rhgunguy Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 I was curious, having a SP-01 Shadow Custom for USPSA, I had thought about trying to make weight into IDPA, but how would the ergomonics of the Shadow SP-01 and CZ85C compare? i.e. could you have the Shadow for USPSA and CZ85C for IPDA and go fairly easily between the two? Ideally, it'd be nice to have the same for both, but I'm wondering how having 2 different firearms might work. Get the 75 Shadow if you want one gun for both. It'd be a lot cheaper than a Custom and a Combat too. Well, I have the Shadow already from the custom shop. I thought I'd be interested in reducing the weight to get into IDPA SSP, but maybe I'm just trying to talk myself into another toy - the 85C. I know there are subtle differences, just curious how easy it'd be to go from one to the other in practice and competitions. Sorry, misunderstood. If you run the same sights and grips on both and have a comparable trigger you shouldn't have a problem. Then again I shoot a G19 in SSP and a Custom inproduction, but I don't think I'm good enough for it to hamper me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ck1 Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 the difference between an fpb and non fpb trigger at their best is maybe 020 or 030 at the most on the reset, a hair. If you mean .030", I don't know if I agree, the difference in reset length between my SP-01 and Shadow is at least a 1/4" or more (.250"+)... that said, the Shadow and it's shorter reset hasn't instantly turned me into the second coming of TGO compared to how well I shot with my SP-01, and I can't say if the difference is unequivocally worth it's price considering what a Shadow costs over an SP-01 and comp hammer, but, it is nicer, and I'm pretty sure it doesn't hurt either . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningsquirrels Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 i was talking about custom guns with trigger jobs. or even DIY jobs. i've touched a lot of stock, DIY'd, and angus/mink guns and there is a difference between the three, but the #1 difference is still the shooter. all said and done, i'm sitting here with my fpb'd and long-reset/no-trigger-job sp-01 and i'm still not out-shooting it in the year i had it lol. i guess my point is that equipment matters up to a certain point, but so long as it runs and cycles there's a lot of other things to be more worried about. once you've been shooting any CZ for a while you'll learn what you like and need, and the few hundred bucks that swings either way is negligible compared to everything else we spend in this sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ck1 Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 Totally agree, Indian > Arrow. Also totally agree about sweating a few hundred bucks savings compared to how many dollars get burned up in ammo, range/match fees, sheesh, these days even gas driving back and forth to matches and such... Everything is relative, and really, for the price as compared to performance, even the top of the food chain CZ Custom shop guns are genuine bargains compared to many of the platforms being run out there... for the dollar, any of the CZ's are well worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningsquirrels Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 Yup. What I tell new shooters frequently is that the gun is the cheapest part of this sport. I.e. custom gun or not, what is the difference, really? Two or three range trips? One major match outing? Ever priced out an EAA or 2011 for limited? Yikes! That's one reason I am seriously considering shooting limited minor and just loading up my mags haha. Unless one of you guys can find me a 40 upper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ck1 Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 No doubt! It's funny, when the CTS .40 showed up I was like "$2000 for a CZ seems steep...", a buddy of mine who shoots custom built 6" 2011's and who's been imressed with my CZ's was like "a custom gun assembled by actual humans that'll feed the shorter rounds without the drama and comes with 3 mags that'll work and that won't need $200 tuned mags to be match-ready... you're crazy, that's a steal...". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 equipment matters to the point that you run a reliable platform. a gun that will run, good mags, good ammo and good technique will take you a lot further in any of the games than any top of the line gun. most people buy the spendy gun and then feed it cheap sh*t ammo and bitch that gun won't shoot. just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningsquirrels Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 LOL STU!!! you hit the head on the nail. i spent my first two years in uspsa with guns that frequently jammed and i constantly fiddled with. as a result, i classified straight into C and never budged. got me that sp-01, then i immediately broke out of C and made M in a year. now i'm screwed! i shoulda stuck to the broken guns. yep, i "know of" a CZ limited rig. the way it was "built"... used sp-01, FO sights, AL grips, wide rocker safety, SA trigger, it was under $700 for a lim minor gun. the mags were 'pricey' at $60 a pop, but it was only 900 when the dust settled. so solid and crisp, shoots like a bat outta hell! just as accurate as another big name lim minor 2011 someone else i know shoots. hell, it was more than triple that price! i wish i could get another TS for limited again. i just don't want to have to sit on my hands for half a year (or sell the two guns i own) to save up for it, lmao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grimaldi Posted July 2, 2011 Author Share Posted July 2, 2011 Well, I just found a deal for a lightly used SP-01 tactical with 3 magazines for $500...seems god enough for me! I think it will be a long time before the slight difference in trigger pull between a shadow and standard (eventually with comp hammer and such) becomes an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningsquirrels Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 tactical sounds like it might be a decocker? make sure you get a manual safety version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grimaldi Posted July 2, 2011 Author Share Posted July 2, 2011 Why? What's wrong with the decocker version? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningsquirrels Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 manual or decocker, it's your preference. they can both be made into nice triggers. pro - you start from a half cock so shorter DA pull, and you don't have to manually lower the hammer. con - depending on your grip style, competitive shooters with very high grips tend to ride the decocker. you'll see some decocker guns with shaved down decocking levers on them. that, and if oyu want to do any work on them down the road, it's a completely different mechanism than the manual safety guns. i recommend the manual safety guns because you can install the competition hammer which is the biggest upgrade you can get on the CZ. otherwise, there are those (like schmeky of cajun gun works on the CZF forums) who sell pre-massaged hammers and sears for you that you can drop in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 tactical is a decocker version of the SP01 you can get really good triggers on decocker guns with a little effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningsquirrels Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 +1. they take a little more work to assemble and disassemble the bits of the action, just know what your preferences are between the manual and decocker. that said, i carry a decocker with a very nice trigger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 yeah.... after doing several decocker trigger jobs and test-firing them, I have finally gotten to the point where I kind of like them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningsquirrels Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 i thought about deleting the decocking lever before, but now that canik has me interested now where i can have my manual safety and alloy, too. have you gotten to play with it yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 i thought about deleting the decocking lever before, but now that canik has me interested now where i can have my manual safety and alloy, too. have you gotten to play with it yet? yeah...pretty neat little alloy gun. I did a trigger job on one and it came out very well. it has diferent pin sizes than the CZ, the firing pin block works more like the Tanfoglio version, but everything else is very close to a CZ. They shoot very well, right now its in the shop getting some Heinie sights put on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 (edited) For you slow builders Cajun Custom Gun Works. A friend has a 75B and the double action and single action is way better than my CZ Shadow Custom Shop. WAY BETTER. I'm thinking of getting mine Cajunized. But for you do it yourselfers they sell kits! I don't mangle my own metal. Edited July 18, 2011 by CocoBolo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grimaldi Posted July 18, 2011 Author Share Posted July 18, 2011 Actually got a cajun gun works competition hammer and spring set for a used SP-01 tactical I got. It's giving me all sorts of jamming issues currently (working through a checklist of potential problems) but once I get it up and running properly, we'll see how much they improve things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 The CGW stuff is pretty nice stuff. I have done a couple of guns with the decocker hammer/sear and for a safety gun. Play with his DA reduction kit right now and it looks really promising adding it to a full action job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1SOW Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 (edited) I'm looking at getting into USPSA production shooting a little more seriously and I've always been a fan of the CZ line. My wife, of course, would kill me if I went all out and purchased a Shadow from the get go, but other threads in this forum have made it sound like it's tough to buy a current 75 and slowly upgrade it to "Shadow" level. Let me first say, I'm old, retired and only a 'C' shooter who really likes USPSA and Steel shooting. I started with a plain 75B (now well over 30K rds) and DIY slowly added: Comp Sights, Aluminum Grips, Reloading my own 9mm, 13# Hammer Spring (-1 coil), 11# recoil spring, extended Firing Pin, lightened trigger spring and various polishing of all the friction areas; then added Cajun Gun Works: disconector, machined & modified Shadow Hammer, (these lightened and moved the trigger back about 5mm in DA) and an adjustable trigger reset screw. My son has a Custom Shadow and so does Coco bolo here on the forum. Both will tell you my DA is very noticeably lighter than their Shadows. The SA is also really light, but I don't have a trigger gage. The 75B reset is still long and the beavertail doesn't let me get the higher grip. For the draw and transitions the 75B is faster for me with less weight up front, but that's just me. I wouldn't trade even for my son's Shadow, but I do borrow his 19+1 mags for steel shoots. One thing I wanted and can't do on the 75B, I wanted the mag release on the strong side but it can't be switched. Either way you go, you won't be sorry. The 75 is a fine platform. Edited July 20, 2011 by 1SOW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 Actually got a cajun gun works competition hammer and spring set for a used SP-01 tactical I got. It's giving me all sorts of jamming issues currently (working through a checklist of potential problems) but once I get it up and running properly, we'll see how much they improve things. I seriously doubt that the hammer and spring have anything to do with your issue, seriously. Here is the short list: 80% chance its your ammo - Run a box of good factory ammo thru it or Winchester White Box. 15% chance its your mag or mags - try a known working mag. 5% chance its the gun. Start by taking the extractor out and polishing the sides that rub the slide (means just remove the burned on powder residue, clean the cavity. Make sure no idiot has rounded off the edeges or is it broken etc, is the spring good etc. Put a little clp on it and put it back in. Try it. If its not one of those do a post with pictures of what it is doing. Good Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grimaldi Posted July 22, 2011 Author Share Posted July 22, 2011 Wasn't trying to say I thought the hammer and springs were causing the problem, just that I had ordered them but didn't want to install them until I figured out what was causing the jamming issue. Should get a new magazine and stronger magazine springs any day now, so I'll be able to test that out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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