Marv Z Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 (edited) I just started reloading .223 on my 550. Was using Dillon dies and having lots of problems with setback. Made up some dummy rounds and chambering them in my BHW upper, they will set back any where from .020 to pushing the bullet into the case. I tried getting more crimp from the Dillon die with no success. Actually crimped them far enough it bent the case with no luck. Picked a Lee FCD die, and tried that with the same issue. I can almost slide the bullet in the case by hand after sizing. Tried new LC brass, used Privi, used RP with the same results. I'm using 69 gr MK HPBT. Just for fun I decided to pull a bullet from some Black Hills 77gr match ammo left from last year. The bullet on the left is from my case and the one on the right is the Black Hills. There appears to be a huge difference in neck tension between the two. The Black Hills also has no crimp. My case necks measure .246 od and .2255 to .223 id with a calipers after sizing. Bullets are .224 Any chance this is a bad sizing die? Sure looks like there are way to loose. I can't believe I have to crimp those 69's that much. I searched the forum and saw that a lot of guys don't crimp at all. I'd never get one in the chamber like that. Any ideas? Thanks!!!! Edited March 21, 2012 by Marv Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number99 Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Pull your die apart and measure expander. I think mine is .222,. From memory necks after sizing are smaller than yours. Place to start anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv Z Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 I measured the ball on the Dillon die and it's .223. That's too big as far as I can tell. I called Dillon and got a RMA number to send it back for inspection. I picked up a RCBS base size die that's supposed to size to minimum SAMMI specs and that seems to have done the trick. I'm still crimping to get the bullet to stay put while loading fron a mag on my AR. I pulled apart a bunch of different makes of ammo and all appear to have some type of crimp. I'll shoot some back to back against the Black Hills and see how it performs. Thanks for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number99 Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 I chucked mine up in a drill and turned it down by hand with a piece of kinda fine emery cloth. Works pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp73 Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 I chucked mine up in a drill and turned it down by hand with a piece of kinda fine emery cloth. Works pretty good. What does it messure now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickB Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 I was told by Dillon that removing the ball from the resizing die increases neck tension... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Exactly why I full length resize/decap/expander ball first, THEN run thru the dillon trim die, THEN don't do anything with the neck other than a slight bell for bullet seating. the dillon trim die (which is a full length size die as well) leaves the neck tension tight, which is what you want... jj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickB Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 In my 650 setup, I use a Dillon carbide FL resizing die with the expander ball removed in station 1, then through a RT1200/trim die in station 3, then a lee neck expaning die in station 5 for a very slight bell. I tried a RCBS neck sizer/decapper in station 1 but found much more consistent sizing and shoulder setting using the FL sizing die in station 1. Mick quote name='RiggerJJ' timestamp='1333483818' post='1675213'] Exactly why I full length resize/decap/expander ball first, THEN run thru the dillon trim die, THEN don't do anything with the neck other than a slight bell for bullet seating. the dillon trim die (which is a full length size die as well) leaves the neck tension tight, which is what you want... jj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leemoe83 Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Typical neck tension for an autoloader should be around .003", bolt gun .002", bolt gun for seating on the lands .001" (for seating final bullet depth with the bolt). This is just the neck tension not counting any crimp. I have found that .003" interference in my Bushmaster works just fine no crimp. So reloading a .224" bullet you should be looking for about .221" ID at the neck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Force Posted April 27, 2012 Share Posted April 27, 2012 I'm having the exact same problem with .223. Snagged about 500 once fired Federal ( FC 07) brass the other day when I re-qualified. Prepped them just like I always do on my 550B using Dillon 3 die set.. Tumble,size/decap,tumble, check in case gage. Nothing needed trimmed. All cases ranged around 1.75 Sizing die is set to bump back around .003-4. Bullets I was using was some bulk 55gr FMJ w/ cannilure. Was getting inconsistent OAL at first. Checked bullets with digi caliper. Tip to cann and base to cann measured different. Also bullet length varied. Crap, cheap ass bullets. Decided to sort and load a few. Neck tension seemed to not be enough. Some would not set back, others would push right in with a finger. Tried light crimp to severe crimp. Same results. Tried some Win .223 brass with the same results. Tried 55gr and 60 gr Vmax bullets, same results. Gave up after about 3 hours of fiddling with it. Gonna strip seating die tonight and measure expander ball. Weird thing is I have loaded over 3k of .223 with this same set up with no problems. Maybe expander ball is gunked up with lube??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv Z Posted April 27, 2012 Author Share Posted April 27, 2012 (edited) I ended up going with a RCBS base size die to get to the minimum spec on the neck. That and a Lee FCD seems to do the trick. I shot about 100 of them at our last 3 gun match. There just doesn't seem to be enough tension to hold them without a crimp. I must have made about 100 dummy rounds with every type of crimp with both the Dillon and Lee dies to get it to stay. So far so good... Edited April 27, 2012 by Marv Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Force Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 UPDATE: Measured the carbide expander ball last night when I got home from work. Ball measured .223. Removed the ball and screwed the decapping pin back on. Re-sized 5 pieces of FC 07 brass and seated some 55gr fmj w/cann. Neck tension was greatly improved! OAL stayed the same even after attempting to push the bullet in on the side of my bench. Gave the dummy rounds a very slight crimp using the Dillon crimp die. Only bad thing is I now have to re-lube/size/tumble all my brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now