Skywalker Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 I am re-reading (lost track of how many times I read it in the last three years) THE book, and I'm at that point where BE speaks about grip neutrality and flexible wrists to allow precise and consistent muzzle tracking. This reminded me of something a fellow fencer once told me about how to grip a foil: "The foil is like a robin: while holding it into your hand you have to bear in mind that if you squeeze it, it will die, if you grip it loose, it will fly away" I guess it's perfectly applicable to gripping a handgun too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcoliver Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 Hmmm....need to re-read the Book again. What got stuck in my head was Ron Avery's locked wrists. Or is that what BE was talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Buff Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 I NEED to get THE Book!!!! Next month pay..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasonub Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 huh you dont have it already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 I read and tried to believe all the relaxed grip / wrists stuff, but the reality is something else. I shot a class with Barnhart this past June and he is the only guy I have ever met who admits to crushing the gun. I think when that beep goes off a lot more of us crush it than will admit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Buff Posted October 21, 2004 Share Posted October 21, 2004 From DGA (Death Grip Anonymous) Hi, my name is _________ and I have killed _____ guns this year with my grip of death. -------------- I'm still practising though...TNX for the reminder Sky! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdragon Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I have been known to squeeze the oil out of my pistol a time or two Ivan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ong45 Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 None of you guys hold on to the gun hard enough Todd Jarret during a class a couple of years ago. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasonub Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 ok on grip pressure the answer is basically "it depends" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 What ever happened to grip it and rip it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling White Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Jake, nothing...your there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 "The foil is like a robin: while holding it into your hand you have to bear in mind that if you squeeze it, it will die, if you grip it loose, it will fly away." I find that if I grip in THIS manner, then I almost can't feel the gun, and it performs more on its OWN than if I FORCE it (I just have to be sure to AIM properly)(heh). But seriously, a light grip reduces MANY of the things that seem to go wrong when I grip TOO tightly....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDave Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Like with many, if not all, things... ...do only what you need to do to ensure the the result you desire. Nothing more, nothing less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 It's possible to have a very firm yet neutral grip. I shot a class with Barnhart this past June and he is the only guy I have ever met who admits to crushing the gun. Not only that, he admitted to doing it intentionally. He even recommends improving your grip strength via Ironmind grippers & etc. He also mentioned that he no longer recommends a 70% weak hand / 30% stong hand bias. He now recommends 50/50. Sounds like a firm neutral grip. Think about this for a minute. If I remember correctly, Todd, Jerry, Robby & Eric G. all grip the gun hard. Todd & Jerry have admitted to doing it on purpose. Notice anything in common with these 4? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Storm, good points. I didn't think to mention iron mind. Based on a combo of Jerry inspired drills I now have a sort of workout for my grip pressure, and aggressive stance: We did a drill starting at about 5y going back to 25y in 5y increments, 2 rounds each distance, sloooow fire, trying for one hole. I add gripping the gun tightly and leaning forward (like we're all supposed to). I do this drill three times, for a total of 45 rounds and I find my "grippers" are tired. Clear evidence I was not strong enough before, or gripping the gun hard enough. Don't know if I'll see improvement from this drill in the grip department, I have just started doing it, but it is helping in being able to shoot groups without standing there limp as a noodle. as at your own risk... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulW Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 While taking TJ's class he kept telling to "grip harder". Albeit there is a difference between a harder grip and a tense trigger finger. They need to become "disconnected". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg G Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 When you choose to grip hard the tendency to try and counteract recoil is greater and flinching, trigger freeze etc seem to follow. I try to use a fairly firm grip but still let the pistol recoil. What were the reasons behind the hard grip? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 I don't think flinching follows, only compensating for recoil (the difference is in the hundreths of seconds). Trigger freeze comes with gripping hard if you haven't experienced detachment of your finger from the rest of the gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turtle Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Jake, I would also add that trigger freeze comes from tension in places other than the hands/forearms. I feel that when ever I've had trigger freeze, I've had tension in my shoulders/neck area and I was just generally tense. It comes from "trying" to shoot fast versus gripping the gun hard and letting it go off. Did someone say "Ironmind grippers"? Can anyone here close the #3 yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Good point. If the Ironmind are the ones I'm thinking about, I believe there are only around 12 people in the WORLD that can legitamately close the #3's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 I think a difference needs to be made between: 1) How much pressure you put on the grip of the gun and... 2) How tense you are when putting pressure on the gun If you are really strong, you can have a relaxed grip, yet crush the gun. If you're not strong, you can put an equal amount of pressure on the gun as the strong guy, but you will not be as relaxed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turtle Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 It also depends on the individual's ability to grip the gun hard while maintaining a trigger finger disassociation, in order to achieve maximum trigger control (assuming that there is a direct correlation between accuracy and trigger control). There is a certain amount of mental focus that is required to do this. For me, a firm grip is important to achieving the best results, but it's just one part of the equation. Jake, The Iron Mind Captain's of Crush list has expanded a bit. Right now there's about 120 people on the list for the #3 gripper. That by no means takes away from the feat that it is! A friend of mine from work is on the list and got me into it. I don't have a #3 yet because I'm still working on the #2. I'm almost there (about 4mm away)and have vowed to be able to close it by New Years day. The #2 requires about 195lbs of pressure to close. Just FYI, a run of the mill sporting goods store model is rated at about 30lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 120 hmm. Looks like I need to start working on that again. I got to the point where I could close the #2 completely three times, but after I did it, it felt like something was tearing away from something else. Gonna start again tomorrow though. hehe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wim Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 When I was young(er) and dumb(er) I tried a lot of forearm and gripping exercises. My 2c worth is just not to get too carried away in your quest for instant grip strngth - be sensible - I worked may way into tennis elbow twice and the problems took many months (cortisone shots etc.) to resolve... Oh any you guys on the big equipment take it easy shaking hands when you meet people who don't expect to be crushed in a gorilla grip you may break something (of theirs) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mas Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 I had a breakthrough over the weekend. I learned how to effectively shoot full power 45 loads with speed without using a strong grip....i was Very relaxed. The gun ran. I hit the target. I have to keep working on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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