Using a Metronome

[daves_not_here]

I started using a metronome (the thing that goes click-click for playing music with steady tempo) with dry-fire.

The goals are to:

Get my eyes to snap faster or sooner to the next target for transitions

Get my transitions equal to my splits

Get faster and smoother.

Rationale:

All the good shooters have a nice rhythm.

Matches are won with transitions and reloads.

My Current Approach:

• I have an electric metronome which is actually a free iPhone app.
  
• I'm comfortable with 0.3 second splits yet my transitions are 0.4 at 7 yards.
  
• I've set the metronome to 200 beats per minute (60 seconds in a minute / 0.3 seconds = 200).
  
• I make sure I lead with my eyes.
  
• I make sure I am efficient and have a proper sight picture on the dry-fire targets.
  
• Avoid doing it too much e.g. getting sloppy
  

I'm also using a SIRT pistol so I get proper hit indication when I trigger press. I also turn on the takeup laser periodically to see whether I overrun the next target.

I just started this yesterday so I'm looking for ideas and comments.

DNH

Edited August 6, 2012 by daves_not_here

[Steve Anderson]

I've used this trick with a few shooters to get the transitions quicker and the splits slower. It's great for breaking double tappers out of their old ways.

The olny way it hurts is if we get a preconceived idea of what an array will "sound" like and then shoot it that way regardless of what the eyes see.

It does a lot of good before that happens...

SA

[daves_not_here]

Steve,

Thanks!

I think the preconceived ideas about how it's supposed to sound also creates the "double tap/hammer" syndrome to begin with.

Your drills that use sight picture without trigger press help me drive the gun by what the eyes see and not by sound.

I've translated this to working with the metronome by just looking target to target with my eyes to the beat of the metronome. Then introducing the gun no trigger.

Because you can't hit faster than you can see...

DNH

BTW, I have your book open on my desk right now.

[dravz]

I have been looking for a good way to practice cadence with my SIRT. I can't believe I didn't think of a metronome app. I'm totally doing this.

[GmanCdp]

My son has had mine for the last 4 yrs..i use to use it alot dry firing..i need to get it back and start over

[daves_not_here]

My son has had mine for the last 4 yrs..i use to use it alot dry firing..i need to get it back and start over

Gman,

If you've got a smartphone there's probably a free metronome app.

My latest twist is to have the metronome going and then engage targets in different sequences, two body - one head or 1-1-2-1-1.

It's keeping dry-fire practice fun and challenging. Then again it's only day two...

DNH

[mikeg1005]

I think the idea of basing your shooting speed off shot cadence is a poor approach to this.

Your speed should be dictated by how fast you can aim.

I used to shoot based on cadence for a very brief period, and then I realized that in say a 3-4 target array, I'd get almost all charlies, because trying to keep the cadence required for me to keep the gun moving instead of stopping and aiming at every A zone. I also felt that it slowed me down... since again, cadence dictated the speed, not aiming, and sometimes I could aim faster than my cadence.

Mike.

[GmanCdp]

I think the idea of basing your shooting speed off shot cadence is a poor approach to this.

Your speed should be dictated by how fast you can aim.

I used to shoot based on cadence for a very brief period, and then I realized that in say a 3-4 target array, I'd get almost all charlies, because trying to keep the cadence required for me to keep the gun moving instead of stopping and aiming at every A zone. I also felt that it slowed me down... since again, cadence dictated the speed, not aiming, and sometimes I could aim faster than my cadence.

Mike.

bold mark..it is..when i was using the metronome alot several yaers ago,i made it a point to see what i was seeing..if you know what i mean..anyway, i would work up to a pretty fast pace with it,progressing as fast as i could see..also worked with draws the same way..

not allowed to own a smart phone,but i do have an ipad..

Edited August 7, 2012 by GmanCdp

[daves_not_here]

Your speed should be dictated by how fast you can aim.

Mike.

VERY GOOD POINT!!!! I think that bears repeating in this thread and else where. It's the classic "you can't miss fast enough".

You can only hit as fast as you can aim...

Since this is the second day I've had a chance to get sloppy and find this out.

Now, for the majority of my "runs" with a metronome I use the dry-fire drill approach from Steve Anderson's book where one gets a sight picture and DOES NOT PRESS THE TRIGGER.

Reinforcing good habits and not practicing mistakes...

DNH

[dravz]

I think the idea of basing your shooting speed off shot cadence is a poor approach to this.

Your speed should be dictated by how fast you can aim.

I used to shoot based on cadence for a very brief period, and then I realized that in say a 3-4 target array, I'd get almost all charlies, because trying to keep the cadence required for me to keep the gun moving instead of stopping and aiming at every A zone. I also felt that it slowed me down... since again, cadence dictated the speed, not aiming, and sometimes I could aim faster than my cadence.

Mike.

Cadence is just for practice. It is a way to force you into having a shot ready on the beat to improve your transition times. That's all.

[daves_not_here]

Your speed should be dictated by how fast you can aim.

...sometimes I could aim faster than my cadence.

Mike.

...It is a way to force you into having a shot ready on the beat to improve your transition times...

Really good points about aim and sight picture to emphasize:

• Not breaking a shot before you're ready. - This means sights must be aligned first.
  
• Trigger press based on what you see not a specific time. - If you aimed faster than an arbitrary cadence then take the shot. Why wait?
  

Many times I've fallen into the "Shoot NOW!" mistake before I had the sights on the target.

I'm adding two additional training points to my notes:

• Faster transitions - Get the sights on target before the beat.
  
• Visual Patience - Proper sight alignment as a visual cue for trigger press. The goal is to not pressing the trigger before the sights are on target
  

Thanks,

DNH

[mikeg1005]

Cadence is just for practice. It is a way to force you into having a shot ready on the beat to improve your transition times. That's all.

Hmmm... I never had problems with transition times but that does make sense... use the cadence for transitions, not shots.

Mike.

Edited August 8, 2012 by mikeg1005

[GunBugBit]

The idea of using a metronome for shooting training occurred to me recently, mainly because I'm gearing up for the upcoming jazz ensemble fall rehearsal schedule. I spend more time improving speed and precision on my horn than speed at shooting tasks, but that could change!

Downsides - what Steve said, plus the steady beat of the metronome lets you anticipate when to start your draws or mag changes, so you might not be as fast as you think you are.

Upsides - you can know the pace at which you are able to execute certain things and train yourself to do certain things at a set pace.

Looks like some of you have thought of smart ways to employ it.

[daves_not_here]

...improving speed and precision on my horn than speed at shooting tasks,...

Flight of the Bumblebee comes to mind! (Green Hornet Theme). Move a trigger as fast and accurately as your valves you'll be GM in no time!

I think it can be argued there are a lot of similarities between music and shooting (Just don't tell my hippie music teacher).

When playing sheet music you've got to look a couple notes ahead of where you're playing. This would be like looking for sight picture.

When you actually play the notes to a rhythm it is done in a controlled and precise fashion. Just like trigger press.

When playing with others you have to sync up with their cadence. Like shooting at a swinger.

Try to play the song faster than you can you'll hit wrong notes. Like missing targets or poor accuracy.

Ultimately, one looks at a whole measure or phrase and it's just played. This is where musicality comes in. That would be subtleties in approaching groups of targets in a stage.

I'm sure there are people on this forum that find the sound of gunfire musical. That of course depends on who is doing the shooting and the direction of fire.

DNH

[GunBugBit]

...improving speed and precision on my horn than speed at shooting tasks,...

I think it can be argued there are a lot of similarities between music and shooting (Just don't tell my hippie music teacher).

Make your gun sing!

As a competitive shooter facing varying stages, there is an analogy to improvising, as in jazz. A good jazz soloist flies not just by the seat of his pants, but understands the chord progressions and timeflow as the rest of the band plays, and knows how to cleverly and creatively play in synch.

A shooter looks at a stage and figures out an optimal way to get through it. When the buzzer goes off, it's solo time.

Edited August 8, 2012 by GunBugBit

[hunt_fish]

I guess the difference is that music has an underlying tempo even while a solo is playing.

Shouldn't shooting be almost chaotic, doing each action as fast as possible, dictated only by the target placement and distances?

[daves_not_here]

When you've practiced something and know it cold you can play it way fast!

I think that is just like blazing through a stage feeling like it's slow.

The time wasn't slow it just seemed like it because you kept ahead of what was happening. Also the notes or the shooting technique was in your subconscious. You didn't need to say to yourself B-C#-D or press trigger with the right index finger.

So, using a metronome you know the speed you can shoot and the technique is in your subconscious at that tempo. I believe with live-fire this will help you keep ahead of what is happening and change your tempo smoothly.

DNH

Edited August 9, 2012 by daves_not_here

[GunBugBit]

In music practice, using a metronome, I find I can't move on to a new level of speed until I've mastered a speed that's within my current ability, and that speed is defined by my ability to play it accurately/cleanly, and do so consistently. Then, I can creep the metronome to faster speeds in small increments, or bigger ones if I want.

At the moment I'm thinking maybe I'd practice shooting tasks at a certain tempo after I've picked up the tempo from the metronome, but leave the metronome off as I shoot. I wouldn't want to come to depend on it.

Music is much more deterministic. The other players in a group aren't going to keep switching up a tempo to throw a soloist off. But in shooting matches, things aren't arranged to accomodate a click-click-click pacing. Fluidity and adaptability are more important.

[Not-So-Mad Matt]

I started using a metronome (the thing that goes click-click for playing music with steady tempo) with dry-fire.

I was considering the same thing -- or using a par-timer with multiple beeps -- but I was worried about trying too had to to beat the multiple beeps. I already struggle a bit trying not to make up for lost time from a bad draw (or whatever) while dry-firing.

The goals are to:

Get my eyes to snap faster or sooner to the next target for transitions

Get my transitions equal to my splits

Get faster and smoother.

I've heard that same benchmark of transitions equal to splits, but what's the rationale? I'm sure there's more room to improve transitions than splits, and they're more important to your overall time, but is there any reason they should be about the same? Or is it just that many shooters over-emphasize fast splits and under-emphasize fast transitions, and this advice nudges their priorities in the right direction?

Rationale:

All the good shooters have a nice rhythm.

Matches are won with transitions and reloads.

Do good shooters have a nice rhythm because a nice rhythm improves their shooting, or do they have a nice rhythm as a side-effect of their consistent shooting?

[dravz]

I guess the difference is that music has an underlying tempo even while a solo is playing.

Shouldn't shooting be almost chaotic, doing each action as fast as possible, dictated only by the target placement and distances?

I would say the targets are your sheet music.

[dravz]

I've heard that same benchmark of transitions equal to splits, but what's the rationale? I'm sure there's more room to improve transitions than splits, and they're more important to your overall time, but is there any reason they should be about the same? Or is it just that many shooters over-emphasize fast splits and under-emphasize fast transitions, and this advice nudges their priorities in the right direction?

I think it's both, but imo it's just a matter of diminishing returns and time efficiency. For instance, a C-class shooter may have splits on a 30-ft target of .33 seconds, while a GM will hammer it in .15 seconds. However, the C-class shooter may take .66 seconds to transition onto that target, while the GM transitions in .20 seconds (or lower, honestly). So there is a lot more room for improvement by speeding your transitions (.46s gained), way more than speeding your splits (.18s gained). That's point one.

The second point is pretty much every M/GM (and even most A-class) will have the same splits on a given target/distance, usually like .12-.14s. At that level it is strictly the speed of target acquisition and transitions which will separate the field, because human beings cannot physically pull a trigger faster than about .12 seconds, but transition times can still come down from .25 to .22 to .18s.

Thirdly, if your splits are equal to your transitions, then it means you are functioning at 100% peak efficiency. Much like a maximized .12-second split is the limit on the speed of shots, if the gun is therefore on the next target and ready to shoot at the end of that .12 seconds it means there was no wasted time in the shooting whatsoever. At such a point, you have eliminated all waiting from your shooting (of an array), which is by definition the fastest you can go.

[HostileHabitat]

Finding your guns cadence is the key.

[daves_not_here]

It's been a couple of days working with a metronome, some live-fire and digesting this thread.

My current goal is to improve my transitions by getting my EYES to snap faster to the next target.

I don't think constraining myself to an arbitrary and constant beat is going to help my shooting except with a rack of steel plates. I will get all jazzy with you on the topic of rhythm because like dravz man says "the targets are your sheet music". Some swing, some pop and other's don't threaten.

Transition time equal to splits I consider the theoretical maximum speed of a transition. This would be the time of how fast you can recover and fire the next shot regardless of whether it required a transition or is the same target. Perhaps thinking that a transition is "recovering to the next target" might help me.

I've begun to notice how my eyes move: Things are smooth and fast or slow and choppy. When my eyes move first and get a good focus on the next target the sights smoothly "appear" and it's fast. If I don't get focused clearly on the next target, the gun arrives and the sights swim around before I clamp down a sight picture. I end up "behind" the movement of the gun, jerking it to a stop and it's slow.

My basic premise:

You can't hit faster than you can see...

My background references:

Refer to Brian's book p. 65 for shooting types. There are different things going on and vision plays a HUGE ROLE!

Brian's book starting on p. 79 talks about Visual Awareness.

"You need to start to see things that you wouldn't normally see...

At home or in your office, pick out a couple different spots at different distances and practice shifting your focus from one to the other...see how quickly you can go back and forth." (Enos 1990 p.79-80)

So from this and a little Steve Anderson got me thinking of using a metronome.

So, this exercise it to: NOTICE how to have one sight picture then snap the eyes to the next target and then establish the next sight picture.

I have narrowed drills down to:

2-2-2 and 1-1-2-1-1 sequences on three targets

X drills head-body-head-body on two targets

I do a "run" trying to make the tempo but most importantly getting the EYES to lead the gun to the target and getting a good SIGHT PICTURE.

Anyone else find stuff out about what they're doing?

I highly recommend getting both Brian's and Steve's books. They put a lot of support into this forum so buy their books even if you don't read them.

DNH

Edited August 10, 2012 by daves_not_here

[BSComp]

I know this is going to sound weird/strange. But, as a kid I would put my ceiling fan in my room on slow and focus on one specific blade while lying on my bed. I got good at that then I would move it up to the medium speed and focus on a single fan blade again. I got pretty good at it and could focus on a single blade going round and round without losing the blade or the blade getting blurry.

What I found is that if done right, it forces my eyes and brain to focus on a specific spot, like a fan blade (or a front sight). For me, its dryfire for my eyes/brain. I now do it from time to time as a mental exercise to see if I still have it.

Like I said, I know it sounds weird, but it really helps me train my eyes to focus intensely.

~Brian

[reichebrown]

I am a High School Band and Chorus Teacher. (no I am not a "Hippie") However, I do see a lot of correlation between the shooting sports and music performance. I feel that my sense of rhythm plays a lot into my cadence and control of it. Just like I can very meter, time and subdivisions in performing music I very depending on target location a difficulty. Learning to shoot proficiently is not very different from learning to play an instrument proficiently. There are many individual processes that all must be mastered first so they can be performed simultaneously in the subconscious mind.

Just like shooting a complex stage, A pice of music music first be rehearse and prepared to the point where it becomes automatic. If you fear and doubt your ability to perform the difficult three measure passage of complex rhythms and notes (a series of moving and disappearing targets) chances are you will not perform the passage correctly. However if you prepare the passage properly and have no doubt in your ability to perform it you will each and every time.

As a freshman in college I really learned how to practice. It takes a great deal of discipline and self control to focus for extended periods of time to identify, diagnos, and solve the problems you are having. I transfer this disciplin directly to my shooting. Lately I have been applying Lanny Basshams mental management system to my shooting as well as playing. I also work with my students encouraging them to apply his management system to their preparation of our marching band show. It was fun explaining that system to my students in the first week of marching band and watching all of the light bulbs turn on as their eyes opened up wide!

Take a look here. Coincidence? I think not!

PS- If i ever have a child some day look out they will kick some butt