5Shot Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 I notice that if I do a Bill Drill during dry fire practice that the gun is moving all over the place. Definitely milking the gun. If I go slow - not a problem. Doesn't seem to matter how much I relax - those other fingers just want to move right along with the trigger finger at high speed. Any ideas on ways to improve the situation, or is just something to be aware of and it will slowly go away? Thanks, 5Shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FranDoc Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 I used to do a dry-fire exercise for this -- seated, gun in strong hand only, gun resting upright on lap, practice pressing ONLY with the trigger finger, holding the rest of the fingers absolutely still. I've also seen people measure the distance between the trigger & the back strap, then cut a piece of small tubing or a pencil to about the same length. Put one end of the tubing against the web between thumb & index finger, press on the other end with your index finger as if pressing the trigger. Simulates trigger press, but that's something you can do when you're in a place that doesn't permit you to have the gun present (office, etc). Isolation of the trigger finger is a learned skill -- you're retraining your hand to do something contrary to the way your neuro-muscular system is 'wired'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted March 24, 2007 Share Posted March 24, 2007 It sounds ridiculously simple, but one of the best things you can do is simply hold your hand up in front of your face, fingers curved as if wrapped around a gun, and move your index finger back and forth like you're pulling a trigger. At this point, watch your other three fingers. Do that until you see no movement in anything other than the index finger. You didn't say what kind of gun you're shooting. If it's a "short trigger movement" gun like a Glock, 1911, etc., bear in mind you don't have to move your entire index finger to fire the gun. Actually only the first two joints move, everything from the second knuckle back stays absolutely immobile. I'd suggest lots of dry fire focusing on prepping the trigger before breaking the shot. Like, if your gun has a four pound trigger pull you should have 3-1/2 pounds of pressure on the trigger. That in effect turns the gun into a super-target pistol with a 1/2 pound trigger pull. That's all the energy you're applying to fire the gun that could possibly pull it off target. Begin practicing by taking up the slack in the trigger action until you hit the "link" resistance point, then prep the trigger with almost enough energy to fire the gun but not quite, then apply that last little bit of energy to fire the gun. Hold the trigger to the rear while you hand cycle the gun to reset the trigger. Slowly let the trigger forward until you feel the trigger reset. If you're firing a Glock or 1911, at that point there will be no slack to re-uptake since the "link" point is in the same place going both forward and back with no re-uptake travel. Then you're back to doing the same thing again: prep the trigger, fire the shot, hold the trigger to the rear, cycle the action, hit the link..... Do that several thousand times to get it into your mind and your muscle memory where the link is, what it feels like to hit it, and how hard you can prep the trigger without actually firing the gun. Eventually, in both dry and live fire, you want to start making the time interval you hold the trigger to the rear shorter and shorter. Eventually you'll get to the point you've got the trigger reset and prepped while the gun's still in recoil. If you can do that, and get the gun tracking consistently so it comes right back to the same point every time - a completely different topic - you can fire the gun as fast as it comes down out of recoil and still be accurate. Hope that helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Shot Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 (edited) Thanks for the tips - I will keep at it. I don't have any trouble with trigger control on slow paced shooting - I have done lots of Benchrest Type shooting at paper and varmints and lots of target shooting with single action revaolvers and autos. The biggest problem is with rapid finger movements (as in the example of the Bill Drill) - then it all goes to hell. The pistol in question is an XD with a Canyon Creek 2-1/2 lb Trigger Job, so that isn't the culprit either, since it has almost no take-up or ever travel and breaks really crisp. Back to the Dry Fire Range for me 5Shot Edited March 25, 2007 by 5Shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazos SC Shooter Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Depending on your front sight and gun type this is a great one. Lay a dime on your front sight. Pull the trigger over and over trying to keep the front sight so still the dime does not fall off. I have a production gun with DA/SA so I can do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Shot Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 Depending on your front sight and gun type this is a great one.Lay a dime on your front sight. Pull the trigger over and over trying to keep the front sight so still the dime does not fall off. I have a production gun with DA/SA so I can do this. I can accomplish this with a slow trigger pull - I will have to see if trying it at greater speed results in any improvments. 5Shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
short_round Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 Any Exercises For Isolating Trigger Finger Movement? Shoot a revolver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I don't have any trouble with trigger control on slow paced shooting....The biggest problem is with rapid finger movements (as in the example of the Bill Drill) - then it all goes to hell. When most people begin shooting "fast" - no offense intended - what that really means is they just start yanking the trigger really hard. In the overall scheme of things, this is not really that fast, and all that excess energy moves the gun all over the place so it's not very accurate either. It's important to realize that we don't really pull the trigger any differently when we're firing the gun fast as we do when we're firing slowly. We just perform the exact same technique in a shorter period of time. The key here, as in so much of shooting, is efficient use of "dead time" - i.e. the time period that most people, whether they realize it or not, don't do anything while shooting. In this case, we use the time interval the gun is elevated in recoil, when we can't fire it, to reset the trigger and prep it so that, by the time it comes down out of recoil and realigns, we've already accomplished everything needed to fire the gun except that last little bit of pressure necessary to break the shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosshooting Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I use grips squeezer tool. Squeeze the grip of your strong hand except index finger. Hold it tight and move your index finger just like pulling the trigger. Pay attention not to change the pressure of your grip wile doing that! Another option is to squeeze and relax the grip simultaneously wile pointing index finger straight. Pay attention not to move it at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted March 25, 2007 Share Posted March 25, 2007 I'm guessing that you might be doing about 75% of your gripping with the strong hand? Certainly gripping more/harder with the strong hand than the weak? I'd suggest flip-floppin that ratio. Do most of the gripping with the weak hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Shot Posted March 25, 2007 Author Share Posted March 25, 2007 I have been trying to keep most of the gripping preasure with the weak hand - I will concentrate on that during my next dry fire practice to see if I am achieving the correct ratio. 5Shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyinBlue Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 The way I was taught was to hold/squeeze a tennis ball in my strong hand with only the 3 bottom fingers and thumb...then move the trigger finger independantly. This exercise will train the trigger finger to operate on its own. It helped me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandhu Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 I've had great luck with grip trainers that allow you to use the fingers individually, like the Grip Master. My all time favorite would have to be the donut. Compress the donut with all the finger except the trigger finger and attempt to move the trigger finger in a "clean" motion with the donut compressed. In addition I picked up a work out from Matt Burkett's Practical Shooting Radio that has worked extremely well for me. It's described here. http://teppoudo.org/8-grip-pressure Hope this helps. Cheers, Achint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 I've used a piece of foam rubber cut out in the shape of a gun. Make sure to leave a trigger on it. If you don't pull the trigger straight back it will squish the gun to the side and turn the barrel to the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frenchwrench Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 Iv'e had great return from the Gripmaster in medium and hard grip levels. Great for use at work where the 35 would cause screaming panic...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 sandhu, In addition I picked up a work out from Matt Burkett's Practical Shooting Radio that has worked extremely well for me. It's described here.http://teppoudo.org/8-grip-pressure I found this absolutely fascinating, and I'll be experimenting with it while lifting weights myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSEMARTIN Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 (edited) I found this absolutely fascinating So did I. In fact, I believe my success in shooting is in large part due to my ability to separate what my trigger finger is doing from the rest of my body. A (controlled) .09 second split time would be otherwise impossible. Edited May 30, 2007 by CSEMARTIN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 You animal. Seriously, that's pretty impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSEMARTIN Posted May 31, 2007 Share Posted May 31, 2007 You animal. I guess a little mockery is in order after the statement I made. I wasn't trying to brag. I just think most people don't place enough emphasis on trigger control. A 0.13 - 0.15 second split in a match with good hits is plenty fast on close targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverback Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 I've had great luck with grip trainers that allow you to use the fingers individually, like the Grip Master. +1 on the gripmaster. Grip tight with lower three fingers, leaving trigger finger loose and thumb parallel to floor, then squeeze in trigger finger as if pulling trigger. try not to flex thumb or move wrist. hold for ten seconds and repeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Do you have a .22? Ammo is cheap... SA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandhu Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 (edited) Do you have a .22? Ammo is cheap...SA They frown on that at work. Especially in the Great Frozen North (Canada) The nice thing about the trainers is that there are a couple sitting on the desk at work and I can grab them whenever I have time, or am on a call etc. Cheers, Achint Edited June 12, 2007 by sandhu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rennie Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 I've had great luck with grip trainers that allow you to use the fingers individually, like the Grip Master. I have one of these that has a top piece with a set of sights.That way you can see how much your hand moves when squeezing your trigger finger.Before you ask...no I don't remember where I got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 I guess a little mockery is in order after the statement I made. It wasn't intended to be mockey, just friendly teasing. It's all good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Shot Posted June 13, 2007 Author Share Posted June 13, 2007 (edited) Do you have a .22? Ammo is cheap...SA Yeah, but I was looking for something I could do around the house or at work as well. I am working 2 jobs right now, trying to get my own business rolling, so I don't have as much time as I would like to get to the range. I think I might try a Grip Master, but I definitely enjoy shooting too, so more shooting is definitely in my plans. Thanks to all for their suggestions. 5Shot Edited June 13, 2007 by 5Shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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