Buyer Beware - HP/Compaq

[ButchW]

I have had a computer business for 22 years and I even thought this was more evil than most...

First of all HP does not exist except in name. Compaq Chinaman makes all HP/Comqaq.

A customer brought in the kid's computer. An HP Pavillion a1467a. It was doing the common XP Home Edition crash... starts then reboots.

Been here done this a few hundred times.

Opened up computer to remove hard drive attempt to scan for virus or spyware infection with my special created computer just for that purpose in the shop.

Picked out usual Phillips Head screw driver and started taking things apart. Wow, I have a Phillip Head screw driver. Compaq / HP don't use Phillips Head screws they use Japanese metric torques. REFURB computer!!!

Been here a few hundred times since I have a Staples, Circuit City and Sam's Club close by.

Now have the hard drive out and it can not be read in another computer... Compaq uses a strange format on the hard drives that keeps the hard drive or other Compaq parts from being replaced standard parts. It's a Yugo and not a GM.

Been down this road a few times.

Try hard drive in server... still can't read the information on the hard drive.

The lady has now lost every family picture, resumes, email, Paid For downloaded music, etc.

Do the restore on the computer (by chance it worked and didn't have the usual battle with Compaq to buy restore CD's)

Now it starts up, reboots. Starts up, reboots. NO safe mode either.

Call the lady ask how long has she owned this REFURB computer? "It only had 9 months warranty and it is about a year old."

Been down this road a few thousand times.

NOW THE REAL PROBLEM....

It is a Compaq with a Compaq version of Windows XP. NO real Microsoft Serial number (COA), NO real Microsoft CD. Not even a Compaq Windows CD. The computer needs a new motherboard and a New Microsoft Windows XP. Maybe a new hard drive; since there has been no way to actually test it thanks to the Compaq special format.

End of story... Lady buys a custom built computer from us for the kids.

Buyer beware...

The new parts needed to build a new computer are more than $600 my cost and my company buys at the $800,000 per year price margin. (That is 2% over what it costs directly from the Chinamen.) I guarantee Compaq makes more than $12 per PC.

Now I have a HP to take out to the range to add to the Dells for target practice. Cool for me. Bad for anyone who didn't know.

Butch

P.S. Dell's don't have real Microsoft COA or real Microsoft CD's either. Only custom built computers from reputable businesses have real Microsoft CDs & COA.

[Flatland Shooter]

Butch,

Thanks for the info.

Your post is quite timely. I'm replacing an older Compaq with a new machine. Some of my software is not compatible with Vista and per the suppliers, never will. (Small market niche specialty software.)

The only machines currently available with XP seem to be "business sales" of Compaq/HP. Another alternative is blow away Vista and buy MS XP Pro separately, but I'm not that comfortable doing that either.

Guess I'll keep looking.

Bill

[chuckbradley]

YOu make me feel good about my decision Butch. Needed a new work computer for a new employee. Nothing fancy. I thought about just buying a dell or HP/Compaq instead of having my son build a custom one. He built the one I am typing on and it hasnt crashed once since he finished it. Of course he had a few issues building as seen on another thread on this list where several came to his aid.

Austin talked me out of it. Got all the parts to build a new work computer for 700.00. Including flat screen monitor. 160g HD, 1G ram, 1.8 duo processor, dvd/cd burner, wireless mouse & keyboard.

I also hate the proprietary crap these manufacturers put on their computers. I dont want preloaded software. Just what I want and need.

Custom built is the way to go. Sort of like the guns we shoot.

Edited June 23, 2007 by chuckbradley

[raz-0]

OK, I don't know what the hell you are tlaking about, as a lot of what you are saying doesn't jibe with reality.

First off, slurring "chinamen" is pretty lame and borderline racist. You can argue the sensibility of buying stuff from china with regards to domestic economics, but you can get perfectly well made items from china. If it is cheap crap, it's because the US or multi-national company specced it that way.

Second, the computers YOU build are built with parts that are made in china, vietnam, the phillipines, etc just as much as any brand. I challenge you to show me ANY made in the USA computer. HEck, I challenge you to build a system that simply doesn't include a chinese part. You can't. How is your use of chinese parts somehow more ethically or morally correct than some other US businesses other than it puts a buck in your pocket rather than theirs?

Third, Dell will indeed ship you a restore CD that is a slipstreamed version of whatever MS OS you chose with all patches and product specific drivers rolle dup in it. You simply have to check the right box while ordering your machine. I have one form the Dell laptop I bought for myself (via dell home & home office), but also at my job we have several 10 gallon bins full of the DELL CDs that came with the DELL PCs purchased for the student labs. Sure, it isn't a microsoft pressed disc, but it is indeed a vlaid, licensed copy of windows that will install onto the hardware you purchased. However, if you don't have it, and have to argue with the vendor to get one when doing repairs, that really isn't the fault of the vendor, but rather the fault of the computer owner. If they DID shipa genuine MS pressed disc, you could be GUARANTEED microsoft wouldn't send you anything when you told them you lost it without paying a fee and providing proof of purchase. I suspect this would fall under your definituion of "arguing" with them just as much as with any OEM.

Fourth, EACH and EVERY dell I have EVER seen through multiple jobs, doing freelance in-home setups and repairs, and personal purchases has had a valid and genuine MS COA. Same with the several hundred HP machines we purchased. IF HP and Dell were selling machines without COA, it would be blatant piracy, and a SEVERELY doubt that Microsoft would put up tih it. This verges on slander/libel/defamation depending on how you want to interpret discussion on an electronic forum, and is probably likely a large part of why Brian says no vendor bashin as part of forum policy. I can't count the number of times I have seen custom built computers form the local computer shops with pirated MS OSes on them. I have NEVER run into an HP or DELL without the appropriate MS sourced labeling.

Fifth, how can you assemble/repair computers to the tune of $800k a year and not own a complete set of torx bits? Heck, I can get a nice set with a T7 bit in it for less than $75. A set with bits not meant to deal with automobiles is less than $10.

Sixth, HP does indeed exist in more than name. They purchased compaq. Second, they indeed do have offices, sales staff, support staff. Lots of it is even domestic if you happen to be dealing with large volume business purchases or their servers. I suspect their 128 processor servers are not assembled in china, and I'm pretty sure the on-site service guys for their x86 and unix servers aren't flown in from china. Especially the white guys who live within driving distance.

Seventh, HP A1467A is not a part/model number of a HP computer as far as I can tell. It's listed as a VMEbus expander sold by HP for their enterprise systems.

Eighth, there's nothing wrong with a refurb computer unless it is sold as new.

Ninth, "Compaq uses a strange format on the hard drives that keeps the hard drive or other Compaq parts from being replaced standard parts." UH.. so you are saying microsoft granted compaq access to the kernel level source code of whatever MS OS came on there so they could code in support for a new file system? I have yet to see MS OS support for ANYTHING except NTFS, FAT16, and FAT32. Heck, they don't even have a read only mode for NTFS volumes. Even the absolute nadir of what I will begrudgingly refer to as computers, the packard bell, still used standard filesystems.

Tenth, the lady did not lose all her precious data because HP did something wrong. Hard drives are usually specced as having a MTBF of about 5 years. However, lots of the manufacturers are only doing 1-3 year warranties. On top of that, google put out a real nice whitepaper about actual real world disk failure rates. It's absurdly high and nowhere NEAR the MTBF. It's her data, it's her job to back it up or accept the consequences, same as you or me. HP doesn't make hard drives and can only buy the exact same disks you or I could.. they just get bulk discounts and special part numbers as well as a different support model than we do. About the only thing you can blame the OEMs for their is if they do not give you a choice other than an on-disk recovery partition. IF they want $10 for the recovery CD PAY IT. It is worth every penny.

[ima45dv8]

As has been stated many times, and quite a few recently, customer service issues don't belong here.