definitely think the gun feels a little sluggish as compared to a five inch version.

What will the round count be for the 10 stages? 10 stages, with enough rounds, is typically the number of stages one should expect from a Level II/State Championship.....

USPSA has its own version of a FTDR rule....... ....call it what you want, but 99.9% of this issues that has spawned this boundary line rule comes from poor course design. Whether that poor course design is because of BAD design or simply the course designer is an inexperienced shooter (i.e. not familiar enough to look for and thus prevent holes in stages). And since it is going to be impossible to have good, experienced course designers for every stage at every level II match and above......we have a boundary rule in an attempt to counter poor design, for whatever the reason. And when you read the intent and the possibilities, the rule offers some favorable advantages (i.e. creating a bridge effect and other scenarios where leaving the area would be dangerous). However, I highly suspect many of these poor course designers are going to implement this rule into their designs so that they don't have to think for more than 5 seconds as to how to setup the stage.....as opposed to creating the bridge scenarios and etc. The net result for many of these stages will simply be a weird hybrid of freestyle and box shooting....only this version is not only going to limit the different ways to shoot a stage, it is going to limit the way you actually get to those locations. And while I do not support this rule as a whole, I also don't think the abuse is going to be too wide-spread. It will occur and it will make some stages/matches very boring......but I doubt it will be that big of a deal in reality. One exception - if this rule is utilized at national level matches to "stop the gamers," then I would be VERY disappointed in the design crew. If we cannot properly design stages at a national match without having to enfore USPSA's FTDR rule, then we need to take a hard look at who is designing/reviewing our stages.

crimping probably isn't your problem - it is the sizing die that is probably the culprit. As you will see across many threads/posts, the "U" (undersized) die will not only solve most problems like this one but will also aid in overall feeding and functioning. Do a search on the U-die and you will get more than enough information about it and where to get them.

John, just shoot lead........it will be cheaper and any residue will have to be easier to clean than that Montana Gold stuff you had to clean out previously.

I was joking with a fellow shooter at our last match that I'm probably getting more dance practice than shooting practice. Footwork is very important: one of the Local GMs does a pretty good job of whipping up on the young guns...and not because he ever physically runs through a course. You have to understand what Jake is saying - footwork and footspeed are two different things. The best example today of that fact is Rob Leatham. I could probably out run Rob while wearing a cast on both legs and balancing a glass of water on my head......but his footwork and ability to get in and out of positions is still some of the best ever, and thus he more than makes up for his lack of speed in between locations. Sort of like a quote Michael Jordan made towards the latter part of his basketball days - he said as a young player that he could beat most guys because of his physical skills but now that he has "slowed" down, he beats most guys because he understands the game better that most. And contrary to other comments, while a GM or M can miss fast enough to beat B-class shooters......in the upper classifications, you cannot miss fast enough and expect to win your class, much less the match. Now I am a definite advocate of going after speed first and then points second on most stages, but on every stage and within every class, there is a breaking point that if you drop too many points, your time will probably not save you. The other thing that I would caution people about judging someone's results to the better shooters at a local match - for many upper-classed shooters, local matches are nothing more than practice. They are not going to shoot a local match with the same focus and intensity as they would at a real match. So if you are a C-class shooter and you regularly finish in the 70%-80% range against M's at your club, do not expect to finish anywhere near this at a real match......and conversely, you cannot necessarily call that C-class shooter a sandbagger because of his local match results.

Sorry, forgot to say that the data was through a 1/32 twist barrel with 3 holes in the barrel.

Great powder........8.1gr to 8.2gr loaded to a 1.235 length. In several guns this seems to average around a 170 - 172pf.

You can order them online now at http://www.cingular.com It should be at home when you get back No, you have to go to Apple's website to order online. AT&T is making you come to a store to order one at this time.

Oh yeah, I have had one from them for a long time and have not had any issues whatsoever from it. I also thought that they were VERY reasonably priced.

A great litmus test is to put in a new shock buff and then shoot several rounds holding the gun normally - as opposed to any weak hand or other awkward positions. Take a look at the shock buff.....you should see an imprint where the slide is just making contact with the shock buff. If you don't see an imprint, you have too much spring for that given load, if you see a deep impression, you have too light of a spring.

yeah, one match doesn't exactly answer all questions...... .....but when you shot tight squeeze with no dot (darn rookie, forgot to turn it on), he almost got all of his hits. That tells me you are able to point the gun very well. And no, the shooting the stages again wasn't really a key factor - you were shooting faster and with more confidence with the open gun. We just now got to get your grip more consistent!!!!

Did Cem shoot the match? Just wanted to know how I needed to ridicule him.

'blow' past a target? I thought you just chose NOT to shoot that particular one? and just in case anybody wonders if that 'mongoose' face from Florida was a one-time event......nope. He maintains that face through every stage.

If you are seeing this level of disparity in these two 'groups' you identified, then that tells me the make-up of these clubs is the problem......not who is shooting what type of gun in a particular division.

this is where a part of the question I keep asking comes back to - how does setting a pound limit on a trigger job make any difference? And by that I am asking - if I am allowed to do a trigger job (one where I am not redesigning the action in any form or fashion) and the resulting trigger job only makes the gun more 'user friendly,' then where does the pound limit come into play?????? Allowing trigger jobs AND including a pound limit is no different that allowing you to change sites on a gun but not allowing you to have Trijicon or Dawson sights. You either allow trigger jobs or you don't. If the thought that a new shooter shows up with all of the needed gear to shoot USPSA but decides to quit the sport because another competitor(s) has invested an additional $150 on a trigger job......that isn't happening. Anyone serious about competing in USPSA, $150 is a drop in the bucket of the expenses they will incur and is therefore not the deciding factor if they decide to stay in the sport or not. The other argument about allowing all of these mods on Production guns will blur the lines with Limited and Limited-10.......come on. The only real changes you can do to a production gun is clean up the trigger and install better sights. The changes you are allowed to do to a Production gun is just the tip of the iceberg of what is done to a real limited gun in most cases. Again as I asked on a different thread - while Production may not be exactly as some had envisioned it to be several years ago, what is really broken that needs fixing? And specifically in this case - what is broken that requires a 3lb trigger pull to fix?

And I guess this is where I don't understand your points. When I modified my trigger, I didn't go out on a limb or try to push the envelope. I simply had my trigger modified so that it was more 'user friendly' for competition. I didn't draw up blue prints to redesign how it works, I didn't contract with NASA to develop new materials......I just had Canyon Creek make the trigger to where it is easier to pull (thus making the gun more accurate) and no longer requires me to pull the trigger over a half mile to make the gun go bang and that same half mile back in order to reset itself. THAT modification is what the current Production rules allow and was it's intention. So where does a pound limitation come into play? What about the double-action guns that have a 1 1/2 trigger pull after the first shot? My XD is way above that pull on every shot? Are you only concerned with the first shot? And does that fit in with your definition of the original intention of Production? If my XD has to have a 3lb pull on every shot - shouldn't double action guns have the same limitation on every shot? My point and my overall question for these rule changes is - in your opinion, what exactly is broken? While the current format of Production may not be exactly as you had hoped, WHAT IS BROKEN? As others have shown, Production is the leading division in some areas. I know in a couple of major matches, Production was the second most populated division behind Limited - beating out Open. Production doesn't sound broken to me. So what do you see is broken that requires a 3lb trigger pull in order to fix?

You know, I have heard more "horror" stories relating to electronic scales....and no manufacturer seems to be immune. And because I still hear about them, I am sticking with my manual scale......until gravity changes, I know the measurement is accurate.

my sentiments exactly...... .....I guess the good coaches were asking for the market value, in other words, too much for Jerry.

it would fit.....look at the Blackjack.