A Question About New K-22's...

[mikey357]

I've got a new-to-me ( purchased "Gently-used"...) fairly recent-production Model 617-6 with the ten-shot cylinder...locks up well, and even has a decent DA trigger...

HOWEVER, it has NOT been 100% reliable...with ANY ammo I've tried...I get between 2 and 4% misfires with "WallyWorld" bulk-pack, and between 1-2% M-F's with CCI "Mini-Mags",so...

I've looked it over pretty closely...it APPEARS that the mainspring tension screw MAY BE a lil' shorter--.015 in. or so--than any of my other, recent-production Smiths...also, the firing pin protrusion seems rather anemic to me...would the "C&S" Extended firing pin work in a K-22???...TIA....mikey357

[HSMITH]

Mike, take a spent primer cup and put it on the strainscrew, in between the spring and the screw. Try that, if it helps it probably isn't the firing pin. If it helps odds are that someone filed the strainscrew down in a kitchen table fit of attempted gunsmithing. It could also be a reduced power firing pin spring. If it doesn't help send it back to S&W, they will look at it and fix anything wrong with it free, and send it back free. If you call them first they will probably send you a shipping tag that covers the shipping to them too. If it isn't spring tension you get into all sorts of stuff, like headspace, endshake, and so on. If S&W will fix it free there is no need to get your education on a 22. They are the hardest to set up and get running correctly IMO.

22 firing pins are different than certerfire firing pins.

[AlamoShooter]

It is most likely the amoe. a rimfire primer is not somthing that will always work after it is hit once or twice after two or three hits it 'probably' will not fire.

I do a team event that uses ALOT of rimfire amoe. The stuff is just not that good

I would blame the amoe first.

Put some fired 22 empty casses in the gun and rehit them and you will get a new fire pin/ striker mark on the empty case = it will tell you just how hard the strike is.

When the gun fires on a live round you get some movment in the case, and a spent cass may not tell you all the news.

[J.Bagakis]

I've got a new-to-me ( purchased "Gently-used"...) fairly recent-production Model 617-6 with the ten-shot cylinder...locks up well, and even has a decent DA trigger...

HOWEVER, it has NOT been 100% reliable...with ANY ammo I've tried...I get between 2 and 4% misfires with "WallyWorld" bulk-pack, and between 1-2% M-F's with CCI "Mini-Mags",so...

I've looked it over pretty closely...it APPEARS that the mainspring tension screw MAY BE a lil' shorter--.015 in. or so--than any of my other, recent-production Smiths...also, the firing pin protrusion seems rather anemic to me...would the "C&S" Extended firing pin work in a K-22???...TIA....mikey357

Mikey, Jason Pettitt and I have used our ten shot 617 for the Rimfire pistol event at the Steel Challenge for many years with good results.

Those revolvers need almost a totally stock main spring to be reliable. I bobbed the hammer on mine and it would only light off about 5 out of 10 rounds per cylinder.

I installed an exstended firing pin, it did not help even after replacing the hammer, and the longer firing pin will hit your cylinder if you dry-fire the revolver.

Good ammo is the key with these revolvers, I have used Wolf in my rifles, it is great ammo very reliable and very accurate. Wolf is hard to get out of the cylinder of my revolver for some reason, CCI Mini Mags work well but you need to have a full power main spring. I have also had good luck with the Walmart bulk pack Federal rounds.

Remington has been easier to light off, but very inconsistent. I have opened up many mis-fired Remington .22Lr rounds to find the priming compound did not go all the way around the case rim.

Good Luck!

[mikey357]

Thanks, everybody who has replied so far...John, when you got your "Ten-shooter" running WELL, what level of misfires did you have to put up with??? I ask this because I have an older 17-6--alas, only a SIX-shooter--that was "Tuned" by Lou Ciamillo of "MGW"...one of the old-time PPC gun builders...and it will misfire about one or MAYBE two times in 1,000 to 1,500 rounds...???....mikey357

[Carmoney]

I used a 10-shot 617 at the Steel Challenge in 2004 (the only year I have attended that great match), and it worked very well. I have always used CCI Mini-Mags for competition, even back in the old days. Before the 10-shot 617 was available, I actually shot a 9-shot High-Standard Sentinel I had slicked up--it did very well for me at the local plate rack matches!

I think maybe 1 misfire in 1000 is about what you should expect from a .22 revolver.

The action on my gun is smooth, but fairly heavy. I have bad-mouthed the C&S extended firing pin elsewhere, but this gun is the one exception where I found it helped me drop the mainspring tension down a little more than I could otherwise. (I think that means my original firing pin did not have quite enough protrusion, each gun is different, but it might be worth a try.) As John said, the extended FP will ding the edges of your chambers if you dry-fire without snap caps, I had to use my dremel to clean up the burrs I made.

My 14-year-old daughter won the junior division at the Missouri Steel Championships last year with the 617, proving that even smaller-statured people don't necessarily need super-light revolver actions to do well with round guns.

[hdgun]

I think Mike is correct in every thing he mentioned. My friends, PMD, 10MMDave and my self use the 617. I use mine exclusivlly. Matter of fact I just picked up a second one, now I have a stock and an open.

Any way, In my open one, I bobbed the hammer, took 10K off the main spring screw, used a 14lb return spring with 3 coils cut off, and used an extended firing pin ( modified ) I polished the bejesus out of it and squared off the tip. also polished the channel where the firing pin resides.

With these mods, I still have about an 8lb trigger, But it is much smoother than before.

I get 99% firing with CCI Blazer ammo. this week I will do all the same mods to my new 617.

[10mmdave]

{snip}

be worth a try.) As John said, the extended FP will ding the edges of your chambers if you dry-fire without snap caps, I had to use my dremel to clean up the burrs I made.

Had to get that Dremel referance in there eh Mike

Now tell us the truth......you have a converted beer holster to hold that puppy don't you

DaveP

And as far as 22 revo trigger pulls go, I do believe Mr. Lee talked about a 4 lb 617 trigger

pull coming out in the future

[Carmoney]

I think for my next stunt I'll flute a cylinder and contour a fully-lugged barrel using nothing but my Dremel and a little sanding drum.....

Dave, I do remember seeing somewhere that Randy has promised us some sort of incredibly light DA on a .22 revolver. 4 pound DA on a 617 would be quite a feat, now, wouldn't it boys??

[hdgun]

Now, Has any one done a moon clip conversion with a Dremel.

I have!! I have!!

Beat that one Mike

[revchuck]

Now, Has any one done a moon clip conversion with a Dremel.

I have!! I have!!

Beat that one Mike

Note that he didn't ask, "Has anyone done a moon clip conversion with a Dremel that works?"

[Carmoney]

Edited February 21, 2006 by Carmoney

[10mmdave]

Now, Has any one done a moon clip conversion with a Dremel.

I have!! I have!!

Beat that one Mike

Note that he didn't ask, "Has anyone done a moon clip conversion with a Dremel that works?"

Well I'm here to tell you....It works

I was amazed when I saw it and when I aksed him who did it he said "me! with my dremel"

Looks pretty darn good.

And that sounds like a good project Mike, re-contour a barrel using a dremel tool, just

keep a tally of how many sanding drums you go thru

('dem barrels are hard)

[mikey357]

...yeah, BUT...HOW can I use a DREMEL to increase the reliability of MY 617???....mikey357

[hdgun]

Use it to polish out the firing pin channel,

use it to polish the firing pin. ( put the pin in the Dremel, Put a little rouge on a cloth, turn the dremel on and apply the cloth )

polish the inners of the revo

polish the rebound slide

[mikey357]

YEAH...why didn't I think of that?!?! ....mikey357

[haras]

I've been thinking of buying a 617. Are they round or square butt?

[mikey357]

The early 617's...I'm thinking thru about the "Dash one's"...were square-butt...all current production is round-butt...and BTW, I've got a total of FIVE K-22's, including another 617, and this ten-shooter is the ONLY ONE to give me any trouble...since it was purchased "Pre-owned", I can't say for sure that it wasn't "Monkeyed With" by the previous owner...I recommend ANY S&W K-22 HIGHLY!!!....mikey357

[J.Bagakis]

Thanks, everybody who has replied so far...John, when you got your "Ten-shooter" running WELL, what level of misfires did you have to put up with??? I ask this because I have an older 17-6--alas, only a SIX-shooter--that was "Tuned" by Lou Ciamillo of "MGW"...one of the old-time PPC gun builders...and it will misfire about one or MAYBE two times in 1,000 to 1,500 rounds...???....mikey357

I would say about the same as yours one or two every 1,000 rounds.

[mikey357]

Thanks, John, that's kinda' what I was hoping...Now, I have a "Reliability Target" to "Shoot For"...BTW, I talked to "Larry" At S&W--in Customer Service--after describing the problem to him, he sent me a new firing pin, F/P spring and mainspring tension screw...all GRATIS!!!...probably be this weekend before I have a chance to pull the old parts/measure/replace with the new parts and test-fire...maybe I can put off a FEW of the "Honey-Do's" another day or two....mikey357

[haras]

Ok, I'm looking for a 617 6" 10 shot, no lock, stainless cylinder. Would consider a 648 6" with 22LR second cylinder. Got one? Looking for a deal (who isn't).

[mikey357]

UPDATE: Yesterday I put in the NEW firing pin and firing pin spring...as near as I could measure, I THINK I'm getting about one or two thousandths (.001-.002) MORE firing pin protrusion with the NEW innards...after 300 rounds of Federal "Bulk-pack", the misfire rate is now down to 1%...exactly three in three hundred...still a lil' ways to go, but better...may have to put in a slightly longer strain screw next....mikey357

[festus1]

A little bit off topic, but this is how I got my K-22. In 1964 when I was in 2nd grade an older gentleman from the Quad Cities came out to our farm to go coon hunting. I don't remember how he knew my folks. He called the next morning (coon hunting is done at night with dogs and a lot of chewing tobacco) and told my Dad that his revolver fell out of his holster and to be on the look out for it - somewhere along the 1 1/2 miles of Eliza Creek that flowed through our farm. Well, about 3 weeks later my Dad was hooking on a corn wagon to the tractor and when he bent down to put the pin in the hitch - there laid the revolver. When he called the owner he was informed by the wife that the man had a heart attack and died the previous week and that she did not want the gun back. A gunsmith cleaned it up and reblued it and it turned out pretty nice. My Dad gave it to me after I graduated from 8th grade. The mindset was a little different then. True story. Chris

[hdgun]

UPDATE: Yesterday I put in the NEW firing pin and firing pin spring...as near as I could measure, I THINK I'm getting about one or two thousandths (.001-.002) MORE firing pin protrusion with the NEW innards...after 300 rounds of Federal "Bulk-pack", the misfire rate is now down to 1%...exactly three in three hundred...still a lil' ways to go, but better...may have to put in a slightly longer strain screw next....mikey357

Mikey, dont forget to polish the pin (fat part ) and firing pin channel.

BTW: dont dry fire with an extended FP. it will hit the cylinder and bad things will happen.

[haras]

Do the currently manufactored guns have a stainless cylinder?

Would I be better off looking for an older one without the lock? Would one of these older ones not have MIM parts?