Sight Picture Rule Clarification

[JThompson]

---snip ---

Some people tool around with their mags or whatnot. Thats no different then taking a couple of extra sight pictures. As long as you don't take to long, I don't care if you take 3 sight pictures or whatever you need.

"Toolling around with there mags or whatnot" is a no-no! 8.7.4 Air gunning only!

Not so Chuck... the rule is now 8.7.2 and you can use a mag if ya like... you just can't use a gun or replica.

I was right in May 2006!

It was good to see them loose "any part of a real firearm including any accessories thereof etc."

At the 2006 A5 match I was doing a walk through while wiping sweat from my forehead with a bandana and the RO asked me if that was a "sighting aid"? I guess he could of called it. It is more reasonable now...

Later,

Chuck

You were right Chuck Just a little dated like me. I've been through the rules front to back lately, so it was fresh in my mind.

From waht I hear, it got out of control with replicas and even airsoft... to the point RO were wondering just what someone was using.. could it be real? You see some of those airsofts and you can't tell. The BOD over reacted a bit imo. The new rule makes sense. I learned with my finger gun, so I shall continue to go that way.

Don't blame the BOD for that one. I am pretty sure it had it's orgins in IPSC, not USPSA. The BOD just never wrote a "US" rule to override it. Until now, that is

Okay then... whoever wrote it over reacted.

[ChuckS]

Okay then... whoever wrote it over reacted.

No problem! It's just that the BOD has been getting way too much crap lately on other subjects and I hate to see them diss's for something that were given! <InstantThreadDrift>You goin to A5?</InstantThreadDrift>

Later,

Chuck

[JThompson]

Okay then... whoever wrote it over reacted.

No problem! It's just that the BOD has been getting way too much crap lately on other subjects and I hate to see them diss's for something that were given! <InstantThreadDrift>You goin to A5?</InstantThreadDrift>

Later,

Chuck

I'm going to do my damn best to be there. You going? PM me so we don't drift this one to much.

Edited March 6, 2008 by JThompson

[galt11]

The one conflict I noticed while reading the new rules was 8.3.1.1 says "Once the “Make Ready” command has been given, the competitor must not move away from the start location prior to issuance of the “Start Signal” without the prior approval, and under the direct supervision, of the Range Officer."

Now If I were to ask the RO if I could take a sight picture from a position one step away fromt eh make ready position and was granted permission, the way I read 8.7.1 , I would be in violation of that rule."A competitor is permitted to take a sight picture prior to the start signal.

Such sight picture is only permitted from the “Make Ready” location."

It seems like a catch 22 since you are following the RO's directions and under their supervision.

Adam

[JThompson]

The one conflict I noticed while reading the new rules was 8.3.1.1 says "Once the “Make Ready” command has been given, the competitor must not move away from the start location prior to issuance of the “Start Signal” without the prior approval, and under the direct supervision, of the Range Officer."

Now If I were to ask the RO if I could take a sight picture from a position one step away fromt eh make ready position and was granted permission, the way I read 8.7.1 , I would be in violation of that rule."A competitor is permitted to take a sight picture prior to the start signal.

Such sight picture is only permitted from the “Make Ready” location."

It seems like a catch 22 since you are following the RO's directions and under their supervision.

Adam

I'm not getting your point.

[ChuckS]

The one conflict I noticed while reading the new rules was 8.3.1.1 says "Once the “Make Ready” command has been given, the competitor must not move away from the start location prior to issuance of the “Start Signal” without the prior approval, and under the direct supervision, of the Range Officer."

Now If I were to ask the RO if I could take a sight picture from a position one step away fromt eh make ready position and was granted permission, the way I read 8.7.1 , I would be in violation of that rule."A competitor is permitted to take a sight picture prior to the start signal.

Such sight picture is only permitted from the “Make Ready” location."

It seems like a catch 22 since you are following the RO's directions and under their supervision.

Adam

No catch 22. The RO can give you permission to move from the start position but the RO can not give you permission to take a sight picture from somewhere other than the start position.

[Nik Habicht]

The one conflict I noticed while reading the new rules was 8.3.1.1 says "Once the “Make Ready” command has been given, the competitor must not move away from the start location prior to issuance of the “Start Signal” without the prior approval, and under the direct supervision, of the Range Officer."

Now If I were to ask the RO if I could take a sight picture from a position one step away fromt eh make ready position and was granted permission, the way I read 8.7.1 , I would be in violation of that rule."A competitor is permitted to take a sight picture prior to the start signal.

Such sight picture is only permitted from the “Make Ready” location."

It seems like a catch 22 since you are following the RO's directions and under their supervision.

Adam

No catch 22. The RO can give you permission to move from the start position but the RO can not give you permission to take a sight picture from somewhere other than the start position.

The "may not move from the start position" was written to prevent stuff like competitors who are already hot, walking away to grab another mag, different glasses, etc.

[JThompson]

The one conflict I noticed while reading the new rules was 8.3.1.1 says "Once the “Make Ready” command has been given, the competitor must not move away from the start location prior to issuance of the “Start Signal” without the prior approval, and under the direct supervision, of the Range Officer."

Now If I were to ask the RO if I could take a sight picture from a position one step away fromt eh make ready position and was granted permission, the way I read 8.7.1 , I would be in violation of that rule."A competitor is permitted to take a sight picture prior to the start signal.

Such sight picture is only permitted from the “Make Ready” location."

It seems like a catch 22 since you are following the RO's directions and under their supervision.

Adam

No catch 22. The RO can give you permission to move from the start position but the RO can not give you permission to take a sight picture from somewhere other than the start position.

The "may not move from the start position" was written to prevent stuff like competitors who are already hot, walking away to grab another mag, different glasses, etc.

Also, I was told, to keep guys from running the COF for the sight picture. Pull the gun run through the COF and come back and start.

Edited March 7, 2008 by JThompson

[AlamoShooter]

I don't like a start position up against a wall that I can not see down range to load my gun, I prefer to move to the side of the wall so I can see the back stop -load and move back to the start. I am getting used to it but I don't like it.

When I do check my dot I like to do it on an appropriate background & in both directions from the sun, I like to but I don't normally do it just out of being self conscious to "what will they think"

Some shooters do take 10 times as much time as others to "Make Ready" and everyone is not going to start taking that long just because a few shooters take that long. That part is a very small part of the overall match time. And so long as they do their part to help 180seconds is not that long, over a five stage match the slowest guy spent 11 minutes longer that the feasts guy.

A great training tool is to video the stages - start the tape just before the "Make Ready" use it to learn what part of the pre shoot was good and what part was too short.

You may find that your own set-up could use some improvement.

A side note that may help some with perspective is for Steel Challenge stages, I have shot every stage 100s of times, and I know that 2 tenths of a second is a big loss for just five targets. & I take close to 60 seconds to get ready for a stage and 20-30 seconds between runs, depending on how the last run went.

For me a stage and an IPSC stage is like "Winding a Clock" if you crank on the spring to hard you can break it.

Most matches the guy that takes the longest to get ready is allso doing 1/2 of the Ro work.

[Gary Stevens]

As with all rules, we always hope that an element of common sense is applied to them, while maintaining the integrity of the rule.

I read the rule to allow sight pictures on as many targets as they wish from the start position. That is normally limited in number in most stages. In addition, I would not get my drawers in a wad if the shooter took a half step or a step in a particular direction while they were doing their sight picture. As has been stated before the purpose was to keep the shooter from running around taking sight pictures on every target on the stage, or at least a substantial number of them.

Remember when given the command "Make ready" that course has began. Since we do not prohibit a loaded sight picture, the shooter could be moving around the stage with a loaded gun if so allowed.

To paraphrase Chester Nimitz, common sense is sometimes an uncommon virture. This is a situation we are constantly aware of and addressing through training.

Gary

[JThompson]

As with all rules, we always hope that an element of common sense is applied to them, while maintaining the integrity of the rule.

I read the rule to allow sight pictures on as many targets as they wish from the start position. That is normally limited in number in most stages. In addition, I would not get my drawers in a wad if the shooter took a half step or a step in a particular direction while they were doing their sight picture. As has been stated before the purpose was to keep the shooter from running around taking sight pictures on every target on the stage, or at least a substantial number of them.

Remember when given the command "Make ready" that course has began. Since we do not prohibit a loaded sight picture, the shooter could be moving around the stage with a loaded gun if so allowed.

To paraphrase Chester Nimitz, common sense is sometimes an uncommon virture. This is a situation we are constantly aware of and addressing through training.

Gary

What he said.