FN SLP/Winchester Practical

[Brian Payne]

I have been shooting the FN SLP MK1 and like it so much I have purchased a Winchester Practical as a backup. Basically the same weapon but the Win. is 2 3/4" only while the FN is 3". They both come with two gas pistons.

I got the Winchester as a backup because I have been having some odd jams from the FN. The jams are being caused by pilot error I think. I lube the gun the same way I lube my AR and my old Rem. 1100. If the gun fires and oil splatters my glasses and shirt, it might have enough oil. This much oil on the FN gas piston might be slowing it down enough to be causing my problems.

How are you oiling the FN's and Winchesters? Do you oil the gas piston? Also, what other differences are there between the FN and the Winchester Practical? The photo I looked at showed the Winchester had a chrome or stainless mag tube, where the FN's is blue. I also see the two gas pistons for each weapon are rated differently.

The FN is being sent off to SRM Performance later this week. They "seal" the gas system and install the surecycle recoil system, hopefully reducing the malfunctions.

[TXMXRACER]

I talked to Daniel Horner at the Larue 3-gun match this weekend about his. He runs his pretty wet too. I started having some weird jams with mine and thats what started the conversation. He did mention the "sure cycle" system and about having problems with breaking recoil springs.

I have been lubing my gas piston lightly and lube the crap out of the bolt and carrier. Seems to be working ok so far.

shane

[Doug H.]

I have been shooting the FN SLP MK1 and like it so much I have purchased a Winchester Practical as a backup. Basically the same weapon but the Win. is 2 3/4" only while the FN is 3". They both come with two gas pistons.

I got the Winchester as a backup because I have been having some odd jams from the FN. The jams are being caused by pilot error I think. I lube the gun the same way I lube my AR and my old Rem. 1100. If the gun fires and oil splatters my glasses and shirt, it might have enough oil. This much oil on the FN gas piston might be slowing it down enough to be causing my problems.

How are you oiling the FN's and Winchesters? Do you oil the gas piston? Also, what other differences are there between the FN and the Winchester Practical? The photo I looked at showed the Winchester had a chrome or stainless mag tube, where the FN's is blue. I also see the two gas pistons for each weapon are rated differently.

The FN is being sent off to SRM Performance later this week. They "seal" the gas system and install the surecycle recoil system, hopefully reducing the malfunctions.

Give a discription of the jams, might find someone here who knows the fix. Several of the guys I shoot with and I have SLPs. The shell lifter spring gets weak which causes a failure to feed. It can be fixed by replacing it with a couple of Glock springs to increase the tension. That was a problem that I had last year and now it functions perfect.

Doug

[Brian Payne]

At the High Plains Shotgun Challenge, while using Federal low recoil 00Buck and low recoil TruBall slugs, the last three stages I had several jams where the shotgun would fire, eject, and I would click the trigger on an empty chamber. When I racked the bolt I did see the next shell sitting on the lifter. The ejected cases were only a a foot or so away from me. The normal birdshot cases are ejected six or more feet out.

I have also had several times where the shell would be partially fed into the chamber but the bolt would stop about half way to lockup. This has happened with ammo that normally never caused me a problem in the past. The malfunction is cleared by just pulling the bolt back slightly, then letting it go and it slams forward with authority.

I should just break down and shoot the Benelli but I really like the way these shotguns feel and shoot.

I will be picking up the Winchester Practical later today. I see that the Winchester actually has two different versions of the Winchester Practical MK1 (they also have a MKII). One version is an older one that has the 3" chamber and only has one gas piston, the one that I am picking up is the newer version that has the 2 3/4" chamber and has two gas pistons. I will be interested to see what other differences there are between the two weapons.

[Doug H.]

At the High Plains Shotgun Challenge, while using Federal low recoil 00Buck and low recoil TruBall slugs, the last three stages I had several jams where the shotgun would fire, eject, and I would click the trigger on an empty chamber. When I racked the bolt I did see the next shell sitting on the lifter. The ejected cases were only a a foot or so away from me. The normal birdshot cases are ejected six or more feet out.

I have also had several times where the shell would be partially fed into the chamber but the bolt would stop about half way to lockup. This has happened with ammo that normally never caused me a problem in the past. The malfunction is cleared by just pulling the bolt back slightly, then letting it go and it slams forward with authority.

I should just break down and shoot the Benelli but I really like the way these shotguns feel and shoot.

I will be picking up the Winchester Practical later today. I see that the Winchester actually has two different versions of the Winchester Practical MK1 (they also have a MKII). One version is an older one that has the 3" chamber and only has one gas piston, the one that I am picking up is the newer version that has the 2 3/4" chamber and has two gas pistons. I will be interested to see what other differences there are between the two weapons.

I did have something similar on a stage last year at the X3 Championship. Luckily the last flipper malfunctioned and I got a reshoot. Lubed the snot out of the bolt and it ran fine the rest of the match. I very lightly lube where the gas piston rides and try to get all the crap off after each match. I have used the Federal Low Recoil Truball slugs and they run fine in mine. S&B slugs ran good last weekend. Good Luck!

Doug

[jobob]

I don't know. You might try light lube. I've been lubing up my Remies, and have occassional malfs similar to yours. A friend of mine use to be on the national trap circuit and was good enough to be sponsored by Browning. He recently told me that Remies need very light lube. He says VERY light to nearly zero. Guess I'll be trying his method this year.

[Big Bore]

I run mine wet with 10-30 Mobil 1. I lube everything pretty heavy (I used to shoot a Rem.) I only clean the thing maybe 2 or 3 times a year and rarely have any malfunctions. It is a 3" mag 26" duck gun I picked up and added a extended mag tube.

I usually run 1 1/8 3 dram bird shot and lower recoil FED 1 oz. slugs (1300fps). I try to steer away from the real low recoil ammo and stick with something I know will run the gun.

Edited April 1, 2009 by Big Bore

[ken hebert]

I use CLP pretty liberally on the bolt and in the receiver, light sheen on the gas piston. Mine runs like a sewing machine, I've had exactly one malfunction. I run Winchester Super Target 3 dram 1 1/8 oz at 1200 fps and Fiocchi low recoil slugs and #4 buck.

[Brian Payne]

Checking the two guns out, I noticed a few minor differences.

The FN has two gas pistons, one for over 1 1/2 oz loads and one for under 1 1/2 oz loads. The Winchester has two gas pistons, one for over 1 1/4 loads and one for under 1 1/4 loads and low recoil.

The mag tube is identical. Both are blue with the brass ring at the gas port area.

If I hand cycle the FN very slowly, the bolt will stop just shy of lockup and need a nudge to get to full lockup. It has done this since new. With the Winchester, no matter how slowly I hand cycle the bolt, I can't get it to stop before full lockup. Maybe the recoil spring is stronger?

When looking at the shotgun with the loading gate facing up. The FN lift gate sits a little crooked in the receiver and has been this way since new, I assumed it was just the way they are built. The Winchester lift gate sits square in the receiver.

I will ship out my FN today for some work, and shoot the crap out of the Winchester for the next couple of weeks. I will hopefully have two perfectly functioning shotguns prior to the BRM3G.

Ken, what gas piston are you running in yours?

[ken hebert]

The light one, but the Winchester is my primary and the FN is my back up. When i get home tonight wi will compare the two side by side and see if I can notice the differences you speak of. To be honest with you I really don't have that many rounds through the FN, maybe 150 total, but so far so good.

BTW, the loading port mods on the Winchester worked like a charm this past weekend at LaRue, I could even load with gloves on and not "load" the end of my thumb in the tube.

[TXMXRACER]

Let us know how the "surecycle " system works. I might be interested in the mod.

shane

[KalaniLaker]

I grease the bolt/bolt carrier and lightly oil the piston and brass gas ring.

Anybody know a place that I can order a set of stock springs? recoil spring, lifter spring, mag catch spring, and magazine tube spring?

Thanks.

[Big Bore]

I grease the bolt/bolt carrier and lightly oil the piston and brass gas ring.

Anybody know a place that I can order a set of stock springs? recoil spring, lifter spring, mag catch spring, and magazine tube spring?

Thanks.

I believe Brownells has them

[Brian Payne]

Took the new Winchester out to run through its paces. Flawless. Even with the ammo that was causing the FN to malfunction. I fired it canted to the right, left, and upside down, plus one handed, not a burp.

Cleaning the weapon afterwards I noted that the bolt and carrier on the Winchester is very well finished, with no machining marks. The bolt/carrier on the FN looks much rougher. I don't think the FN bolt is so rough it would cause function problems, just more confidence inspiring looking at the Winchester bolt.

Took two hours with the dremel and files on the receiver and forarm to get the loading area big enough, then another hour with the soldering iron to texture the forarm and pistol grip area and Voila', it is ready.

[SA Friday]

Took the new Winchester out to run through its paces. Flawless. Even with the ammo that was causing the FN to malfunction. I fired it canted to the right, left, and upside down, plus one handed, not a burp.

Cleaning the weapon afterwards I noted that the bolt and carrier on the Winchester is very well finished, with no machining marks. The bolt/carrier on the FN looks much rougher. I don't think the FN bolt is so rough it would cause function problems, just more confidence inspiring looking at the Winchester bolt.

Took two hours with the dremel and files on the receiver and forarm to get the loading area big enough, then another hour with the soldering iron to texture the forarm and pistol grip area and Voila', it is ready.

No pics after that kind of description? FOUL! I'm throwing the yellow flag on that one.

[Brian Payne]

If you watched me shoot shotgun you really would not care about any sort of high speed low drag type modifications I make to my weapons. Because they really don't seem to be working all that well. I will try to get photo's in the future though.

[55fmj]

I have running a Winchester practical for the last 2 years and really like it. I clean it after every match and lube the hell out of it, and it has run perfectly. It won't however cyle the really light cheapie target loads. I run the Remington nitro 27's or my equivelent reloads in it to be reliable. Good luck.

[Brian Payne]

55fmj - Is your Winchester Practical the 3" version or the 2 3/4"?

I test fired my Winchester with the same ammo that you use (Remington Nitro 27), I also just picked up a case of Remington ammo. that is one notch higher on the power scale at 1300 fps, 1 1/8 oz. I can't remember what it is called, but it has the same Gold hull.

[Big Bore]

Let us know how the "surecycle " system works. I might be interested in the mod.

shane

I just put one in a month ago and so far it has been running fine. 1 practice session and a local 3 gun with no issues. It seems to cycle faster but it is louder. You can hear the spring and follower pretty well it should break in and quiet down after I get a few more rounds thru it.

[BigCat88]

I purchased the SLP Mk1 this year to start shooting some 3 gun. The High Plains shotgun Challenge was the first event with the gun. I was running all 1300 fps stuff and thought I needed to be running the black ring or "heavy" piston. This only happened to me three times, but it would eject the old shell, and the new one would be started into the chamber sitting on the lift gate. I would just bump the bolt and it would go in. When I got home I email FN and the guy that responded basically told me to ignor the load weight published in the book and run the red ring "light piston" for all 2 3/4" and the black ring "heavy piston" for 3" only. I have since switched to the light piston and it ate 100 rounds of light clay loads without a hicup. My smith has moded the gate so it won't eat my finger, smoothed the loading port and made a custom bolt release assit. I love this gauge! Oh yeah...lightly oil the piston and keep the action wet.

[55fmj]

Brian- Mine is the 2 3/4 version. I have been very happy with it. Like I said, I keep it pretty well oiled up and run the hotter shells with the light piston. I even have a 7 round side saddle and 6 more rounds on the stock and it cycles as long as I use the hotter loads. I have been interested in the sure cycle system, but just haven't been able to spend the money. For now, it works just fine anyway.

[Brian Payne]

Back for a quick update.

Still running 100% with the Winchester Practical, very impressive shotgun.

I got the FN back from SRM Performance. It has run perfectly thus far but I will have to shoot it a bunch more before I will consider it 100% trustworthy again. The job done by SRM was very good. I asked them to send a second recoil system and a second sealed gas piston so that I would have it for the Winchester in case I wanted to make that addition in the future.

Some things of note. The Winchester is 2 3/4" and the FN is 3" but the loading port on both guns is identical in size. The shell lifter on the Winchester sits perfectly in the loading port and when it moves up and down it touches nothing else in the receiver. The FN shell lifter sits a little crooked in the loading port and when it moves up and down it rubs against the bolt release mechanism. I was warned to check for this problem by another FN shooter.

This rubbing or binding is the main cause for the unusual malfunctions I was having. Using the same type of ammo, the weapon would work perfectly for a couple of matches, then have several unexplainable malfunctions that would frustrate the heck out of you. SRM must have noted this also because the area where the shell lifter rubs is now highly polished and the lift gate moves much easier now. SRM also polished numerous other areas in the receiver and on the bolt/carrier. The whole gun feels like it runs much smoother.

SRM said that one of the weak points of this type of weapon was the gas piston spring. The springs can wear and break over time, so they seal the gas piston by taking the spring out and replacing it with an aluminum bushing. The weak link in the system is replaced and now the gas piston does not let gas leak through it, making the weapon more reliable with light loads, and the weapon is easier to clean due to less fouling left under the gas piston. They recommend that their recoil system is used with the sealed piston because the added stress to the stock recoil spring can cause problems. The recoil system has the "light" recoil spring in it. With the surecycle recoil system in place you can also shoot "heavy" loads without damaging anything, even with the sealed piston.

I have a practice match on Sunday where I will be shooting the Winchester and I have "recruited" several other shooters to put the FN through its paces. After a couple of hundred rounds I should have a better idea as to how well the modifications to weapon work.

[blackstone]

Please advise with contact info for SRM Performance and list the specific mod.'s you had performed.

Thank you.

[Brian Payne]

I just got back from shooting a local 3-gun match. I had a friend shoot the FN for me while I shot the Winchester. Both ran without a hitch. I was asked to sell the FN, but not going to happen.

To find the contact information on SRM Performance, just type that into a search engine on the net, or try www.surecycle.com and that should get you there also. They have worked on numerous other 3-gunners weapons and really seem to know what they are doing. I had them do the reliability package on the shotgun, and this included the surecycle recoil system and sealing the gas piston, new mag spring and follower, and polishing numerous areas inside the weapon. Very good work and the weapon runs great so far.

I sent the weapon to them via UPS, they had it one day and sent it back. Great turnaround and great people to talk too.

[RaymondMillbrae]

Hey guys,

seems like I was magnatized to this thread.

I also have a new FN SLP Mk1, and am shooting Rrio Shotshells. (2 3/4, 7.5, 3-dram).

I will attach a video of last weeks practice - which includes some of the jams I have been having.

So far I get FTF, puffs of heavy smoke (weak loads?), and fireballs. (Split hulls)?

Some folks recommended that I go with factory Federal shotshells...which I will be trying the first chance I get.

But I am also considering getting SRM to seal my gas piston. What will something like this cost?

And also, if I seal my piston, will I also need the recoil system they offer?

And very lastly, what was ultimately the cause of the bolt carrier not going fully into battery? You will see this happening to me in my video.

SHOTGUN PRACTICE SESSION

In ChrIst: Raymond

Edited January 11, 2011 by RaymondMillbrae