First 9mm loads ready to test

[Pensfan]

Thanks to everyone on this forum for the great help in developing first reloads. This site has been an excellent resource for the all the great testing info I have gathered so far.

I have made up 50rds to test today or tomorrow depending on the weather and will be using this approach. I have a question about the OAL recipe vs what I am using for my CZ.

My drop/plunk test for the Dardas 124gr Lead RN bullets resulted in a Max OAL of 1.18" (1.995" - 0.15" ~ 1.18"). I found load data for Winchester WSF powder and 124gr LRN with OAL's of 1.169" with Min/Max grain loads of 4.0gr - 4.7gr. After research and testing varying OAL dummy rounds in my CZ 75B, I am starting with an OAL of 1.10".

10rnds 124gr LRN, WSF 3.8gr, 1.10" OAL

10rnds 124gr LRN, WSF 4.0gr, 1.10" OAL

10rnds 124gr LRN, WSF 4.2gr, 1.10" OAL

10rnds 124gr LRN, WSF 4.4gr, 1.10" OAL

10rnds 124gr LRN, WSF 4.6gr, 1.10" OAL

So the question... Since I am wanting to drop the OAL from the load data of 1.169" to 1.10", should I go lower on the powder to make up for the increased pressure from seating lower? Or should I pull and seat at 1.169"? Or should I just start at 4.0gr per the Winchester Load Data?

Seating / OAL length is still the one thing that I am not 100% sure on. Lower seating can increase pressure obviously, but how much more so does it and does changing the seating lower mean you have to change the powder charge?

Thanks!

[Jonathan Taliani]

Any time you go with a shorter OAL than the load data lists, it is definitely advisable to also downwardly adjust the powder charge. 1.169 is pretty long for non-major loads.

[jdphotoguy]

My question would be why are you wanting to load such a short OAL? What was the longest OAL that would fit in your barrel?

[Pensfan]

Thanks... that is what I was thinking as well. I have a load starting at 3.8 (lower than the 4.0 stated). Is that low enough or should I start at 3.6gr?

[Pensfan]

My question would be why are you wanting to load such a short OAL? What was the longest OAL that would fit in your barrel?

The max OAL according to a drop test is around 1.18", my factory ammo and Atlanta Arms & Ammo is all 1.15". According to all the research and reading I have found, CZ 75B's shoot great with OALs around 1.08"-1.10". I want to start testing to find that sweet spot so I would like to start on the high end of that range.

Again though... these are my first rounds so I am still learning and open to all input.

[Jonathan Taliani]

I would guess that the 3.8 will probably be fine, but it would be a good idea IMO to make up a few at 3.6 to be safe. Throw them over the chrono and check for signs of over-pressure. If all looks good, start working your way up.

[Pensfan]

The weather held out and I got to fire off my first 30 rounds of reloads! I have to admit... it was really dang cool to be shooting my own ammo. Thank you so much to everyone that helped with my endless questions. The first trigger pull I was shaking and had a hard time keeping the sights on target, haha. Overall though I learned a TON with these 30 rounds... easily more than I have ever learned in any other 30 rounds downrange.

So the report: April 27, 2012, Friday afternoon, 1:30 pm CST, partially cloudy / overcast, outdoors, 62 degrees. All rounds fired freestyle from 9yds range to target with ProChrono Digital in line of fire approximately 4yds from muzzle.

Atlanta Arms & Ammo: 147gr FMJ RN, 1.15" OAL

~ Used these as a baseline both through the chrono and for group on the target to compare the reloads.

~ Two 5rd Strings, 1.62" Group

~ High Vel = 906; Low Vel = 877; Ave Velocity = 890; PF = 130.83

Batch 1: 124gr LRN, WSF 3.6gr, 1.10" OAL

~ Only shot eight rounds as two failed to throw the slide into battery due to soft recoil.

~ One 8rd String, 1.44" Group with 1 flyer. 1.20" without flyer

~ High Vel = 916; Low Vel = 847; Ave Velocity = 882; PF = 109.37

Batch 2: 124gr LRN, WSF 3.8gr, 1.10" OAL

~ Extremely accurate round... if the PF wasn't so low it would warrant more testing. Too bad, haha

~ One 10rd String, 0.97" Group

~ High Vel = 981; Low Vel = 909; Ave Velocity = 947; PF = 117.43

Batch 3: 124gr LRN, WSF 4.0gr, 1.10" OAL

~ Smooth action and recoil, however one round failed to throw the slide into battery due to soft recoil. Accuracy dropped a bit from the previous load. This load is still too light considering PF and failing to run slide into battery.

~ One 10rd String, 1.49" Group

~ High Vel = 1047; Low Vel = 993; Ave Velocity = 1013; PF = 125.61

Looks like I need to bump the powder charge to 4.2gr and test 10 rounds, then crank out a hundred or so and do more extensive testing. I think I am on the way there though!

[warpspeed]

Batch #2 looks like an great Steel Challenge round if you were ever to shoot SC where pf is not an issue. Heck, Batch #1 would be better but you would have to change recoil springs for sure.

I'd bump it up to 4.2 or even 4.3. You want a load where the lowest velocity you get with a random selection of loaded rounds from any given batch is still @ pf floor. Especially with a minor pf load. It's one thing to get dropped to minor but a whole different deal to shoot for no score.

[sroe3]

For me to be confident in my match load all rounds in my test group must chrono above minimum PF.

[Jonathan Taliani]

It sounds like the range trip went well. Congrats! I like to have some cushion above PF floor, so I usually go for 132-137. It is a great feeling not only being able to make your own ammo, but also being able to cater the load to your gun and preferences.

[Mike_P]

Congrats on finally being able to shoot your own rounds. It's a great feeling!

Smart move using the chrono off the bat. It makes things SO much easier in the long run.

[gary2232]

I too just tested my first hand loads. I also used LRN. I used 231 but got about the same results. It's fun to see how a change in powder weight or a OAL change can effect the group. I am going tO copy your loads because I have some WSF than I want to use.

A question on your OAL. Did you do push test? I did and with my Shadow at 1.095 I am on the lands with a 125 gr Bear Creek so I like to back off .010 or .015 from there. Are you finding the same thing?

Great report thanks.

[CocoBolo]

Sounds like you are ready to try searching for the holy grail. My favorite is 135gr Bayou Bullet with 3.8gr of N320 set 1.145. My shadow eats 125gr Zeros out to 1.165 so it may have a deeper chamber than yours.

[Pensfan]

More testing today... with an interesting note that I didn't even think of. I loaded up some of the 124gr Lead RNs with 4.2gr WSF like I mentioned above, and I also loaded up some 147gr with 3.5 WSF to 1.12" OAL and tested them as well.

The unintended aspect of the test though... it was 82 degrees today at the range, however I left from work and my ammo was in a sweltering hot car all day. Easily over 100 degrees in the car. When I got the range I noticed several of the rounds had blue lube melting down the nose of the bullet (they were stored nose down / primer up in retail boxes).

After inspecting the rounds, and discarding the rounds with shown lube, the rest seemed normal and I continued to document everything.

So the report: May 1, 2012, Friday afternoon, 3:00 pm CST, mostly sunny, outdoors, 82 degrees (ammo left in 100+degree car for 6 hours prior to shooting). All rounds fired sitting, two-handed grip, with sandbag from 10yds range to target with ProChrono Digital in line of fire approximately 4yds from muzzle.

Atlanta Arms & Ammo: 147gr FMJ RN, 1.15" OAL

~ Used these as a baseline both through the chrono and for group on the target to compare the reloads.

~ One 10rd String, 1.60" Group

~ High Vel = 910; Low Vel = 841; Ave Velocity = 878; Extreme Spread = 69; Standard Deviation = 19; PF = 129.07

Batch 4: 124gr LRN, WSF 4.2gr, 1.10" OAL

~ Great feeling round, little smoky but not too bad, no failures to slide into battery.

~ One 10rd String, 1.52" Group

~ High Vel = 1048; Low Vel = 1004; Ave Velocity = 1029; Extreme Spread = 44; Standard Deviation = 16; PF = 127.60

Batch 5: 147gr LRN, WSF 3.5gr, 1.12" OAL

~ Great feeling round, little smoky but not too bad, no failures to slide into battery, excellent accuracy.

~ One 10rd String, 0.90" Group

~ High Vel = 878; Low Vel = 851; Ave Velocity = 868; Extreme Spread = 27; Standard Deviation = 9; PF = 127.60

The 147s handled GREAT, I LOVE them. They were super accurate, soft recoiling, great for watching the sights lift and return very smoothly. Depending on how the heat affects the speed of the powder, I may need to adjust the powder charge up a grain or so after running another batch through the chrono with better controlled temps.

So the questions... WSF is reverse temp sensitive, we know that as a fact. However, how much will it slow down from 82deg when heated up to 100+ degrees? Will it slow back down once cooled or is the powder damaged/slowed permanently? I will obviously need to reload a batch with the same settings and shoot them in better controlled temps to get an accurate reading on the speed / PF.

Thanks to everyone for all the help in developing these loads. I greatly appreciate it!

[gonefishin]

Wow, Pen, sounds like you've got a winner there! I'm working up my first load too. I hope you had as much fun working yours up as I did! Good luck with it and be safe!