sinnsyk Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 (edited) The new Guiderod is now finished. I wrote up an article to show how this thing works and it's purpose. They are at heat treat right now, will be ready to ship early next week. Eaa Witness / Tanfoglio FrameSaver Guiderod Edited December 4, 2009 by sinnsyk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 Cool, this is getting added to my growing list of parts to get installed before next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slavex Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 another part Tanfoglio needs to add to their list of "factory" parts. sigh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnsyk Posted December 3, 2009 Author Share Posted December 3, 2009 This is a problem the factory should have addressed a long time ago. But no reason to wait for them. If you wanna get it done right... do it yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Spiess Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Awesome! I'll be picking one up soon as i put together small spare parts kit for next season. I wouldn't mind one in tungsten - yeah, I know it would would be $100 or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Limited Custom Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Awesome! I'll be picking one up soon as i put together small spare parts kit for next season. I wouldn't mind one in tungsten - yeah, I know it would would be $100 or so. Is tungsten has one for us? They works really good in STI/SV Henning's is nice but just to save the frame (my guess) I do want soming to make the gun with less "kick". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnsyk Posted December 4, 2009 Author Share Posted December 4, 2009 The secondary idea behind this is to bring a shock buff solution next. A tungsten solution is something I have considered. I could make a two-piece ConeHead with a screw-on tungsten piece, but as you said it'll be expensive and I'm not sure how big demand would be for it. Personally I think the Match would benefit the strongest. The Limited in my opinion is okay as is, but you know.. maybe a tungsten rod is the cat's meow... let's try it. Here's probably the way to go... In fact if you wanted that today, I bet Rich at Canyon Creek would make you a setup using my guide rod and turn a tungsten piece to fit. Rich already have made the traditional guiderod out of tungsten. A blend of his tungsten rod custom-fitted to my ConeHead could be a exactly what you're looking for. The hardened cone steel head will hold up the beating and the tungsten for added front weight. I'll be sending some of my new designs to Rich next week and he could turn some custom rods to match up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 I think the reason that a tungsten guide rod can benefit a STI/SVI is because of the composite design. I think you will find that the all-metal construction of the Tanfoglio will negate much of the benefit that you get with a plastic framed gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Limited Custom Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 The secondary idea behind this is to bring a shock buff solution next.A tungsten solution is something I have considered. I could make a two-piece ConeHead with a screw-on tungsten piece, but as you said it'll be expensive and I'm not sure how big demand would be for it. Personally I think the Match would benefit the strongest. The Limited in my opinion is okay as is, but you know.. maybe a tungsten rod is the cat's meow... let's try it. Here's probably the way to go... In fact if you wanted that today, I bet Rich at Canyon Creek would make you a setup using my guide rod and turn a tungsten piece to fit. Rich already have made the traditional guiderod out of tungsten. A blend of his tungsten rod custom-fitted to my ConeHead could be a exactly what you're looking for. The hardened cone steel head will hold up the beating and the tungsten for added front weight. I'll be sending some of my new designs to Rich next week and he could turn some custom rods to match up. Henning In that case, I want one. Will you post it when you and Rich ready for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnsyk Posted December 4, 2009 Author Share Posted December 4, 2009 (edited) I'm back in Colorado on Tuesday, but I may get Emma to pick them up from the heat treater even earlier. Either way, Rich will have some as soon as they are ready and it's probably just a matter for him when he can make a combo-rod. I like the idea and i think it's the absolute best way to go to ask Rich to do this on a custom basis. Based on the curious experimenters' experience maybe the rest of us will follow suit. Who knows... And I have said this before.. I think the Match owners really could benefit from adding front weight from a tungsten rod. I will probably pretty soon cut my slide to allow for a rubber shock-buff with the ConeFit (that's what I renamed it) guiderod. Edited December 4, 2009 by sinnsyk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 I'm curious, why would you need to cut the slide for a shock-buff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnsyk Posted December 4, 2009 Author Share Posted December 4, 2009 The Tanfoglio doesn't have a very long rear travel - compared to a 1911. Take a look at it when you rack your slide to it's farthest rear position. You'll see that the breechface is just past the ejector and just far enough to pick up the next round. For a shock buff to work properly it needs to be placed between the frame 'block' where the slide (the dustcover part of the slide) hits it. This is what stops the slide from moving any farther back and this is where the slide - frame hitting occurs. I can make a 0.050" to 'maybe' 0.080" thick aluminum shock buff and still get the slide to pick up the next round. But if it doesn't move far enough and give the magazine enough time to push the next round up, you'll see misfeed issues. Exactly how thick of a buff we can install without any slide modification I don't know, but I'll start to experiment when I get back. I would recommend getting the new guiderod before trying any of this. The reason is that if you don't you won't get much support behind the buff and it could snap real easy. Being so thin, only an aluminum shock would be feasible. But... if the slide (dustcover part) was machined off, say by 0.100"... it would allow the slide to move this much farther rear. And this means we could make a rubber shock buff and most likely have it protected with a very thin steel washer for extended rubber shock life. So, now the new shock buff would offset the same amount machined off, whether this is 0.100" or 0.150" etc. We would prefer to keep the rearward movement as it was originally designed. If we just shorten it, it may cause everything from frequent to cccasional feeding issues. A rubber buff w/ protective steel washer is the absolute best way, but it also will require to cut the slide's dustcover back to compensate. Now is just the question of how much softer it will make the recoil. Besides of course being a frame/slide life extender. I can say this... if and when our slide/barrel project gets off into production, the complete upper (conversion kit) will be supplied with my new guiderod, a rubber shock buff, steel washer and a slide to match up with the buffer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slavex Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 sorry Henning I meant that this is another part of yours that Tanfoglio should carry and offer as an option for us Production shooters. It's frustrating as hell to not be able to legally use your parts!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Spiess Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 I think the reason that a tungsten guide rod can benefit a STI/SVI is because of the composite design. I think you will find that the all-metal construction of the Tanfoglio will negate much of the benefit that you get with a plastic framed gun. The weight difference between an STI Edge and an all steel high-cap 1911 like a Para is less than a couple ounces. I have use tungsten rods in my Paras and like the extra forward weight. In the Tanfo, I'd like to reduce the slide weight, but keep the overall gun weight up as much as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnsyk Posted December 4, 2009 Author Share Posted December 4, 2009 Hey Rob. No.. got what you meant and I agree with you. The factory won't be interested in paying for higher end parts. What would be nice is if the production rules were flexible enough to allow for using parts that keeps the guns running. Being a production division it's a sensitive topic as of course they don't want the class to slide into another 'open' division. Some parts are not as much of a competitive advantage as just beneficial to making sure the guns are reliable. The new guide rod won't make you shoot faster, but it will protect your gun from damage. I remembered the misfire problems you were having at the world shoot and that they ended up allowing production shooters to use my firing pin so you could use the Armscor match ammo you more or less were forced to use. I'm glad you can use my front sights and grips in production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnsyk Posted December 4, 2009 Author Share Posted December 4, 2009 I've reduced the slide weight of my Limited by a little bit. Probably a little less than the Limited Custom. What really makes the Tanfoglio guns so flat shooting is the lighter slide weight over the 1911-style. And having a heavy frame to absorb the recoil/impact is what makes the combo so nice to shoot. More and more are discovering this... ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slavex Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 That wasn't me with the misfire issues, that was Jim and a few other guys, they let them use heavier hammer springs and I heard some guys did get to use your firing pin. I was lucky that I brought my own ammo (curtesy of my two ammo mules Warren and Michelle). The sight, the grips, are all awesome, but all Tan would have to do is offer your parts through their website, and say they are options for all guns, and we'd be good to go. Just like CZ did with Angus' stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 That's a neat idea! If IPSC already approved that for CZ then they have set a precedent. It might be worthwhile to contact Tanfolgio when you get back from Norway, Henning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Hepworth Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 yes,..+1 on that. I guess it would depend on how tanfoglio wants to progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slavex Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 yeah the ball is in their court. they are aware of Henning and all the goodness he does, but whether or not they want to grant official status is another thing. But man it would be nice if they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bianchi Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 Great idea! Don't forget to include a decent sear as well.... If Tanfoglio doesn't want to go to the trouble themselves, they would indirectly profit from increased interest in all PD approved models and others by creating a "Performance Center". My Stock II wasn't very competitive "out of the box". It took hours of polishing and tweaking with a lot of help from some of you guys to get the trigger right. Henning, why don't you fly back to the US via Milano or Verona ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinnsyk Posted January 7, 2010 Author Share Posted January 7, 2010 We shipped a lot of the new ConeFit guiderods in the mail today, you guys should have them shortly. The Conefit is designed to stop the battering of the frame, but next step is to design a matching shock buffer to prevent the slide from hitting the frame. There will ultimately probably be two shock buffer systems: 1) An aluminum shock buffer that can be install without any modification to the gun. It will have to be thin and from aluminum to allow the slide to move far enough back for reliable ejection and feeding. I'm going to play with some steel washers to determine the thickness. Preliminary measures will be 0.050" - 0.080". I doubt any thicker shock buff will be reliable. 2) The ultimate shock buffer is of course made from rubber for a softer recoil. However, they are thick and a thin steel washer in front of the rubber will be the best setup. To be able to do this it will be necessary to cut the same amount of thickness added by the rubber buffer and steel washer off the slide. This will probably only be done by a few, but I'm guessing more and more will follow suit as soon as the brave few starts modifying their guns in this direction. I'm also hoping to have an american made slide (and barrel) which my plan is to be designed to work with my guide rod and a rubber washer. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-Ho Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Henning, Any plans for a good trigger bow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slavex Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 how long before you start making frames dude? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Spiess Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Any news on the Tungsten Cone Head front? 2) The ultimate shock buffer is of course made from rubber for a softer recoil. However, they are thick and a thin steel washer in front of the rubber will be the best setup. To be able to do this it will be necessary to cut the same amount of thickness added by the rubber buffer and steel washer off the slide. This will probably only be done by a few, but I'm guessing How much material do you anticipate will need to be removed from the slide? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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