BerettaRacer Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 In USPSA at LAMR is there a rule specifically against direct chamber loading? When shooting my Beretta EII in Production, when I think the extra shot my be necessary I generally drop a round in the pipe, close the slide, then drop in a 10 rnd mag. I occasionlly get grief from 1911/2011 shooters or RO's saying this is illegal but they cannot show me a rule in the book. I understand that this is not a reccommended practice with a 1911/2011 but this is a non issue on a Beretta with a spring loaded extractor. I'm not looking for opinions here, but a hard and fast rule, as in rule xx.x.x.x I've heard the general rule of unsafe gun handling, but to my thinking that doesn't hold because a Beretta is designed to be directly chamber loaded, as chamber loading was a requirement by the US military in the decision to adopt the Beretta as the US military combat handgun, so I'm using the gun within it's design paramaters. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dunn Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 No rule against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 My only concern would be safety. With anything other then a Beretta and its open slide, there may be some odd movements to get it in there. I know that I would feel nervous around someone trying to do that through the narrow ejection port of a CZ, for example. That might result in treating different shooters with different guns in different ways, and I can see why people wouldn't want that. I dont think there is a rule against it, but would it kill ya to keep a spare mag in your back pocket just for this reason ? Vlad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dunn Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 If the muzzle is in a safe direction, why would you feel nervous? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 Sorry, I should have been more clear. I tried this with my CZ and snap caps a few times. And I had a hard time not waving the muzzle around. I can keep it in the general direction of the backstop, but it would still look kinda bad. On a stock CZ the ejection port is just small enough that I have a hard time putting my index finger through it, with the pad of my finger facing the chamber. Trying to feed a round that way, will involve holding the gun I my left hand, and moving it at odd angles as I try to drop a round in the chamber, without droping in on floor through the mag well, or getting it jammed, because you can not just place it in the chamber by hand, when you can't fir more then a finger through the ejection port. And oh yeah, I forgat to mention, you can not see the chamber unless you keep the gun at another funny angle. Again, this is handgun specific, and the Beretta is the easiest gun in the world to do this with. And there is not rule against it as far as I can tell. I just don't see a need, if there is a possibility that some new guy with fat finger is going to fumble theirs so bad that everyone around them will hit the floor. All I am saying, I can see why RO's would be nervous. Just my two worn pennies. Vlad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garfield Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 they cannot show me a rule in the book. Probably because there is no rule against it ! For IPSC I am sure there is no rule against it, I expect this to be the same for USPSA, but I am too lazy to go through the whole book right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnL Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 I guess I'd be suprised if someone did this but as long as it was done with the muzzle pointed down range and the finger was off the trigger I wouldn't have any problem with it. As has been pointed out there is no rule against it but IMHO it is safer and easier to do from a magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LPatterson Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 The Beretta is such a different bread of animal with it's completly exposed barrel that top loading directly into the chamber is not a problem. So as long as the muzzle stays pointed in a safe direction there is not a problem that a RO should complain about. I have a lot more problem with open shooters trying to seat a big stick with the muzzle pointed 20 feet over the berm. 92 Vertec with an 1/8" sanded off a "D" spring but an LTT is in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajarrel Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 If you have ever had a slide try to chamber your finger because, during the unusual handling of the gun, the slide release is hit, you will understand why you might not want your finger in the chamber when it happens. Just a thought from one with a scar on my finger from a shotgun bolt during my youth. dj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscbigdawg Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 As I understand it, you're just going for 10+1. With that, and let me preface this by saying I don't think you're wrong, just offering an alternative method, try this: Seat a mag and chamber a round. Flip the safety on, and retrieve the magazine. Holster the gun. Take an extra round with you, maybe in your pocket and top off the mag. Re-insert the mag. Basically, it's what I do for my 1911 when shooting L10. You have 10+1 and the RO can easily see what's going on in front of you. There's no fear of the slide slamming shut on your finger, etc., etc. Again, I'm not disagreeing with you, just offering an alternative. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Seat a mag and chamber a round.Flip the safety on, and retrieve the magazine. Holster the gun. Take an extra round with you, maybe in your pocket and top off the mag. Re-insert the mag. I know there are some very well-qualified people - Robbie Leatham, for instance - who do that way. Pesonally, I like to use a Barney mag to chamber load, pop that out and simply insert a full mag before holstering. Much less gun manipulation required, gets the job done faster and easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgary Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 Under the upcoming USPSA rules, you will be able to avoid that whole mess. The USPSA Board decided to clarify the rules for Production and Limited-10. You will be able to stick 11 in a magazine, put the magazine in the gun, and chamber the round, without penalty, as long as there are no more than 10 rounds in the mag when the buzzer goes off. Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 Until Wilson Combat comes out with the 11-round singlestack .45 ACP magazine, I guess I'll just have to stick to my old procedure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wide45 Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 I don't have any 10 round mags. Still have several of the old 11 round units that the 170mm rule was rumoured to have been made for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Pinto Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Hi guys, Better late than never - I confirm that there's no IPSC rule against chambering a round as described in the opening post, however the vast majority of competitors use a spare ("barney") magazine to add the "+1" round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted February 19, 2004 Share Posted February 19, 2004 That's me: "the vast majority of competitors." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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