Vince Pinto Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Although I own a DVD copy of the movie, which I've seen so many times that I can virtually quote most of the dialogue verbatim, I was compelled to watch it again on HBO tonight. For me, this drama has an excellent script, performed by an outstanding cast, and it ranks right up there behind "12 Angry Men" (1957), which is my all-time favourite courtroom drama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdragon Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 GREAT MOVIE! Ivan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 It is outstanding. Been quite a while since "12 Angrey Men" crossed my mind. I think I will go to the local vid store and try to rent it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3quartertime Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Kevin Pollack was a guest of a local morning radio show recently. He was relating a story from the filming of A Few Good Men. He said that all the cast was in awe and reverence of Nichalson. He said that when they were filming the " you can't handle the truth" part there was days that the supporting cast were being filmed reacting to the speech. Normally, he said either a tape would be played or a stand in would deliver the lines of the 'off camera' role. He said during those days Nichalson was there the entire time speaking his part off camera. ( And nailing it each time so much so that they all had goosebumps he added). He said that at one point the director went to Jack and said that he really didn't need to be there, that they could do the sceen without him as he wasn't needed on camera. Jack responed that he was doing it because he loved it. He wanted to be a part of it. It's no accident that some actors play parts that we never forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajarrel Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 I watch the whole movie just to see the last five minutes. dj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sweeney Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Yes, a great movie, despite the glaring legal error that Duane has pointed out. but then, art doesn't have to be perfect to deliver the emptional punch we expect from the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyn Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Sorry as a lawyer, citizen, and a prosecutor, I HATE 12 Angry Men. Western Society has spent hundreds, nay thousands of years figuring out rules governing how the State can bring evidence against a criminal defendant. Evidence is admitted if it is relevant and legally obtained. It is excluded if it is not relevant or illegally obtained. The rules are the result of zillions of trials and have the input of many brilliant minds. But not in Twelve Angry Men, jurors - with absolutely no training in investigation - get to ignore the rules and this precedent and go off and gather their own evidence, conduct their own investigation without any input from either the Court or the State or the Defendant himself. Well what is the point of a legal system if everyone just gets to run around and do whatever is they want to do? Why have any rules? Let's just revert to mob justice governed by emotion, passion and prejudice. Rant mode off But the performances are excellent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 What if the rules are wrong? Are governments and courts without fault or failure? That thread drift aside, I now need to know what was the error that Duane pointed out. I can't seem to find it with a search. Vlad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyn Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Like any human institution, Courts and governments are full of failure, mistake and error, although in our criminal court system those mistakes nearly always favor criminal defendants. Rules are adaptable and are changed all the time but to just toss them out the window, without anything better is just plain dangerous. We've (the We being Western Society) have tried to come up with a process which give us the best result: justice balanced by protection of the individual. Remember the jury system, Rules of evidence, and Constitution are just as much designed to proect the community as the individual. How would you feel if you were accused in a criminal case, went to trial, and the jury decided to secretly go gather evidence which convinced them of your guilt? 12 Angry Men has the opposite result (they found the accused not guilty) but it could just as easily be the other way around. You would not have an opportunity to challenge or test that evidence or it could even be illegally obtained, yet it would be used to convict you. Scary stuff. Juries decide the facts of what happened but the information presented to them is strictly controlled to make sure it's reliable and legally obtained. But I've often wondered what sort of legal system we would have if there were no rules about evidence and everyone could drag anything they wanted into Court and present it as evidence to a jury. I suspect we would have to quadruple our prison space cause I would get a WHOLE lot more convictions if I could spew forth everything I knew about a person to a jury and there were no safeties to keep me in check. But I do like a Few Good Men, again great performances. Of course those defendants were guilty as hell regardless of Jack Nickelson's part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sweeney Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 What Duane pointed out (to the best of my recollection) were two things: Tom Cruise does not argue with a superior officer. He can disagree on the law, courtroom strategy and the like, but when a superior officer tells him what to do (Demi Moore) he will do it, or else. Second, proving that the Marines who wer eon trial were acting under orders does not exonerate them. They're still guilty, but now they've pulled down a bigger fish. The hidden and unanalyzed (because Hollywood isn't that subtle) context is, the friction between obeying orders and not obeying illegal orders. But all dictionaries in Hollywood have the page listing "subtle" excised before they are allowed into the State of California. Duane how'd I do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted December 17, 2004 Share Posted December 17, 2004 Purty good. If anyone wants to read my review of this movie, it's on page 6 of my collection of Amazon.com reviews. http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-review...y=public&page=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9MX Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 My favorite scene in this movie is where Col. Jessep replies with "I eat breakfast ___yards yada yada yada... (yo vince, wanna help me out on this? ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Pinto Posted December 20, 2004 Author Share Posted December 20, 2004 "I eat breakfast 300 yards from 4,000 cubans who are trained to kill me so don't think for one second that you can come down here, flash your badge and make me nervous." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9MX Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 "I eat breakfast 300 yards from 4,000 cubans who are trained to kill me so don't think for one second that you can come down here, flash your badge and make me nervous." whooa! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skywalker Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 9MX, in case you missed the best part of his speech...here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9MX Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 9MX,in case you missed the best part of his speech...here! Thanks Skywalker! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Pinto Posted December 20, 2004 Author Share Posted December 20, 2004 I paraphrased Jack Nicholson's character Colonel Jessop at the last IPSC Rules Committee meeting in Bali, when I said: "I post messages 300 pixels away from 4,000 Enos Forum members who are trained to beat the crap out of me, so don't think for one second that you can come down here, flash your rulebook and make me nervous." Sadly, they just laughed and took away my cookies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Colonel Jessop ...lol...if you didn't already have "Darth"... :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 give me a big old HOO YAAA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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