Who's stoked about the new Tisas Night Stalker 2011?

[Tokarev]

@mreed911 how does it shoot?

[mreed911]

23 minutes ago, Tokarev said:

@mreed911 how does it shoot?

 

No clue.  Don't have one yet.  Did you mistake me for someone else?

[Tokarev]

1 hour ago, mreed911 said:

 

No clue.  Don't have one yet.  Did you mistake me for someone else?

Apologies. 

 

@shred how does the MAC shoot? 

[shred]

Don't know yet.  Maybe I'll get a chance to try tomorrow.  I expect it to be somewhat bumpy with the factory recoil spring in it.

 

[shred]

Update: shot as expected.  No issues with the first (and only as yet) mag of ammo.  Bounced like a heavily-sprung 4.25" Prodigy or Stacatto.

 

[mreed911]

If I recall these are spring pretty heavy from the factory.

[Tokarev]

12 hours ago, shred said:

Update: shot as expected.  No issues with the first (and only as yet) mag of ammo.  Bounced like a heavily-sprung 4.25" Prodigy or Stacatto.

 

Any idea what spring weight might be? I assume these are sprung for defensive loads and not for USPSA minor. 

 

Is there anything oddball about the gun that would preclude the use of any old Commander length spring?

[mreed911]

If they're sprung the same as the Tisas models, they're 16# from the factory.  Should be able to use any Commander-length spring.

[shred]

Probably somewhere around there.  It ran some 130 PF ammo ok.  Looks about the same as any other 4.25" bull barrel 1911 in there although I've not tested interchangeability of springs and parts.

 

[Tokarev]

I shot mine today finally.  It shoots pretty good.  These should be a good gun if the QC and metallurgy is good and consistent as time rolls on. 

 

Yeah.  The spring is heavy.  I had a couple failures to lock open when empty with lighter powered stuff.  The slide locked back without issue with full power defensive stuff.  I'll probably order a 12# spring next time I'm getting some stuff from Brownells.  

[Tokarev]

[Tokarev]

Much like (I'm drawing a blank on the fellow's name) who does work to the Rock Island Hi Caps, I could see these being a pretty good semi custom base gun. These could be offered in two or three packages. One would be a basic inspection and tune as needed and a trigger job to three and a half or four pounds. Next would be maybe something like EGW internals added to the gun. Then lastly through out everything but the frame, slide and barrel and redo the whole thing with new safeties, sights, slide release etc. 

[Tokarev]

Aha! This is the guy:

 

https://hayescustomguns.com/pistols/rock-island-pistols/

[troupe]

I know folks like to spend money on their pistols, and I have been one of them myself, but it kind of defeats the purpose of spend less money on the lower priced 2011's.  Do the work yourselves, it really is not that tough and a great way to learn and feel more pride in your pistol.

[mreed911]

10 hours ago, Tokarev said:

Next would be maybe something like EGW internals added to the gun. Then lastly through out everything but the frame, slide and barrel and redo the whole thing with new safeties, sights, slide release etc. 

 

Why would this be necessary on a gun with machined steel parts?  What is this fetish with immediately replacing known-good parts with EGW internals?  I see this on Reddit but didn't expect it here.

[Tokarev]

12 minutes ago, mreed911 said:

What is this fetish with immediately replacing known good parts

Fetish. Haha you're funny. Are they "known good parts?" That remains to be seen, no? 

 

My point is there's probably a business opportunity here for a shop with the money and time to invest in some of these. 

[troupe]

I agree that it is a good chance to take hard working folks money and there are many that will do just that.  Feed someone some mumbo-jumbo that for this amount, we can make your pistol better.  The price point will allow it.  Try it first before throwing away money, buy ammo and get better that way.

 

Looking for a true and honest range report from someone.  We already know it is not a Staccato, but is there that much difference in the two.  People have bought the Staccato's and started changing parts as well. Looking forward to the reports.

[392heminut]

1 hour ago, mreed911 said:

 

Why would this be necessary on a gun with machined steel parts?  What is this fetish with immediately replacing known-good parts with EGW internals?  I see this on Reddit but didn't expect it here.

It seems that a lot of people have issues with MIM parts and think they aren't reliable. That may have been the case back when they first started manufacturing MIM parts, but that's not the case now. I have a Wilson Combat MIM hammer in my Limited gun that has probably set off around 50K rounds and never had an issue with it! I worked the factory parts in my Prodigy to a nice, reliable 2.5# trigger pull. I probably could have brought the pull down even more but 2.5# is where I prefer my competition triggers. I also worked on my shooting biddy's Prodigy and had ne problem getting a 2.5# pull on it with the factory parts.

 

There are a couple of Prodigy Owners Groups on Facebook and the general consensus is if you haven't swapped your internals for the EGW kit then your Prodigy is a P.O.S. Gotta do what the 'cool kids' do don't ya know!

[Tokarev]

20 hours ago, troupe said:

I agree that it is a good chance to take hard working folks money and there are many that will do just that.  Feed someone some mumbo-jumbo that for this amount, we can make your pistol better.  The price point will allow it.  Try it first before throwing away money, buy ammo and get better that way.

 

Looking for a true and honest range report from someone.  We already know it is not a Staccato, but is there that much difference in the two.  People have bought the Staccato's and started changing parts as well. Looking forward to the reports.

 

A case could easily be made by some that this entire firearm is "a good chance to take hard working folks money." Turkish imports have had a variety of issues that can often make them a bad purchase. 

 

With that said, if someone does start tuning/selling these as semi-custom or competition-ready or whatever how is that taking folks' hard earned money? Nobody is putting the gun to someone's head and forcing him to buy it. We're all free to spend our money as we wish. Expect for insurance and taxes....

 

As for how these compare to Staccato, the MAC is way too new for anyone to make a claim about how good/bad these may be. Give it a year and make your assessment from there. Maybe these will turn out to be 75% of the quality at a 65% lower price. 

Edited February 21 by Tokarev

[shred]

If a dude wanted to get into 2011s cheap, the TISAS guns would be an OK starting point if they've got the base features you want (for match use I'd want a 5" with a RMR-capable plate which is not yet in the lineup), but if you are going all-in I'd start higher up the scale.  20K rounds, match fees and travel and the base cost of the gun is way down in the noise.

 

[mreed911]

9 hours ago, shred said:

I'd want a 5"

 

 

I'm curious, why?  If running an optic, what's the advantage of the longer slide length?  Given that the Staccato P is 4.3" and seems to be doing okay, is something else in play (cycle time, reliability, etc.)?

[Tokarev]

 

[shred]

15 hours ago, mreed911 said:

 

I'm curious, why?  If running an optic, what's the advantage of the longer slide length?  Given that the Staccato P is 4.3" and seems to be doing okay, is something else in play (cycle time, reliability, etc.)?

 

I prefer the recoil of the longer slide stroke.  Comparing back to back a 4.25" Prodigy and a 5" Prodigy (similar total weights) the 4.25 feels "flippier".   On the clock it's not noticeably different, mostly a preference thing.  There's more flexibility to stuff more buffers and whatnot in there as well. 

 

The 4.4" Stacatto length is interesting as it's got a 5" stroke but I've not spent enough time with one to do any back to back comparisons.

 

For carry or tactical-posing a 4.25" is probably preferable.

 

[Tokarev]

One thing that's been popping up on other forums is the height of the iron sights. MAC chose to go with essentially standard height sights on these guns. 

 

Here's what they're saying about it:

 

Originally Posted By SDSImports:

Pre-Production models of the MAC-9 Double Stack used an optics adapter plate that had different geometry than what we shipped with the production pistols. This change to the plates allowed better zero with most optics without an extreme adjustment in elevation with more model of optics, than the “flat” style plates that allowed us to get that co-witness with the pre-production models.

 

As 2024 rolls on, we will explore different options for additional adapter plates to other optic footprints and sights to accommodate the Tisas front dovetail cut that will allow co-witness or use with a suppressor.”

 

This may or may not be a big deal for someone wanting to use a MAC in one of the competition optics categories. Just FYI for those who may be in the market. 

 

[shred]

AKA "we forgot to include the 1-degree barrel angle".

 

Yeah, height of the iron sights is pretty much a don't-care in competition.  If you must have a co-witness pester Dawson or one of the other front sight makers into making some weathervane sights.