Powder charge question for going coated?

[9x45]

Any who reloads (with actual experience) knows what to look for.

Here's a little bit of a clue... flowed primer, almost pierced primer, flat head stamp, bulging case and nasty extractor claw mark. 

Buy a chrono. they are like less than $100.

 

[Bullets]

2 hours ago, hceuterpe said:

Squib. But charge would have to be super low. More likely your slide wouldn't cycle and the case would stove top and jam.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
 

Squibs are generally from no powder at all.

 

As for the op question  like many have said, if it's a little light it would jam. could either stove pipe or leave a spent shell  in the chamber. I have found most coated bullets to run around 50 to 70 fps faster than plated. your plated load should be about .1 to .2 heavier than coated. also, I see your name has glock in it. make sure you put plenty of flare on the case to prevent shaving . we all know how glock barrels don't like lead.

[MemphisMechanic]

Yes. Drop it just a pinch. 

 

But dont sweat this too much. Even keeping your old powder charge you will be well within safe ranges with the bullet change, unless your old load was right at book max for FMJs - which you weren't.

As 9x45 said, we're not talking about a blown-up gun or a squib. Load some up, chronograph them, and tweak your way to 133-135 PF

[IGOTGLOCKED]

24 minutes ago, Sandbagger123 said:

this. also get or borrow a chrono. without one you are only guessing on velocity.  

Who makes reasonably priced chronos?

[IGOTGLOCKED]

4 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said:

Yes. Drop it just a pinch. 

 

But dont sweat this too much. Even keeping your old powder charge you will be well within safe ranges with the bullet change, unless your old load was right at book max for FMJs - which you weren't.

As 9x45 said, we're not talking about a blown-up gun or a squib. Load some up, chronograph them, and tweak your way to 133-135 PF

But for minor aren't I only trying to get to a 125 pf?

[Bullets]

1 minute ago, IGOTGLOCKED said:

But for minor aren't I only trying to get to a 125 pf?

Yes but you wanna load hotter so you are sure you make power factor when it gets colder. most powders get slower as temperature drops. 133 to 135 is probably a bit extreme but I would at least aim for around 130

[IGOTGLOCKED]

Got to get a chrono...

[MemphisMechanic]

Wow. I don't mean this to sound cold, but now I know how new you are. I remember being that guy.

125.00 is barely skirting the legal limit. 

While actual load development and testing are required to find what groups best through your gun, a load around 130 to 135 seems to be more accurate, it cycles the gun more reliably, and steel is a bit more likely to drop from a slightly low hit.

I keep all my ammo above 132, personally. You certainly aren't giving up anything in how quickly you can shoot.

Chrono: Go get a ProChrono. Most consistent and affordable unit out there - I got a cheaper Shooting Chrony first and gave it away. ProChrono all I use. With a bright incandescent light it will even work 100% indoors.

Edited November 3, 2016 by MemphisMechanic

[MemphisMechanic]

Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital Chronograph https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0028MTBJ4/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_rEQgyb9CEAM1W

[IGOTGLOCKED]

1 minute ago, MemphisMechanic said:

Wow. I don't mean this to sound cold, but now I know how new you are. I remember being that guy.

125.00 is barely skirting the legal limit. 

While actual load development and testing are required to find what groups best through your gun, a load around 130 to 135 seems to be more accurate, it cycles the gun more reliably, and steel is a bit more likely to drop from a slightly low hit.

I keep all my ammo above 132, personally. You certainly aren't giving up anything in how quickly you can shoot.

No offense taken Memphis, I'm just glad you guys are here, are willing to help and are patient or I'd probably be shooting left handed by now... Some day I too will be able to pay it forward!

[IGOTGLOCKED]

3 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said:

Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital Chronograph https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0028MTBJ4/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_rEQgyb9CEAM1W

Thanks, will check it out!

[MemphisMechanic]

Most new reloaders chase the softest possible load, it's another thing to tinker with in pursuit of shooting better... due to widgets.

Trigger toys first. Then three sets of sights. Some springs here and there.

Then you start reloading and have a new way to game your match performance. Stop that.

Find a bullet you like, and can afford to shoot a lot of, and that your gun groups well.

Work up a consistent load, and go practice with it a lot. And leave the press alone except to pump the handle.

 

[IGOTGLOCKED]

11 hours ago, 9x45 said:

Any who reloads (with actual experience) knows what to look for.

Here's a little bit of a clue... flowed primer, almost pierced primer, flat head stamp, bulging case and nasty extractor claw mark. 

Buy a chrono. they are like less than $100.

 

Much appreciated 9x45 - I will...

 

11 hours ago, MemphisMechanic said:

Most new reloaders chase the softest possible load, it's another thing to tinker with in pursuit of shooting better... due to widgets.

Trigger toys first. Then three sets of sights. Some springs here and there.

Then you start reloading and have a new way to game your match performance. Stop that.

Find a bullet you like, and can afford to shoot a lot of, and that your gun groups well.

Work up a consistent load, and go practice with it a lot. And leave the press alone except to pump the handle.

 

Memphis, I very much respect and appreciate all your advice (as I do from many others) you have offered me over time! I have not messed with my trigger because I compete with my carry gun, I did put on a better sights to get rid of the Glock plastic, and have done nothing else to it other than shoot and clean it. The decision to change bullets was a financial decision due to how much I shoot and the increased cost of what I was shooting. So I really am not just looking to tinker, I have to save money where ever I am able. More money saved = more bullets to shoot...

Cheers brother!

[hceuterpe]

...you're trying to load to a specific PF...but you don't have a chrono?[emoji32]

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

[IGOTGLOCKED]

Range report on test firing of the coated bullets we have been discussing. 

(Glock 19 gen 4)  145 gr Acme coated RN with 2.5 gr titegroup, 1.150 COAL, .380 crimp - no scrapes or crimp marks on pulled bullets at all.

2 minutes ago, hceuterpe said:

...you're trying to load to a specific PF...but you don't have a chrono?

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
 

I know! Right now I just want to get them shooting well, I can fine tune as soon as the chrono comes...

[IGOTGLOCKED]

Range report for today's testing:

G19 - 145 gr Acme hi tech coated RN, 1.150 COAL (plunk & spin tested), 2.5 gr titegroup to begin as per Lymans for lead, .380 crimp - no scrapes or crimp marks of any kind on pulled bullets.

I made and shot 16. No functional issues neither slow nor rapid fire, the gun ran well. I even shot a few through my 43 and they ran it well too!

The issue is I immediately noticed a significant lack of accuracy. After I finished the mag of coated I loaded a mag of what I have been shooting and tore it up consequently I was not having a "bad day at the range".

No, I did not have a chrono. I asked at the range and they did not offer that service nor have one nor do I know anyone to borrow one from on short notice. Yes I am going to buy one right away.

My question is what am I able to work on during the interim to obtain the accuracy I expect?

Thx!

[MemphisMechanic]

You need to know the velocity your rounds are moving at, so I wouldn't worry about it until your chronograph arrives.

 I believe you'll be below 125 power factor with a charge that low and barrel that short. The very first thing you need to try is a PF in the mid 130s.  You may not be  getting enough velocity to spin the bullet fast enough for it to stabilize.

Then play with over all length once you have your velocity in the desired ballpark.

Normally I'd have someone check for excessive crimp first, but that was addressed earlier.

Edited November 3, 2016 by MemphisMechanic

[IGOTGLOCKED]

16 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said:

You need to know the velocity your rounds are moving out, so I wouldn't worry about it until your chronograph arrives.

 I believe you'all be below 125 power factor with a charge that low and barrel that shot. The very first thing you need to try is a PF in the mid 130s.  You may not be  getting enough velocity to spring & the bullet stabilize. 

 Then play with over all length.

Thank you brother!

[MemphisMechanic]

38 minutes ago, IGOTGLOCKED said:

Thank you brother!

I edited my reply - it makes sense now, and I added a bit more info.

[IGOTGLOCKED]

1 hour ago, MemphisMechanic said:

You need to know the velocity your rounds are moving at, so I wouldn't worry about it until your chronograph arrives.

 I believe you'll be below 125 power factor with a charge that low and barrel that short. The very first thing you need to try is a PF in the mid 130s.  You may not be  getting enough velocity to spin the bullet fast enough for it to stabilize.

Then play with over all length once you have your velocity in the desired ballpark.

Normally I'd have someone check for excessive crimp first, but that was addressed earlier.

Thanks Memphis, I had to read it a few times however had it figured out - no worries. How do you know all this?! Going to have to start paying you a consulting fee 

 

Edited November 3, 2016 by IGOTGLOCKED

[MemphisMechanic]

Everyone on here that's been doing this for years? We've made the same mistakes or asked the same dumb questions.

It's also common sense. At some point, if you don't throw your football in a tight enough spiral, it's going to start to tumble.

[mont1120]

Just a quick note from one of the coated bullet websites on reloading data.

" - Load data – We recommend that you use published lead load data from reputable sources. A coated bullet will run slightly slower than a lead bullet (5FPS-10FPS.}"

That pretty much gives you a starting point to work from. Another determining factor is the barrel you are using. This will have quite an effect on velocity, so without beating the horse into sheet paper, the chrono will be key. I found out the hard way at Nationals when I assumed my backup gun would be fine at the PF I had loaded for on the match gun. I made 165 by the hair of my chin because the bullet weighed 230.9.

I understand the advice to find a great load and stick with it. But.......there are the sick ones here like me who just can't stand to not tinker with new loads, powders, bullets, and all the other new crap that builds the better mouse trap. And we are also the ones who show up at a match and jam every 4th round because we just had to mess with the formula.

[IGOTGLOCKED]

2 hours ago, mont1120 said:

Just a quick note from one of the coated bullet websites on reloading data.

" - Load data – We recommend that you use published lead load data from reputable sources. A coated bullet will run slightly slower than a lead bullet (5FPS-10FPS.}"

That pretty much gives you a starting point to work from. Another determining factor is the barrel you are using. This will have quite an effect on velocity, so without beating the horse into sheet paper, the chrono will be key. I found out the hard way at Nationals when I assumed my backup gun would be fine at the PF I had loaded for on the match gun. I made 165 by the hair of my chin because the bullet weighed 230.9.

I understand the advice to find a great load and stick with it. But.......there are the sick ones here like me who just can't stand to not tinker with new loads, powders, bullets, and all the other new crap that builds the better mouse trap. And we are also the ones who show up at a match and jam every 4th round because we just had to mess with the formula.

Indeed, I learn best from asking questions and doing. I didn't by a 650 to just pull the handle...

[mikeinctown]

On ‎11‎/‎2‎/‎2016 at 9:26 PM, 9x45 said:

2 grains is huge, but .2 grains is not so much, do you have a chrono? You won't squib at 147 with 2.5 grains of TiteGroup. Look at the Hodgdon website. By the way, Dillon powder measures throw at least +/- .1 grains with sugar powders, and +/- .3 with cornflake powders. 

The guy you had originally replied to was talking about the difference between running a 145 vs 147gn bullet, not 2 grains of powder.

 

Personally, unless I was already loading for a major power factor I would have just used the same charge, and then loaded some .2 grains lower to see how that worked out. No need to reinvent the wheel when you already have data available.

[mikeinctown]

Double post

Edited November 4, 2016 by mikeinctown