Is there an SAO CZ with a firing pin block?

[ClangClang]

I compete in Run and Gun matches. They are messy, extremely rough on gear, slips and falls are common.

 

I'm looking for an SAO steel frame pistol but it must have a firing pin block or otherwise be drop safe.

 

I have a Shadow, but wouldn't consider it adequately safe for matches like these. I was thinking about a DWX but it's not clear that the DWX is any more drop safe than a Shadow.

 

Only one I can think of so far would be the Sig 226 but not sure I want to go that direction. Anything in the CZ family?

[EarlKeese]

Yep, 75B SA if you can find one, discontinued in 2018.

[GeneBray]

Relatively easy convert several-many/most CZs that are DA/SA to SAO only. Don’t know what that conversion does to firing pin block but think it can remain or be removed. 

[Runswithwood1]

As far as I know cz only offerred the 75b single action only but think they stopped making them a few years ago. If you're dead set on it, I'd suggest looking on gunbroker. What about running your shadow 2 in a level 2 retention holster? Or are you concerned about running and dropping it more than anything?

[ClangClang]

4 hours ago, EarlKeese said:

Yep, 75B SA if you can find one, discontinued in 2018.

Ah interesting. I knew there had to be one.
 

2 hours ago, GeneBray said:

Relatively easy convert several-many/most CZs that are DA/SA to SAO only. Don’t know what that conversion does to firing pin block but think it can remain or be removed. 

I'll give CGW a call and see what's possible. Ideally I'd love to convert a SP-01 Tactical to SAO.

 

1 hour ago, Runswithwood1 said:

As far as I know cz only offerred the 75b single action only but think they stopped making them a few years ago. If you're dead set on it, I'd suggest looking on gunbroker. What about running your shadow 2 in a level 2 retention holster? Or are you concerned about running and dropping it more than anything?

Exactly, drops and impacts are pretty common. I've fallen running at full speed on my holstered (hot) pistol, I've been sprinting mid-stage and jumped over a wall and tripped and took a nasty spill (never lost control of pistol or broke 180, luckily), etc. It's a sport that definitely demands "combat" gear (whatever that means) rather than "race" gear. But can't stop a guy from trying to get as raced out as possible 

[Runswithwood1]

1 minute ago, ClangClang said:

Ah interesting. I knew there had to be one.
 

I'll give CGW a call and see what's possible. Ideally I'd love to convert a SP-01 Tactical to SAO.

 

Exactly, drops and impacts are pretty common. I've fallen running at full speed on my holstered (hot) pistol, I've been sprinting mid-stage and jumped over a wall and tripped and took a nasty spill (never lost control of pistol or broke 180, luckily), etc. It's a sport that definitely demands "combat" gear (whatever that means) rather than "race" gear. But can't stop a guy from trying to get as raced out as possible 

That's some talent there haha, yeha i get it. I cant say to the drop safety of czs since I try to avoid dropping guns but I'm sure it cant be any worse than many of the others on the market

[rowdyb]

You can't convert a tactical to sao

[Redhemi]

Which Shadow do you have, the 2 or SP01 shadow?

[ClangClang]

7 hours ago, rowdyb said:

You can't convert a tactical to sao

Yeah I realized that after I posted. I mean the base SP-01 with rail. I shoot a couple night matches every year so having a light attachment rail is important.

 

I also found some old posts from Stuart/@eerw on the CZFirearms forum detailing the SAO conversion process and it seems like the juice may not be worth the squeeze. Removing the FPB as part of the conversion is optional, and i would want to retain it of course, but doing so really inhibits you from achieving a great trigger, which is what I'm hoping to accomplish here. I might abandon this project and start thinking about other options. 

 

Maybe a DWX and get a lighter firing pin or stronger FP spring for a little extra insurance?

 

4 hours ago, Redhemi said:

Which Shadow do you have, the 2 or SP01 shadow?

 

SP01 Shadow.

Edited September 28, 2023 by ClangClang

[nkresho]

The extended FP is really the main addition that makes the gun less drop safe.  Factory pin does not contact the primer when the hammer is fully lowered at rest.  Extended does touch the primer, so dropping hammer down (directly on the hammer) can (and has, sadly) lead to a discharge.  I'm pretty sure with the stock FP, you'd need to drop muzzle down and really hard to get the weight of the FP to overcome the spring and ignite the primer.  There may be other ways too, but this is my understanding.

 

Increasing the FP spring weight will very likely increase the need for a heavier hammer spring to get primers to go off, which increases the DA pull.  For reference, to achieve a sub 6# DA in a shadow 2, I needed to use an extended FP, lighter FP spring, and then go to an 11-12# hammer spring.  The hammer spring needs to be able to overcome the FP spring.  With a heavier fp spring I'd get light strikes.  

 

I can agree, though, that the FP blocked SP01 tactical (even with the full cajun pro kit and short-reach installed) has nowhere near the light and crisp trigger feel that the shadow 2 with the same goodies installed does.  The pretravel is significantly longer, reset is longer, and the pull in DA is a little heavier (~8# vs ~6#).  Don't get me wrong, it's way better than stock and a really useable trigger for games, but the shadow 2 is just about as good as it gets (from my experience) for  DA/SA.  Sweet spot at 5-6# DA and 2.25-2.5# SA (for me anyway).

Edited September 29, 2023 by nkresho

[EarlKeese]

There's a B SA for sale on the CZ forum right now. (Not mine)

[DenC]

If you are considering other options, this might interest you:

https://tanfoglio.it/en/products/sport-and-competition-steel/limited-custom

Its says Single action with this on the section for safety: automatic on firing pin, manual on the frame.

If its anything like the Stock series its going to have a drop/firing pin safety. Unless that description is wrong. 

Not too familiar with this particular model though so best to double check before buying.

Edited September 29, 2023 by DenC

[GeneBray]

13 hours ago, nkresho said:

The extended FP is really the main addition that makes the gun less drop safe.  Factory pin does not contact the primer when the hammer is fully lowered at rest.  Extended does touch the primer, so dropping hammer down (directly on the hammer) can (and has, sadly) lead to a discharge.  I'm pretty sure with the stock FP, you'd need to drop muzzle down and really hard to get the weight of the FP to overcome the spring and ignite the primer.  There may be other ways too, but this is my understanding.

 

.

 

13 hours ago, nkresho said:

I have an extended firing pin in my SP01 and it definitely does NOT extend past the breach face with hammer down. If I did, it would have been replaced and rendered unserviceable or shorten to the point where it didn’t extend past the breach face. 
 

IMO a FP extending past the breach face with the hammer down makes the firearm dangerous and unsafe to operate. 
 

P. S.  My SP01 has a DA of ~4 lbs 2-3 oz and SA under 2 lbs 4 oz. CGW short reset and reach reduction installed. FPS installed since it is a Production pistol. 

[nkresho]

43 minutes ago, GeneBray said:

 

Mine (S2) definitely extends past. Here's a razor blade against the rear end.

Edited September 30, 2023 by nkresho

[nkresho]

My Sp01 tac (decocker) definitely does not extend past the breech face with the razor blade test, even with the fp safety plunger depressed.   I'm thinking that fp is not extended that comes with the cgw pro kit. 

Edited September 30, 2023 by nkresho