EricW Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080619/ap_on_...EpSrZNGLaqs0NUE Fraud gets prosecuted. Yes, indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p99shooter Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 A related article: Hundreds swept up in mortgage fraud arrests Good to see some action on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el pres Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 I could not believe it when I read it. Months ago I thought that they got away with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080619/ap_on_...EpSrZNGLaqs0NUEFraud gets prosecuted. Yes, indeed. I can't believe that one of the talking heads on CNBC is defending these guys. Per their comments, "If everyone that lied to an investor was prosecuted, Wall Street would be empty." If so, its time to empty out Wall Street and make investing safe for the little investor. What's the difference between a crooked hedge fund manager and a traveling con artist? Answer: Minimum security prison with golf course privileges versus regular confinement. Way too good for either of them. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMoore Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 (edited) Neither article really says what these folks were doing, and why. Can someone break it down for me? From what I can gather from the little information given, these people were taking mortgages given to people with poor credit (ie: risky investment) and selling the mortgage to a 3rd party, and lying about the details (ie: hiding the level of risk). Is that pretty much what was happening? Edited June 19, 2008 by RobMoore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p99shooter Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 Neither article really says what these folks were doing, and why.Can someone break it down for me? From what I can gather from the little information given, these people were taking mortgages given to people with poor credit (ie: risky investment) and selling the mortgage to a 3rd party, and lying about the details (ie: hiding the level of risk). Is that pretty much what was happening? It's really about NINJA loans - people with no income, no job, no assets. Mortgage brokers find people who really can't afford a home, falsify paperwork and get a loan from a bank under false pretenses. Doesn't the bank that originates the loan do any fact-checking? They don't have to! As soon as the loan goes through it is sold to someone else (thanks to deregulation), and they wash their hands of it. The loan is then traded like a stock. At that point, it's just plain securities fraud; you got a piece of crap stock, yet everyone claims it's the best investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 19, 2008 Author Share Posted June 19, 2008 What they did: - Knowingly made loans they they KNEW would not be paid back - Allowed people to take take out loans for more than the value of a home, then allowing the borrower to simply pocket the change and walk away from the loan. - Booked bad loans as full value assets - Knew that they were in deep doo doo on loan repayments without issuing any warnings, just an "oh my, I left that couple extra billion in my other pair of pants and ran it through the washer." And I'm sure that there's LOTS more.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 Not to mention cashing in a couple of million dollars, while continuing to tout the fund as a terrific investment..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyinBlue Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 It's about time they did something about this situation. These guys got caught but how many sub-humans made millions/billions at the cost of our stable economy during this sub-prime fiasco? Let's not forget George..."Mr Soros, who runs Soros Fund Management, received $2.9 billion" http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/busi...icle3761225.ece Wonder what he's doing with all that $$$...not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 (edited) I was happy to hear about this. If we could get back some of the $15 billion Enron stole from our state we'd be even happier... Every time I hear somebody whining on about how much better it would be if the government just LEFT BIG BUSINESS ALONE..... I remember what they do everytime nobody is watching them. Edited June 20, 2008 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el pres Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 Every time I hear somebody whining on about how much better it would be if the government just LEFT BIG BUSINESS ALONE..... I remember what they do everytime nobody is watching them. 9 Jun 2008 Bountyhunter wrote: Read TopicSocial Security Adminstration I know, they are part of the government so that means (by definition) they are stupid, lazy, and don't give a damn if they do their job right. They completely omitted two years of my earnings from my work history which lowers my benefits. I go downtown to the federal building to get it straightened out.... and have to park on the street (two hour maximum at a meter). So I walk to the building and find: They have new security "procedures": everybody has to empty their pockets, answer questions, they run you on the computer, etc.... and of course, only ONE GUY is doing this while eight other guys stand there and watch. So, a long line was there just to enter the stupid BUILDING.... there's 45 minutes I'll never get back. So, I finally get in and head upstairs and find: about 75 people all waiting to get served at the ONE WINDOW that is open.... and these were clearly "immigration related issues". Didn't hear a word of Engish except for the profanity running through my mind. So, I waited until the expiring meter forced me to leave. What a waste of my life. That is a great reason to keep the Goverment out of big (our) business !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMoore Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 I think there is a big difference between wanting the government to protect us against fraud, and wanting them to regulate every aspect of private business. Leaving business alone doesn't mean letting them decieve and rob people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 20, 2008 Author Share Posted June 20, 2008 Closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 Well it's not like they were running a "widows and orphans fund at Bear Sterns. The Bozo's ran a "hedge fund' (far less govt regulation on hedge funds that on other funds) where the expectation is such that their clients ($ 1,000,000.00 minimum investment, not may widiows and orphans have that kind of disposeable scratch to shell out) were "educated' investors. Guess not. This may or may not be criminal in nature as the SEC does routinely investigate these types incidents/behavior and access civil penalties (fines, permenant loss of license, suspension of license). Looks like it could be a which hunt for the Feds to appear like they are doing something...anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walangkatapat Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 What they did:- Knowingly made loans they they KNEW would not be paid back - Allowed people to take take out loans for more than the value of a home, then allowing the borrower to simply pocket the change and walk away from the loan. - Booked bad loans as full value assets - Knew that they were in deep doo doo on loan repayments without issuing any warnings, just an "oh my, I left that couple extra billion in my other pair of pants and ran it through the washer." And I'm sure that there's LOTS more.... Are these the same people that took out the loans knowing they couldn't afford it and now the government is going to bail them out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el pres Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 (edited) What they did:- Knowingly made loans they they KNEW would not be paid back - Allowed people to take take out loans for more than the value of a home, then allowing the borrower to simply pocket the change and walk away from the loan. - Booked bad loans as full value assets - Knew that they were in deep doo doo on loan repayments without issuing any warnings, just an "oh my, I left that couple extra billion in my other pair of pants and ran it through the washer." And I'm sure that there's LOTS more.... Are these the same people that took out the loans knowing they couldn't afford it and now the government is going to bail them out? Yes... As for regulation, the government just needs to do it's job and enforce existing laws and not set up another regulatory commitee that sits around discussing what they "should" do... The problem is they do nothing until there is a real big problem, attention to the issue. Now they are going to do something about it and show us how much they do for us. When a few low end investors were loseing their shirts while they were in the Bahamas on a paid vacation they turned the other way.... Overreaction is never the answer, accountablity is, everybody knew this was going on 2-3 years ago and the consensus was, that is just how that works, shut-up, everybody's makeing out. Nobody questioned it until "thier" seats were on the block !!! Ahhh, whatever I hope they all burn in hell.... Edited June 20, 2008 by DIRTY CHAMBER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viggen Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 It's just prosecution season and the political class needs scapegoats. Right now these folks are handy. As they railroad this bunch(who likely deserve everything they get anyway), they should also go after the liars who signed for the loans , and how about getting Bernanke and Greenspan to do the perp walk as well, for their leading roles in destroying the dollar and the economy. It's just a feel good measure for the evening news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 (edited) What they did:- Knowingly made loans they they KNEW would not be paid back - Allowed people to take take out loans for more than the value of a home, then allowing the borrower to simply pocket the change and walk away from the loan. - Booked bad loans as full value assets - Knew that they were in deep doo doo on loan repayments without issuing any warnings, just an "oh my, I left that couple extra billion in my other pair of pants and ran it through the washer." And I'm sure that there's LOTS more.... Are these the same people that took out the loans knowing they couldn't afford it and now the government is going to bail them out? No, these are people who glowingly recommended these garbage funds filled with paper they knew was going bad to unknowing investors as they pulled their money out before it all burned down. It was fraud, fueled by greed and arrogance. They thought they would be able to talk their way out of it... and they may well do that, the trials aren't done yet. Edited June 21, 2008 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 how about getting Bernanke and Greenspan to do the perp walk as well, for their leading roles in destroying the dollar and the economy. can't argue with that. The Fed had been underpricing the dollar for decades and it is coming home to roost. In 1980 the country embarked on tha "deficits don't matter" fiscal policies and found they could live high on the hog on cheap money for everybody until the bills came due. They are now due.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 What they did:- Knowingly made loans they they KNEW would not be paid back - Allowed people to take take out loans for more than the value of a home, then allowing the borrower to simply pocket the change and walk away from the loan. - Booked bad loans as full value assets - Knew that they were in deep doo doo on loan repayments without issuing any warnings, just an "oh my, I left that couple extra billion in my other pair of pants and ran it through the washer." And I'm sure that there's LOTS more.... Are these the same people that took out the loans knowing they couldn't afford it and now the government is going to bail them out? Yes... As for regulation, the government just needs to do it's job and enforce existing laws and not set up another regulatory commitee that sits around discussing what they "should" do... The problem is they do nothing until there is a real big problem, attention to the issue. Now they are going to do something about it and show us how much they do for us. When a few low end investors were loseing their shirts while they were in the Bahamas on a paid vacation they turned the other way.... Overreaction is never the answer, accountablity is, everybody knew this was going on 2-3 years ago and the consensus was, that is just how that works, shut-up, everybody's makeing out. Nobody questioned it until "thier" seats were on the block !!! Ahhh, whatever I hope they all burn in hell.... Pretty accurate.... nobody wanted to be the one to scream the sky is falling, they would rather hope that a miracle would occur and it would all turn around. And there's no doubt congress' sudden infusion of courage to action is because it's an election year and they need to do some posturing.... I guess we should just be happy that will result in some crooks going to jail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 21, 2008 Author Share Posted June 21, 2008 Guys, Go trash on "Big Gubmint" in your own thread. This is "WHAT I LIKE" in case anyone missed it. Frankly, never in my wildest dreams did I think ANYONE would ever get prosecuted for this mess. I'm happy that the accountability process is underway. The American system of justice is far from perfect, but I vastly prefer it to nothing at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 (edited) Every time I hear somebody whining on about how much better it would be if the government just LEFT BIG BUSINESS ALONE..... I remember what they do everytime nobody is watching them. 9 Jun 2008 Bountyhunter wrote: Read TopicSocial Security Adminstration I know, they are part of the government so that means (by definition) they are stupid, lazy, and don't give a damn if they do their job right. They completely omitted two years of my earnings from my work history which lowers my benefits. I go downtown to the federal building to get it straightened out.... and have to park on the street (two hour maximum at a meter). So I walk to the building and find: They have new security "procedures": everybody has to empty their pockets, answer questions, they run you on the computer, etc.... and of course, only ONE GUY is doing this while eight other guys stand there and watch. So, a long line was there just to enter the stupid BUILDING.... there's 45 minutes I'll never get back. So, I finally get in and head upstairs and find: about 75 people all waiting to get served at the ONE WINDOW that is open.... and these were clearly "immigration related issues". Didn't hear a word of Engish except for the profanity running through my mind. So, I waited until the expiring meter forced me to leave. What a waste of my life. That is a great reason to keep the Goverment out of big (our) business !!! I don't think the fact the government seems to be incapable of hiring a competent employee into any position really relates to the thread topic, which is that greedy bastards will always sink to their lowest base greed levels when they think they will get away with it..... and the recent admin's policies of obstructing any and all enforcement aimed at Big Business certainly fostered that climate of arrogance IMHO. We need to turn it around: enforce the laws we have vigorously and create new ones in response to the scams being done by major investment banks like the one setting up a "foreign" investment company in London which is actually in the US but avoids all oversight laws by having a London mailing address.... and those scammers are the speculatrors engaging in illegal manipulation of oil futures. Notice the $140/barrel prices? they are artificially driving that price up and they must be slammed hard for it. Edited June 21, 2008 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 21, 2008 Author Share Posted June 21, 2008 Guys,Go trash on "Big Gubmint" in your own thread. This is "WHAT I LIKE" in case anyone missed it. Frankly, never in my wildest dreams did I think ANYONE would ever get prosecuted for this mess. I'm happy that the accountability process is underway. The American system of justice is far from perfect, but I vastly prefer it to nothing at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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