gr7070 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 (edited) however they need a BUG division that is recognized at normal matches, that would bring out all the "carry guns" I guarantee you would begin to see the J frames come out of the woodworks if they knew they did not have to compete against the 686 etc. also see alot more of the "sub-compact" pistols that we all carry I don't see the j frames not coming out for lack of a division to be competitive in. The j frames stay at home or in their carry holster for the same reason the full-sized revolvers do, because they're revolvers. If people were worried about being competitive most would never bring a wheel gun, which most don't. There aren't enough revolvers at matches to compare yourself against other revolvers so we're left to compete against autos anyway. With that in mind nothing is stopping anyone from bringing a j frame or l frame, but the revolver itself. Edited May 11, 2011 by gr7070 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBorland Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 however they need a BUG division that is recognized at normal matches, that would bring out all the "carry guns" I guarantee you would begin to see the J frames come out of the woodworks if they knew they did not have to compete against the 686 etc. also see alot more of the "sub-compact" pistols that we all carry I don't see the j frames not coming out for lack of a division to be competitive in. The j frames stay at home or in their carry holster for the same reason the full-sized revolvers do, because they're revolvers. If people were worried about being competitive most would never bring a wheel gun, which most don't. There aren't enough revolvers at matches to compare yourself against other revolvers so we're left to compete against autos anyway. With that in mind nothing is stopping anyone from bringing a j frame or l frame, but the revolver itself. Yes and no to both of you. At our local Pocket Carry Competitions, roughly half of the shooters use a revolver, many of whom normally shoot a semi-auto in IDPA. But the large revolver turnout isn't because pocket guns have their own division - it's because they have their own match. While Mr. Phinney points to their absence among LEO and military as proof of the revolver's irrelevance, their popularity at these PCCA matches tells quite a different tale, and speaks strongly to their enduring relevance among civilians and non-LEOs. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Model19 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Being in the retail holster business, I can say that Chief Specials and the like are still very popular carry pieces. I do a decent business in holsters for them. I would also point out the strong sales of The Judge as another indicator. Here in Maine we still have quite a few revolvers seeing use as sidearms in hunting season as well. One IDPA shooter here uses his Ruger just for that very reason. Geoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.W. Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I find it pretty ironic that this article (column?) appears in an issue that has fully half of its back cover advertising Smith and Wesson revolvers that are produced specifically for this game. (one of them is even named after the division). I bet the S&W exec. who bought that space is wondering how many sales they lost from people not buying revolvers because they think IDPA is considering eliminating them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirveyr Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 This is from the IDPA Forum : I can wholeheartedly assure everyone that there is no interest or intent in discontinuing the revolver divisions. The opinions in the article are strictly those of the author and in no way, shape or form are the opinions of IDPA Headquarters. It has provided an interesting discussion though :-).Joyce Wilson Executive Director International Defensive Pistol Association Rumors are kewl! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forrest Halley Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 I don't see the j frames not coming out for lack of a division to be competitive in. The j frames stay at home or in their carry holster for the same reason the full-sized revolvers do, because they're revolvers. With that in mind nothing is stopping anyone from bringing a j frame or l frame, but the revolver itself. Who's side are you on mister?? I find it pretty ironic that this article (column?) appears in an issue that has fully half of its back cover advertising Smith and Wesson revolvers that are produced specifically for this game. (one of them is even named after the division). I bet the S&W exec. who bought that space is wondering how many sales they lost from people not buying revolvers because they think IDPA is considering eliminating them. Marketing genius at work there! After all that trouble they went through defending the internal locks...that would not strike as a smart move to even consider printing such a statement without a direct rebutal comment. Indoor Nationals? Venue? Sponsor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NC Shooting Sport Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 I just got back from a trip where I attended an event on another hobby of mine and on the day I left I got my Tactical Journal, so I took it along to read while I was int eh hotel, and I read the article everyone is talking about, and my first reaction was "what the H3!! are they doing!!!" Maybe it is just me but I really don't get why they want to remove the Revo division and combine it with another. I personally shoot CDP and ESP, and some of my closest friends shoot Revo and most of the time they kick my but, but in the same match I beat some of the ESP shooters, so what is the next thing, they are going combine CDP in to ESP, or worse yet, they will have a unlimited division where you can load up the higher capacity mags (15+) and have stages over 16 rounds to force those competitors to reload? That sounds more like USPSA to me. Don't get me wrong, I love competing in both IDPA and USPSA, at local and higher levels, and the one thing that I like is that they are two different games. I think that if they want more people competing in Revo classes they need to do something to promote that class, or they could use the BUG class or even a subcompact class where J frames can compete with G27/26's and PM9s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Z Sr Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 This makes my head hurt, I'm cleaning my 686 to shoot at the ZSA match tonight (our first classifier match) and the plan is to be high overall. Not sure if that will work out, but I will post a link of the results soon, and let everyone see how the revos and bottom feeders compare in the classifier. As stated above, there are different games, play what you want and be safe and have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glockster35 Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 I take offense to the bottom feeder comment John. Wish I could shoot tonight, but will likely be at the hospital. That and I don't want to get in a position where the Drama Queen pushes my buttons, I don't need the added stress right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Z Sr Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 The bottom feeder comment is in jest and to be taken that way, heck, I've been known to shoot a bottom feeder and venture to "The Dark Side" of "Sir Miss Alot" guns myself from time to time. Hope all works out with the health issues, see ya soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmorris Posted May 14, 2011 Share Posted May 14, 2011 Maybe SSR and BUG could be combined into a single, new division, for the purposes of including it in major matches? Six shots, minor power, with 4" barrels for revos and 3.5" for autos? Major matches with nothing but 5 round stages...no thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdmoore Posted May 15, 2011 Share Posted May 15, 2011 Maybe SSR and BUG could be combined into a single, new division, for the purposes of including it in major matches? Six shots, minor power, with 4" barrels for revos and 3.5" for autos? Major matches with nothing but 5 round stages...no thanks. exactly. They'd have to work in something to keep it interesting. Allow reloads from static positions (leave speed strips, mags or whatever on a bbl) or something. The single best reason to ditch revolvers is to get more variety in stage design. Why oh why must so many stages be 12 rounds? Just kidding. But seriously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forrest Halley Posted May 16, 2011 Share Posted May 16, 2011 The bottom feeder comment is in jest and to be taken that way, heck, I've been known to shoot a bottom feeder and venture to "The Dark Side" of "Sir Miss Alot" guns myself from time to time. Hope all works out with the health issues, see ya soon I recently went to a steel match and the "Sir Miss Alot" guns were running as fast as they could pull the trigger on the array, sights forsaken. I couldn't match their cyclic rate, but I did beat some of their stage times! Shoot six, reload, repeat as necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dlebowski Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 It took a while for me to get my copy, I've been looking forward to reading it based on comments in this thread. Not being a revolver guy, I didn't get too worked up about the proposals floated, but it is interesting to me that the author is also suggesting that the non-1911 type pistols that currently can compete in CDP be moved to their own division, keeping CDP 1911 "pure". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircooled6racer Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Hello: If they want more revolver shooters then why not allow 5" revolvers in ESR so more people can play? That way you would get more USPSA shooters involved. Maybe have a catch-all division that allows 7 and 8 shot revolvers also to get the ICORE guys involved? Just my thoughts of what may work. Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glockster35 Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Agreed Aircooled6racer. What they need is to start paying attention to the input from revolver shooters themselves. I have a lot of issues with the rules in IDPA, I think a lot of what we do is downright silly. But I do enjoy the sport, and will continue to shoot it until my 3 year membership expires. Then if appropriate changes have not been made, I will head back to USPSA and shoot production there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1911 Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Hello: If they want more revolver shooters then why not allow 5" revolvers in ESR so more people can play? For the same reason that they banned 5" revolvers in the first place -- they are darn hard to conceal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forrest Halley Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 Hello: If they want more revolver shooters then why not allow 5" revolvers in ESR so more people can play? That way you would get more USPSA shooters involved. Maybe have a catch-all division that allows 7 and 8 shot revolvers also to get the ICORE guys involved? Just my thoughts of what may work. Thanks, Eric This is a great idea. With the holster requirements that IDPA has the longer barrels will not be a hinderance at all. The 7 and 8 shot guns should also be allowed to compete and load full and shoot six to keep it even or give them a different category all together like Custom Defensive Revolver. Agreed Aircooled6racer. What they need is to start paying attention to the input from revolver shooters themselves. I have a lot of issues with the rules in IDPA, I think a lot of what we do is downright silly. But I do enjoy the sport, and will continue to shoot it until my 3 year membership expires. Then if appropriate changes have not been made, I will head back to USPSA and shoot production there. I feel that they do not take enough input from the membership. I also believe the (man) who makes the rules and interpretations needs to be a five gun master and have a working knowledge of the firearms used in the discipline. Sorry, but someone who is a sharpshooter in any division should not be making or cloudifying rules. They simply do not have the grasp of the game. I feel that IDPA started out as an everyman's game, but got arrogant with the rules, "clarifications," and equipment restrictions. The "if we bury our heads in the sand they won't see us," mentality prevails, as the will of the members is ignored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted May 26, 2011 Share Posted May 26, 2011 And on that note, since we are descending to simply complaining about the Rule Book, I'm going to go ahead and close this one down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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