Optic Ready Phoenix Redback

[bigdave24]

I recently purchased an optic ready Phoenix Redback. Very pleased with the pistol overall. I wanted to remove the rear iron sight and replace it with a Trijicon SRO. I opened up the LPA rear sight and removed all 4 screws on the mounting plate. The mounting plate is extremely tight, because of the long reverse dovetail on the pistol.

 

[img]https://i.imgur.com/OtgKXBL.jpg[/img]

 

I actually shot the pistol with the mounting screws removed, and it didn't budge at all. To remove the rear iron sight mounting plate, I used a 5/8 x 5/8 square wood dowel, placed directly on the LPA sight. It slid off to the rear reasonably easily when tapped with a hammer.

 

The optic mounting plate slid on from the rear, tapping it into place with a plastic mallet. It's secured with 4 retaining screws. Again, it's very tight without the screws because of the length of the dovetail.

 

[img]https://i.imgur.com/oc7mxBL.jpg[/img]

 

I'm not sure how the optic mounting plate should be removed. Perhaps I'll custom grind a dowel so it engages the optic posts. I'm not sure how else to engage a purchase on it. It would be nice if there was a tool for it.

 

I secured the SRO with the screws included with the optic plate. My understanding is that these screws are metric, while the screws included with the SRO are standard, and too long.

 

Overall I'm very pleased with the pistol. One thing I've noticed is that I occasionally find that the recoil spring guide rod is sticking out.

 

[img]https://i.imgur.com/Q0z1tHD.jpg[/img]

 

It goes back in when I rack the slide, and hasn't affected shooting it.  I'm  not sure why it happens, other than the rod is being pushed forward off the barrel mating surface.

 

Hope this has been helpful to those interested in the Redback.

Edited February 26, 2022 by bigdave24

[fluffybadbad]

I purchased an identical pistol and feelings are mixed. Fit and finish is really amazing. However, it's frustratingly frustrating to work on and support is nearly non-existent.

 

The double action pull is long, heavy, slightly gritty, and stacks quite a bit midway. The single action is extremely crisp and pretty great except for a pretty long takeup. The SA break is more crisp and defined than my CGW shadow 2.

 

I can get used to having to tap everything out with a mallet because of the tight tolerances, but sometimes those tight tolerances are just annoying. I broke 2 punches and deformed the trigger pin while trying to remove it -- had to go to Grainger to get a replacement (2.5mm x 24mm steel pin if any of you need it). 

 

Changing the front sight fiber has been a debacle. I've never seen a front sight fiber optic retained by a steel pin in the front. Simply cutting the fiber and melting the ends will not work with this sight. It requires full removal of the sight from the frame. I've tried hammering it out after applying heat and it's mauled my wooden blocks. Phoenix says to apply a little more heat than I'm used to in order to remove. I haven't tried that yet.

 

I thought the point of the dovetail optic plate was so it would retain zero when swapping optics/irons, but it's pointless because you need to fully remove the optic to mount the plate and undo the height adjustment of the irons to access the rear mounting set of mounting screws for the plate.

 

Messaging the Phoenix team is like snail mail over instant messaging. I can expect one response per day on a good week -- it takes a few weeks to get one question resolved. I actually never got a full question resolved and I asked about removing the optic plate, size of the trigger pin, and size of the mag release button screw. I've given up on contacting Phoenix directly. Team Phoenix Germany via Facebook has actually been a slightly better help than the company.

 

I'm sure I'll like the pistol more after I shoot it a little more... Just need to find a holster for it. I know GX just received their Redback and is in the process of making a mold, but with how delayed his production is, I think you'd be lucky to get a holster by Fall of this year. I think I'm going to go with a Guga Ribas universal holster and see if it works as good as Humblemarksman says it does.

 

I don't have the guide rod issue -- I've shot close to 500rds so far and haven't had any functional hiccups with the gun. Hoping that the DA pull smooths out, but i'm not holding my breath.

[Phoenix1977]

The guns are top notch, the customer service is worthless. Never seen such arrogance.

better ask the guys from Phoenix Team Germany, those are nice guys.

[bigdave24]

Wow, sorry to hear about the customer service.  If anyone figures out a good way to tap off the optic plate please post here.  Eric at Attic has been a good resource in general.  

I do really enjoy shooting it with the SRO. Very little recoil and dot gets back on target very quickly. I’m pleased overall.  I’d like to eventually replace the LH safety with a smaller one.  But I’m not sure if it’s similar to replacing a CZ safety. A detailed youtube video of disassembly/assembly would be nice.

[fluffybadbad]

26 minutes ago, bigdave24 said:

Wow, sorry to hear about the customer service.  If anyone figures out a good way to tap off the optic plate please post here.  Eric at Attic has been a good resource in general.  

I do really enjoy shooting it with the SRO. Very little recoil and dot gets back on target very quickly. I’m pleased overall.  I’d like to eventually replace the LH safety with a smaller one.  But I’m not sure if it’s similar to replacing a CZ safety. A detailed youtube video of disassembly/assembly would be nice.

It's almost identical to replacing a cz safety. The detent is spring loaded and housed in the safety, so watch out for that flying into space when you remove the left side.

 

I'll probably make a video sometime soon.

[bigdave24]

Fluffybadbad, if you place the iron sight mounting plate with just the front retention screws I think  it will be rock solid.  That way you won’t lose your elevation adjustment when you remove it.  Of course removing the optic mounting plate still seems like it’s going to be an issue.

[mule169]

Have any of you guns run into malfunction issues?

 

Took it to the range to test 4 different loads all factory, Precision Delta 124gr, Atlanta Arms 115g, ELEY 124gr, and Freedom Munitions 124gr, all "match" ammo and constant failure to feed, not going into battery. Do I need to swap out the recoil spring? Magazine issues?

 

Lastly found anyone who makes kydex holsters for these guy's yet? Thanks.

[fluffybadbad]

Lafe at GX will be making kydex holsters soon -- I think he has a Redback on loan and is making molds now. I inquired with RHT and they said that they'd possibly do one if there was an order of at least 20.

 

I haven't had a failure to feed yet with any of my different loads that I also use on my Shadow 2. I'm running a 9lb recoil spring and using my Shadow 2 mags. I don't think I've even touched the mags that came with the Redback yet.

[KommBat]

On 3/23/2022 at 8:15 PM, mule169 said:

Have any of you guns run into malfunction issues?

 

Took it to the range to test 4 different loads all factory, Precision Delta 124gr, Atlanta Arms 115g, ELEY 124gr, and Freedom Munitions 124gr, all "match" ammo and constant failure to feed, not going into battery. Do I need to swap out the recoil spring? Magazine issues?

 

Lastly found anyone who makes kydex holsters for these guy's yet? Thanks.

Hi Mule, could you please get a bit more into details about your FTFeed?

What recoilspring die you use? 
Do you put too much pressure on the side of the slide with your Supporthand thumb? 
We shoot the Redback in the Team since 2018 and had no replicable problems. We shoot reloads and factory loads 115-147gr with 9-11lbs springs. 
If I use a light spring and don’t clean the gun for approximately 2000rds, the slide becomes a bit „sluggish“. But lub or cleaning helped always. 

How about the big brands? Do they also make problems? 
Please keep us tuned to your issues.

Rob 

[Blackstone45]

On 3/27/2022 at 7:38 AM, KommBat said:

Hi Mule, could you please get a bit more into details about your FTFeed?

What recoilspring die you use? 
Do you put too much pressure on the side of the slide with your Supporthand thumb? 
We shoot the Redback in the Team since 2018 and had no replicable problems. We shoot reloads and factory loads 115-147gr with 9-11lbs springs. 
If I use a light spring and don’t clean the gun for approximately 2000rds, the slide becomes a bit „sluggish“. But lub or cleaning helped always. 

How about the big brands? Do they also make problems? 
Please keep us tuned to your issues.

Rob 

What recoil spring would you recommend with 124gr 130PF loads?

[KommBat]

I shoot a lot of 115gr and use a 10 or 11lbs spring.

Try a 9 or 10lbs.

The one that makes me return to zero the best, is the one I use 

[bigdave24]

I’m using 147 gr at 130 power factor with an 11 lb spring.  Pretty happy with it.  Haven’t tried lighter.

[mule169]

On 3/26/2022 at 11:38 PM, KommBat said:

Hi Mule, could you please get a bit more into details about your FTFeed?

What recoilspring die you use? 
Do you put too much pressure on the side of the slide with your Supporthand thumb? 
We shoot the Redback in the Team since 2018 and had no replicable problems. We shoot reloads and factory loads 115-147gr with 9-11lbs springs. 
If I use a light spring and don’t clean the gun for approximately 2000rds, the slide becomes a bit „sluggish“. But lub or cleaning helped always. 

How about the big brands? Do they also make problems? 
Please keep us tuned to your issues.

Rob 

 

Not sure what happened but after giving it a deep clean and firing it again, no issues. I did go to a 10lbs spring but unsure if it is related or not.

[Blackstone45]

10 hours ago, mule169 said:

 

Not sure what happened but after giving it a deep clean and firing it again, no issues. I did go to a 10lbs spring but unsure if it is related or not.

I had a similar issue with some reloads, occasionally the round would not chamber fully, and would get jammed pretty hard. Definitely wasn't an overall length issue. Hasn't happened in the last 200 rounds though. I load 125gr coated bullets at about 130PF and run a 10lb recoil spring.

[chgofirefighter]

I'm looking to buy a Phoenix Redback optics ready pistol, but I already have 2 CZ S2 one Orange and One blue, not sure if the $4200+ price tag justifiies taking the plunge plus the fact that there's no aftermarket support, parts, or etc...  Unlike of course, CZ~ 

[fluffybadbad]

IMO, it's not worth it. Trigger stacks, no aftermarket support, hard to get spare parts, etc...  I'm north of chicago if you want to try one out. PM me.

[chgofirefighter]

On 3/5/2022 at 9:51 AM, fluffybadbad said:

I purchased an identical pistol and feelings are mixed. Fit and finish is really amazing. However, it's frustratingly frustrating to work on and support is nearly non-existent.

 

The double action pull is long, heavy, slightly gritty, and stacks quite a bit midway. The single action is extremely crisp and pretty great except for a pretty long takeup. The SA break is more crisp and defined than my CGW shadow 2.

 

I can get used to having to tap everything out with a mallet because of the tight tolerances, but sometimes those tight tolerances are just annoying. I broke 2 punches and deformed the trigger pin while trying to remove it -- had to go to Grainger to get a replacement (2.5mm x 24mm steel pin if any of you need it). 

 

Changing the front sight fiber has been a debacle. I've never seen a front sight fiber optic retained by a steel pin in the front. Simply cutting the fiber and melting the ends will not work with this sight. It requires full removal of the sight from the frame. I've tried hammering it out after applying heat and it's mauled my wooden blocks. Phoenix says to apply a little more heat than I'm used to in order to remove. I haven't tried that yet.

 

I thought the point of the dovetail optic plate was so it would retain zero when swapping optics/irons, but it's pointless because you need to fully remove the optic to mount the plate and undo the height adjustment of the irons to access the rear mounting set of mounting screws for the plate.

 

Messaging the Phoenix team is like snail mail over instant messaging. I can expect one response per day on a good week -- it takes a few weeks to get one question resolved. I actually never got a full question resolved and I asked about removing the optic plate, size of the trigger pin, and size of the mag release button screw. I've given up on contacting Phoenix directly. Team Phoenix Germany via Facebook has actually been a slightly better help than the company.

 

I'm sure I'll like the pistol more after I shoot it a little more... Just need to find a holster for it. I know GX just received their Redback and is in the process of making a mold, but with how delayed his production is, I think you'd be lucky to get a holster by Fall of this year. I think I'm going to go with a Guga Ribas universal holster and see if it works as good as Humblemarksman says it does.

 

I don't have the guide rod issue -- I've shot close to 500rds so far and haven't had any functional hiccups with the gun. Hoping that the DA pull smooths out, but i'm not holding my breath.

 

One of the main reasons I didn't pull the trigger on a Phoenix Redback is due to their support, parts, etc which are basically none existent in the US market.  It's simply asking for problems and headaches.  Instead I went with an MPA DS9 Hybrid 

[pcar157]

1 hour ago, chgofirefighter said:

 

One of the main reasons I didn't pull the trigger on a Phoenix Redback is due to their support, parts, etc which are basically none existent in the US market.  It's simply asking for problems and headaches.  Instead I went with an MPA DS9 Hybrid 

Any input on your MPA DS9 Hybrid would be appreciated. Am considering one after watching the Humble Marksman video.

[chgofirefighter]

On 7/14/2022 at 8:10 AM, pcar157 said:

Any input on your MPA DS9 Hybrid would be appreciated. Am considering one after watching the Humble Marksman video.

 

Once she's in my hand I will~