Robco

I agree strongly with my Texas bro, johnsons1480. I have not tried any of these game/tools, so bear that in mind. But I think many have pointed out here that getting better at a game that is not shooting, is not likely a winner on any type of cost/benefit analysis. If I understand what you are trying to do J, is to increase you stage analysis skills, then I would think = what better way to do that than by actually doing stage analysis practice? Along the lines of stage analysis skills, the first thing would be to define the goal, and then to apply a standardized, regular process of approaching each and every stage to be analyzed. Goal = most points per second (HF). This has to also be weighed against risk management considerations (N/S, Hard cover-partials, forced to leave a position on steel, critical timing sequences based on an activation, etc.) as well as your own strengths and weaknesses. Here is my stage analysis process in short. 1) Read the Stage description - note start position, gun condition, scoring (VA count, etc.) types of targets and any special mind-screw stuff like holding a brief case, etc, target counts and round count. 2) WALK the stage without even putting up the "airgun," or making ANY presumptions yet. Locate the targets and make sure none are hidden and not seen by you. Go behind the walls and look there too. 3) Determine, relaxed again, where some targets can be seen from or not, and what locations are therefore mandatory - i.e., you cannot see a target(s) from anywhere else. This means you HAVE to go to these locations. 4) walk thru again noting where each target can be seen from, walking from start location thru each mandatory location, beginning to end. By now you should be getting a good idea of where each shooting position will be. 5) Now walk thru noting which targets you will engage at each location. Now it is breaking the stage into PARTS or SEGMENTS based on locations. Building blocks you will merge together in later steps. 6) Now you are ready to consider the most efficient way to shoot this stage. You have identified which targets to engage from each location and it is becoming a pretty solid plan. 7) Pick your identification marks at each location. I.e., straddle this joint in the foot fault stick, or right foot at the edge of this port or wall edge, etc. Consider where you are coming from and going to at each of these positions and locations. 8) Start figuring out the movement now - HOW you will move between location 1 and 2, and then on to 3, as this will help you know what position to be in at each, for entrances and exit efficiency. Do not get hung up on perfect stances as you can shoot equally accurately and fast with either foot forward, period. Place your feet where and how that you can leave fastest. 9) Now put it all together rehearsing in REAL TIME, not 2X or 4X superman movement and transition and split speeds. You should now be figuring out how to most EFFICIENTLY get from the first to the last Location in the stage, time wise. 10) figure out which targets you can shoot while leaving a position and location, which you can shoot on the move between locations, and which you can shoot entering a location. These are huge time saving possibilities. 11) Rehearse the whole stage now acting as if you are actually shooting the stage. Always have EXACT target shooting orders in each location and array. Do not leave that up in the air. Which will you shoot first, second third and last before moving on to next location? Can you see one target while entering the position and can safely engage it in the Alpha before coming to a stop in the new location, while "settling in" to it? 12) Where will I reload? This should be the LAST thing to consider, regardless of your division. I see more lower cap shooters making this their main priority and it is simply the wrong way to approach it. SOMETIMES you might shoot one target from a different location to avoid a standing reload, or go to one location or start differently if it is advantageous, but it is still an after thought, not a threshold criteria. 13) finally DECIDE on your plan and do not change it. Time to now PROGRAM and memorize it all thru actual walk thru and then mental rehearsals until you know it in detail and can "shoot" it with your eyes closed in great detail. Anyway, that is all just off the top of my head. Probably some things I left out. But just think of it as a foot race, which it is often, from point A to Point B, with stops along the route, and you want to be shooting as much of the time as you can (i.e. you want to minimize the time when you are NOT shooting) because when you are not shooting, and the clock is running, points are being robbed away from you at the rate of your HF on the stage! Thoughts?

Exactly my first thought. Shorter trigger. Therefore the trigger finger is effectively going in to the trigger guard a little too far. Just a guess with the evidence provided.

HAHA! Take her out to the range and burn some rounds with her! She might get hooked! Finally got my wife shooting 3 months ago, after she has done our club stats and admin and website for 3 years in Cody, without participating! It can be done! Oh yeah, I forgot to mention this above. When I learn the stages so well ahead of my match day, I get to see all the squad members in AWE of me like I am some kind of genius prodigy who just does not even once walk the stage during the 5 minutes, walks up when on deck, walks thru perfectly and smoothly the first time and I am ready to shoot! HA! Really screws with their minds when they are still trying to verify even where all the targets are when the 5 minutes is up. No different than the kid in school who always appears smart, simply because they actually DID their homework. Duh...... paying the dues and price to be as ready as possible on game day is not rocket science.

HAHA! Take her out to the range and burn some rounds with her! She might get hooked! Finally got my wife shooting 3 months ago, after she has done our club stats and admin and website for 3 years in Cody, without participating! It can be done!

Good post teros135. One correction, I am sure you meant this and just mis-wrote above =, one needs to be shooting perhaps 75% Alphas, NOT 75% of available points possible. Any shooter should be endeavoring to shoot 90 to 95% of available points possible. Yes, you're right. It's early here... Another resource is the USPSA match results, which have stats for individual shooters that show how we did on each stage, plus an analysis that includes the percent of total points shot, both with and without penalties. Very helpful. Take a look at the leaders (the GMs) - for instance, Lesgar Murdock shot 91% of possible points at very high speed at the Florida State Championshp. That's DVM! Good point teros135. I always use the USPSA results page, under individual results to analyze with (assuming the results are posted there) and the same for Practiscore results (IF they were uploaded from an Apple device that is - cannot get individual results if it was uploaded from Android! They still have not changed that). And absent either of those available, I put the results into my own spreadsheet. Just takes a few minutes, but you need to have all your individual stage hits data to do this well, and unless you somehow capture it at the time you are being scored, you may not have your hits data later). What I look at is my overall hits distribution, how many A, B/C, D and Mikes, the % of possible points shot, before and after penalties and my overall match time. I then compare my match time to the division winner if they are a top tier GM. And express my time as a % of time I took MORE than the winner's time. If winner took 200 seconds in the match, and I took 240 seconds, then I took 20% more time than the winner. I track this number more than any other stat in my development. The accuracy indications can be skewed big time by, for example, a match with tons of head shots and N/S risks, meaning you are going to be giving up a lot of A's to avoid risk, making your points shot lower than usual in the match, or I could have shot 58 additional shots, like I actually did in the Florida Open ARGHHHHH!, which of course is both going to increase my accuracy stats, but at the great expense of so much wasted/added time. See my point? One stat alone can lie big time. So since we are in the points per second business, either side of that equation can be pushed to skew the outcome. We could shoot 99% in any match we want to do so in, but I would end up shooting 50% of the winner by so doing (by taking forever to aim every shot to guaranty all A hits). Or I could get my match and stage times down to top GM speeds, but in the process, I would win or be top 3 on one stage I would get lucky on (hero or zero) and totally trash most of the others with so many bad hits and penalties that I would end up lucky to be at 50% of the winner. Here are the links to my Practiscore individual results report for a club match at Rio Salado yesterday. And below that is the USPSA version report. https://practiscore.com/results.php?uuid=fa4a7c37-304c-43fa-9af7-443221cd6ff9 (Go to the bottom left where there "View Individual Result" then just type cook in the window and select me in drop down) Below is the USPSA results version. Note the stats at the lower left bottom as teros135 mentioned. http://www.uspsa.org/uspsa-display-match-results-detail.php?action=summary&indx=13802&compid=30

nimitz: I agree. I do talk at matches when I am not coming up any time soon as shooter, and I find it makes me perform better simply because (apparently) it forces me to lighten up a little and not be so serious. I am obviously balls deep into this game (In case you have not noticed HA! ) But I do not let anyone interfere with my own game. That takes a lot of diligence and some diplomacy but is a social skill I possess. In example, I am good friends with Travis Tomasie (T), and know how to respect top performers' on match day. The superstars get hounded to death by well - meaning but inconsiderate aspiring shooters so badly that it is worse than paparazzi!T has learned to trust my stage strategy/analysis so much that when he arrives at a big match, if we run into each other walking the stages or shooting, he asks me if, for example, there are any "memory" stages or tough ones he needs to look at. Usually, I have already learned them all so I give him my rundown. He then can spend only 2 minutes on the stage and either use mine or alter it, without having to spend a half hour he does not have available to scout it or all of them out. As most know, T is so damn nice and polite, that he gets taken advantage of and imposed on often (my observation not any whining from T). At the Florida open 2 weeks ago, we met and he asked about the stages as usual, and I said let's go walk them. Well the morning squads were all shooting already and the afternoon squads had already arrived, so there were 400 shooters up and down the range. He said, could we just go over them there, where we were standing, out of the main path and visibility, because if we walk the stages he will end up talking to folks the whole time and of course, he would never be rude or hurt anyone's feelings telling them to FO, he is busy! So I drew them in the sand, literally and explained the cruxes and choices on the several stages he could not instantly internalize. Now I am not bragging or name dropping here, as you should know with me by now. Just making a few points. 1) I am pretty good at stage analysis, 2) I am trusted by T - he has always shot every stage exactly as I did or one of the alternatives I identified to him (only a lot better than I shot them !!) 3) T still rehearsed each stage MANY times after confirming he liked my plan. If the top shooters have to do this, then who the hell do all the rest of the pack think they are NOT doing this themselves? Another point of view, and a very valid one and relevant to me, is that if you are investing the time and money to shoot a big match, presumably having to travel and stay in hotels to do so, then why wouldn't you do everything you could to make the few minutes you will actually be shooting the match, optimized and maximized! Spend a month training for a big match, spend 4 days at the match itself, with all the travel and ammo costs, and then you will spend 3 or 4 MINUTES actually performing. Hmm. I think it is just plain stupid not to leverage your investment by learning the stages a bit. Even the GREAT shooters have brain farts when they don't. My good friend Manny Bragg, forgot a whole 3 target array in the Florida State in January. He won almost every stage in the match but that one stage cost him the win. I bet he was too busy to spend the time learning the stages, because these top guys can analyze a stage WAY faster than we can. Even though they arrive at the exact same plan I do, they do it in 3 minutes where it took me 15 minutes (to decide on plan, NOT including memorizing it). It is the same as a shooter not checking to see that his mag is fully loaded before stepping to the line. We all laugh when they run dry after 5 rounds during a stage, but what is the difference in that or forgetting targets? None, they are the same - lack of preparation and process. Watch Todd Jarrett during his make ready process. He drives the RO's crazy. Todd will load and then drop every mag on his belt during make ready period, always, even if it is a 12 round stage and he has 4 20 round mags on his belt! I love it. And I do the same, at least for the mag I am starting with. Learned it from him. Some fat ass might have stepped on that mag while pasting and it could be deformed and not drop out. Only one way to know! Or my favorite, after seeing a guy have 3 gun malfunctions on one stage, say that they have not cleaned their guns in 6 months, as if bragging about that! Hmmmm. Stay happy then................ like this was "unavoidable" and not the shooter's fault! Anyway, it just amazes me the gap between talking the talk, about being "serious" about competing in our sport, and the relative few who Walk the Walk. Cleaning your gun or making sure your mags are fully loaded and KNOWING the stage completely are not "skill" issues, they are attitude and process issues. Don't do them at the cost of your competitiveness. Wonder what their carry guns will do if they ever need them?

Good post teros135. One correction, I am sure you meant this and just mis-wrote above =, one needs to be shooting perhaps 75% Alphas, NOT 75% of available points possible. Any shooter should be endeavoring to shoot 90 to 95% of available points possible.

Great stuff AusPPC. I am finally beginning to get what Brian refers to about shooting "in the present". It has taken me a long time and a long journey to finally understand it. Bottom line is = if you are not calling each shot, then you are not shooting in the present. Because to call a shot, one must SEE the shot while it is being released. And that IS the present, to a millisecond. So as a single pre-shooting thought, or even one to occupy your conscious mind with while shooting, (Steve Anderson said this) = think only about calling each shot during match performance. Thanks!

Dude, how the heck did you become a GM with only 2K live fire rounds fired in practice! WOW! I am in the midst right now, in my development, of figuring out exactly what you stated Donovan. I have had GM skills in many areas of performance, for some time now, and M class in all, yet I continually sabotage my match performance by doing other than focusing on shooting only as fast as I can see. Obviously all the stuff you wrote about - trying to speed up, focusing on non-shooting aspects and then "forgetting" the shooting part, putting too much pressure on myself to do well in a match I have trained so hard for, etc. When we try and work so hard to improve, at the same time we are actually building higher skill sets, we are also putting pressure on ourselves that will likely prevent our actually using and benefiting from the skills and hard work. The more ambitious a shooter is, the worse he performs! Crazy. Laid back guys who never practice, and are not even that good, skill-wise, "beat" us in matches. Of course, we are beating ourselves. And the worst of all, is the most important matches. The big ones. We care so much about doing well in them, that we doom ourselves to failure from the start. And I have rarely (never) had the COURAGE, basically, to not give a shit in a match and see how that works out for me. I act as if my life depends on doing my best at the match, instead of saying, "you know what, just for this one match, I am going to shoot it comfortably, no pressure, shooting all A hits and "invest" this match, risking a lower place result, to just test how I could do, being myself while shooting." If I could do this, and it is simply a decision for me to make and adhere to, I could shoot in the high 80% CERTAINLY in Area matches and Nationals. RIght now, with no more skills or knowledge or training than I already possess. So I am going to plan on doing exactly what you have discovered, in the Area 2 match this week. See you there bro. Wish me luck staying the course, being brave enough to just trust myself.

I agree completely. The motion and momentum/timing aspects of a good performance require FEELING each transition real time, for each stage. Another thing to mention here is, if you do a walkthru like 99% of the people do, you will have a 100% target focus the whole time. Do you shoot like that? Nope, except on a few very close targets. So if you rehearse that way, using a target focus only, then you are training yourself to do exactly that when you actually shoot it - and then wonder why all the bad hits and mikes and N/S's. All because you programmed yourself to shoot the stage WITHOUT AIMING!! You can remedy this by using an aiming device to form sight pictures with, such as your thumb, or preferably a writing pen, shell casing, or as I do, the top of a writing pen held in your hand simulating a front sight, and see each sight picture on each target with it as you walk thru. That is exactly how you WILL see it while shooting it, so makes the walkthru much more realistic and useful. (note I have studied the rules on this and even spoken with Troy McMannus specifically about it, and as long as you are not using a replica gun, as the rules say, you are not violating the rules = Lots of misinformation abounds about this, such as that using a water bottle is prohibited. All is BS!). 8.7.2 Competitors are prohibited from using any guns or gun replicas as sighting aids while conducting their inspection (“walkthrough”) of a course of fire. Violations will incur one procedural penalty per occurrence (also see Rule 10.5.1). Just because it is "hard" to get a proper walkthru due to crowds of often inconsiderate shooters in the way, does not mean it is not the proper way to perform the walkthru. I usually come to big matches a full day early so that I can do this, for sure. And I video my walkthru of each stage with my cell phone, narrating the salient points as I do it, and can then study and memorize the stage, from first person viewpoint, back in my hotel while resting. At many large matches, the shooters in a squad will line up obediently and considerately for the 5 minute period, and this gives a better chance at getting thru one at actual speed, without interruption. But no likely. Waiting to initially walkthru a stage when your squad comes to shoot it, is to me, completely unacceptable. Unless it is an extremely simple stage, or you are far more intelligent than me, there is no way you are going to be ready to shoot it well fighting with 10 others in a 5 minute period. Same thing for making ready process. Me and Eddie Garcia taped and ran the clock for 20 shooters on one stage today, waiting for our chance to shoot it. I ran the clock on Eddie's run. He took 3 minutes after the make ready command and I applauded him. Of course he could not walk thru after the make ready, but he could mentally rehearse it many times. And he did. So, for that stage alone, we spent a full hour there pasting, why would you NOT take 3 minutes to get your head together before shooting it? People rush all the wrong stuff and then screw off when they should be rushing or hurrying. Anyway, my attitude is, do it right, or stay at home and don't waste your time. If you cannot mentally go thru each stage in great detail, real time, with your eyes closed, then you are NOT READY TO SHOOT IT. period. So you decide what it takes for you to be able to do that, and then do it. For me, it is often studying every stage in advance, and on the most difficult memory types, I will spend OVER an hour learning it sufficiently to be able to put up an M class performance on it. The more experienced and skilled you are, the faster you can do this. But you have to do it.

I agree with all responses above. Keep the appropriate perspective and you will avoid much frustration. You are a beginner. Don't compare yourself to M and GM level performers. The reason for the classification system, for all its shortcomings, is to handycap each shooter so they can compete with similarly skilled shooters in the same division (gun type). Stick with doing that, comparing yourself to your peers at this early stage of your development. That does not mean ignore all that the more experienced shooters do, because you need to learn what they know and do in order to move up. But do not be hard on yourself about the comparison, use it as a benchmark instead. You need to learn all of the "target math" and how USPSA scores are calculated, now. Don't wait. These are the tools by which you can measure your progress and to self evaluate. It is ridiculous how many USPSA shooters can compete for 5, 10 or 20 YEARS! and still not know how scoring works. Yikes. Take the time now to learn it, and own it forever. You will use it all daily in our sport. In fact, the scoring IS OUR SPORT. Without it, is just shooting. When I started, I made a spreadsheet, from a scoring results report, and then wrote the formulas needed for each cell to calculate the score results again. This forced me to really learn, and understand the scoring. Then I used it often and never had to think about it again. It is as automatic for me as using words to speak. One thing I do after EVERY USPSA match I shoot, big or small (and I shoot as many as 50 a year), is plugged the results into my spreadsheet for analysis. The primary metrics I keep track of in my results are 1) percent of the maximum points possible I shot (before and after penalties applied) and 2) my time relative to a top GM who also shot the same match in my division. I want to know if I am too sloppy or too accurate. That's right, TOO accurate. If you are shooting over 95% of the points possible, you need to SPEED UP and trade some of that accuracy for speed - it will result in higher scores due to the math. Hit Factor is defined and calculated as "points per second." That means HF is a RATE, not a speed. I want to know how my overall match time compares to the top tier GM's time - i.e., I took 20 seconds more time than Travis Tomasie, which is 15.75% more time than he took. I can do that on each stage as well. Be involved, hands on and aware of this math. It is your stats. It is an objective record and measurement of your progress. So, to summarize, learn the match and scoring, track your own stats and realize it takes 10 years shooting FULL TIME to get to the top, so as hobbyist, keep in mind your level of participation when judging your own progress and setting your own expectations. A lot to learn, experience and master. You should not get bored! Good luck!

Shot my first match today since this post and all this great discussion. Club match at Rio Salado in Mesa, AZ. Not much competition turned out but I needed it to prepare for Area 2 there in 5 days! They are already setting up stages for Area 2. Anxious to try to put into match use some of the new info and principles discussed in the forums, and all the thinking about how to utilize it in match performance, I went forth! (albeit having only 9 hours total of sleep in the prior 3 days!) First stage, the classifier, 4 Bill Drill, I actually stayed "within myself" and did well. All hits, only dropped 9 points (not bad for 35 yard targets and strong and weak hand!) and shot an 84+% classifier on it. I literally recall seeing and calling every single shot on this stage, not rushing, and most importantly - I ONLY released each shot WHEN I SAW WHAT I NEEDED TO SEE! This may have been the first time for that to happen, for me, on an entire stage, in all of my 4 years shooting! I shot it just like it was any other stage (I.e., I did not think of it differently because it is a classifier). So I am sharing this, to not only reinforce it for myself, but to reiterate a few concepts the experience involved. 1) Visual patience - especially with long difficult shots like 35 yards, and with weak and strong hand firing, trying to shoot with any concept of a cadence or rhythm is deadly. You HAVE to let the sights drive the gun and the time is, what it is on each shot. Timing is very different shooting single handed than when shooting freestyle. You have to WAIT until you SEE what you need to see for each and every shot. 2) Trigger control - especially with long difficult shots like 35 yards, and with weak and strong hand firing, good trigger control is absolutely necessary on EVERY SHOT in this classifier. I got all 6 A hits on the weak hand target as a result. There is NO support hand to make up for poor trigger control when shooting single handed. Timing is very different than when shooting freestyle. 3) Mental Management - first, treat classifiers just like any other stage. Second, do not go into a stage making any decisions in advance like shooting speed/cadence, or any other preconception about the shooting part. You have to just let the sights drive the gun - shoot each shot only as each sight picture dictates. 4) Smooth is fast - I never say "slow is fast," as I do not agree with that one. Even though this Va Count standard does not have the aspect of makeup shots and all the problems being sloppy can introduce, it is still true that the fastest way to shoot this stage, is to shoot as soon as you have an adequate "sight picture" for each shot. NO SOONER than you can see what you need to see. If you rush either the sight picture, or the trigger control on any shot, it will be a failure. Not a short cut. 5) Not making mistakes is faster - Take the time to perform all tasks in a smooth manner, especially awkward ones like changing from strong to weak-hand on the clock. Same for reloads. Better to take the necessary time at your skill level, to accomplish all of these right the first time, than to have to suffer the much larger time waste if you miss a reload, or don't get a good grip or knock the safety on when taking up weak hand grip, etc. Also, this holds true for non-VA count stages where you CAN shoot makeup shots - taking an additional 5/100's for each shot to assure a good sight picture and trigger control is way faster than additional shots on the clock.

In our club match today at Rio Salado, I shot stage 3 with Eddie Garcia among 18 others and I was running the clock when Eddie shot it. He was shooting Open and me Limited. I was surprised to see how Eddie and many people shot the right up-range 3-target array entering that port and starting on a tight no-shoot covered target when there was a full open target they could have entered on instead. Two of the three were covered by a N/S rendering a neckline aim point - and they were at a range of only 7 yards. There was no movement/speed advantage to saving the open target till last, as shooting it while moving out was not possible since it was a low target thru this port. Yet the full target was easily shot safely and very quickly as the initial target on entering, while settling into the new position to shoot the two N/S targets safely. I watched shooter after shooter do this, even with iron sights. Watch this video of me shooting it, and note I shot that array very fast, engaging the full target first, on the move while entering it that location/port with all 6A. In the video, the array being discussed is the one with a port with N/S on each side of the port. I did not video Eddie but no way he could have been faster on that array, even shooting open. I forgot to ask him WHY he did it that way. Another example of strategic target shooting order choice. It does NOT apply only to Draw targets!

Yes. Angus Hobdell says he almost "throttles" the gun he grips it so hard with his weak hand. But it should still be reiterated that this must be accomplished without introducing adverse tension and problems into the body or gun. Gripping hard and maintaining a good, stable platform are NOT mutually exclusive. Stoeger is the one who made the point that the strong, weak-hand grip will compensate for poor trigger control. And of course, poor trigger control is probably the MAIN problem with most shooters' accuracy.

Well, today I shot a club match at Rio Salado in Mesa, AZ, as planned. Have had less than 3.5 hours of sleep for the last 3 nights while driving from Wyoming, etc. Anyway, burned out big time so will make this short and sweet for now. I had a good conversation with my friend at the match today, Kerry Pearson, who is a good GM USPSA shooter and a practicing Optometrist here. I had a call into him Thursday about Vision Development which rowdyb has turned us onto in this thread. First off, he does not provide this particular service in-0ffice. Second he is familiar with it. He summarized how it relates to shooters as follows. Three elements to Vision Development for shooters. 1) Ability to rapidly and accurately refocus between objects at different focal lengths (e.g., close up and far off targets). This can be improved with drills which exercise the eye muscles. 2) Ability to rapidly move the eyes in the socket. This means being able to efficiently re-point the eyes in all directions without the head moving to do so. Muscles again, so can be improved with training. 3) Visualization - what he said this meant was the stage preparation process - which of course is referring to cognitive aspects of seeing. He said there are no specialists doing much with this in this Mesa area. So he thought I should be able to do my own research into it, books have been written on some aspects he said, and set up and do my own program and probably reap most of the benefits. Well, as rowdyb had said, it may be a different story from a practicing specialist in this narrow field of Vision Development for sports performance enhancement. I cannot disagree, since I have not done what rowdyb has. I am in Mesa for the whole month of March, so since there are no specialists here, I will just have to work on this all myself. Got to get some sleep. They have already setup half of the Area 2 stages and I cannot be burned out for that match. Need my eyes to work well! Thanks again rowdyb for sharing this all with the forum. Obviously it has generated a lot of discussion and thought. Might positively impact a lot of us!

You know, I think there are things occurring which we do not comprehend, when we focus on the front sight. In other words, YES, when a shooter focuses on the front sight, their scoring performance is usually better too. But that does not necessarily mean that it was the front sight focus that is the reason/causation. I find with my own performance, including today at a USPSA match at Rio Salado, that most of my misses and additional shots are a result of having a target focus when I should NOT. I.e., on poppers at 15 yards, or fast swingers at 12 yards. I knew it as soon as I blew it on a stage due to many misses on poppers. BUT I would not jump to the conclusion that just because a target type focus was inappropriate, that a front sight focus should have been used. I would rather say, that when we use ANY type of aiming, we do better! And a front sight focus is certainly a method of aiming, but only one of many. So, using SOME type of focus is almost always better than NONE! Front sight focus is always going to provide the most accurate and precise method of aiming and also the most accuracy, assuming the release is well executed. BUT, this method of aiming is much slower than others, and should only be used when it is necessary (e.g., for more difficult or risky shots).

A very powerful, tight weak-hand grip makes up for a LOT of poor trigger control. No doubt about this. In my own shooting, it has been proven time and time again. Whenever I have very tight pairs, like 2 inch group or less on targets, it is due to weak-hand grip being much stronger than most can imagine. And it does not affect my strong hand grip, neutrality, or trigger finger dexterity at all negatively.

Man, so am I Willz. It is sure going to be great, if ironic, that untrained eyes/vision has been holding me in my tight 74% big match performance range for 2 years despite sending almost full time and about $50K on shooting in that same two year period trying to improve to little avail! I will keep you posted on what I learn. I am on the way driving to Mesa AZ from Vegas as I write (wife is actually driving!) for a month of full time shooting every day, and have my GM Optometrist friend's contact info ready to call about this in a few minutes. He is not listed as a member of the COVD particularly, but since he is in Mesa, a good GM shooter, and a practicing Optometrist, he will be a good place to start! Thanks Rob

Willz- Jerry is something isn't he! Fast as anyone I have seen, on the gun. I agree with you, especially about the keeping the head up so eyes are not deformed or obstructed by the skull and brows and sockets etc. Very good point. And a related issue I am creating problems for myself by shooting with one eye closed - Brian says in his book that doing so can reduce visual acuity by as much as 20% - and this is not even counting the loss of peripheral vision I believe. Closing one eye causes at least a partial closing of the other. Man! I have a lot of work to do. Check out other posts in this thread for potential and exciting possibilities for how to train our eyes to see faster. Rowdyb has opened up a whole new world to me with his sharing his experience with Eye doctors aiding in vision development. Thanks!

Hey Rob, have you ever tried the 1/2" square of scotch tape on your non-dominant side to block out the sights but leave peripheral vision open? I don't have a strongly dominant eye, so shooting with both eyes open was taking me longer to sort out the visual clutter, and sometimes I found the wrong eye taking over unexpectedly. scotch tape fixed that. There are a few fairly accomplished shooters GM's who do that. Enos, Matt Hopkins, and many others. Yes Motosapiens. Good advice. I have dicked around with it, but am always busy shooting matches all year round so kind of gave up and pussied out because it was so different and uncomfortable. But even two days ago I was doing it again, trying to see how tiny a piece of tape I could get awaywith to mitigate the negatives i was experiencing. Found out something in the process. I was NOT 100% consistent in my head to gun relationship every time I mounted the gun to see if the tape was in the right place. The tape effectively was "moving around" because my head/gun relationship was inconsistent! MAN! More for me to work on. Amazing how trying one thing reveals issues and weaknesses in other areas we were not aware of! Thanks!

Why are you keeping your left eye close during transitions? Actually I am not, usually, unless they are very close (narrow) transitions on difficult targets, like a line of poppers at 15 yards all a few feet apart. Good point and catch supermoto. I am going to fix this whole thing soon! For real this time, no matter how uncomfortable it is for me to learn to shoot with both eyes open. Thanks

Thanks pjb45. Will do!

I understand and appreciate your perspective here rowdyb and agree with you 100%. So no worries. I just intend to pursue this, immediately, and want to avoid any missteps possible. Thanks for the explanation. Even though I drove over 15 hours yesterday, and then spent 3 hours out walking the strip in Vegas after midnight, I still spent another hour researching vision development before going to bed, and I have 5 more hours driving today, and a lot of work to do on a travel trailer this afternoon and will be shooting a match early Saturday morning at Rio Salado. So just wanted you to know I am not wasting your time here, and I have already done some research on it all. I could hardly sleep last night due to the excitement over your revelation about this subject. You have nailed what has OFTEN been said is the key to our sport - SEEING, and doing it faster is obviously the key to higher level performance. So you have my attention my friend! I even found some YouTube examples of types of exercises, etc as well as read the success stories linked from the COVD site you pointed me too! It is ON now! http://www.covd.org/?page=Sports I get it. I will update you on my progress with this new priority of mine, obtaining pro services on vision development. I can hardly wait to get to it! You may have just single-handedly guided me here to finally being able to launch myself out of my M class rut now, as I know this is at the heart of and the main impediment to my progress . Thanks.

Nice find. One of my many weaknesses is that I still shoot with one eye closed, or nearly closed on almost all shots. I am right eye dominant and close my left eye for sight-aimed shots. On close easy targets I keep both eyes open because I never need to actively notice the front sight. On more difficult shots, when I need to see the sights better, this definitely slows me down on wide right-to-left transitions and being able to land efficiently and accurately on left-located targets (those to the left, beyond my peripheral vision of my right eye). My nose literally blocks the left peripheral view of my right eye. I have tried to work on changing this a few times, but have not stuck with it long enough to succeed. It is so uncomfortable to me I rationalize I will put up with the loss of capability not shooting with two eyes open costs me. Someday I believe I will have to fix this to move up much in my match performance level. As for calling shots when a target optical focus is used, it is my opinion that it can still be done effectively, without having an OPTICAL focus on the front sight. I believe what actually happens in that case is that the eye is on the target, and then the focus is pulled back towards the front sight and somewhere before the focus comes all the way back to the front sight, enough is seen to release the shot. And that less-th-sharp front sight image is enough to call the shot. We still always SEE the front sight , if our eyes are open, just not necessarily in sharp optical focus. In the video, Doug says as much. He also makes it clear that it is a slower way to acquire targets, using one eye closed, therefore a competitive disadvantage generally speaking. Take a look at this very interesting post made on another topic today, which exposed me to a whole new concept and area of potential advantage. Visual Development. Amazing. Here is that post by link by rowdyb: lhttp://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=210804#entry2344969 Thanks 3djedi - after sleeping on this since I posted the above, I had some more to offer this morning. I am almost to the point now of not even using these terms anymore, "Target Focus" or Sight Focus " because they are so misleading. Most people automatically assume that target focus means you do not see the front sight at all. Nothing could be further from the truth. I now KNOW that I see my sights on EVERY shot I fire (from my experiment shooting live fire a couple days ago with my sights both taped up). Further, people are ALWAYS speaking of the OPTICAL focus, which is valid, but ignores the often much more important MENTAL focus aspect. E.g., when I shoot a 15 yard open paper target, I will have a target OPTICAL focus but I will be MENTALLY focusing very intently on the more fuzzy image of my front sight, not on the target which is sharply focused. Where, in contrast, on a 15 yard 8 inch plate or mini popper, I will have the reverse. I then have my optical focus on the front sight, and my mental focus on the target. It is as if I perform a tradeoff in either method, or a hybrid of them, where my Optical focus object requires less resolution effort than the less focused object, regardless which object is which. Think of it in the case where you are running to catch a football thrown to you in a game. You will certainly have an optical focus on the ball flying towards you, but while running you will also need to see the defensive players and perhaps the sideline, in your peripheral so you will avoid them successfully. You probably do NOT take your eyes off of the ball until it is in your hands, but you nevertheless SEE the players/sideline out of focus in your peripheral vision simultaneously. Your mental focus is on avoiding the obstacles in your path while running, while your optical focus is permitting your subconscious to execute on catching the flying ball. A quarterback, taking the ball from the center guard, does not need to see the center or the ball other than peripherally when he has his hands touching the center's butt in preparation for the hike, but he is optically focusing on many other players in the field, especially his intended receiver after he has the ball, while peripherally seeing all the players rushing him and guarding for him to avoid being sacked. Along this same discussion line, not having an optical focus on the front sight does not preclude one from using the front sight peripherally to call the shot, as always. In other words, on the easier shots one would be using a "target" optical focus to engage, seeing a more fuzzy image of the front sight lift is equally effective and adequate to call the shot, just as it was for aiming same shot. To say otherwise in internally inconsistent. Try this by taping over the front and rear sights and shooting live fire to prove it to yourself. I did.

Nice find. One of my many weaknesses is that I still shoot with one eye closed, or nearly closed on almost all shots. I am right eye dominant and close my left eye for sight-aimed shots. On close easy targets I keep both eyes open because I never need to actively notice the front sight. On more difficult shots, when I need to see the sights better, this definitely slows me down on wide right-to-left transitions and being able to land efficiently and accurately on left-located targets (those to the left, beyond my peripheral vision of my right eye). My nose literally blocks the left peripheral view of my right eye. I have tried to work on changing this a few times, but have not stuck with it long enough to succeed. It is so uncomfortable to me I rationalize I will put up with the loss of capability not shooting with two eyes open costs me. Someday I believe I will have to fix this to move up much in my match performance level. As for calling shots when a target optical focus is used, it is my opinion that it can still be done effectively, without having an OPTICAL focus on the front sight. I believe what actually happens in that case is that the eye is on the target, and then the focus is pulled back towards the front sight and somewhere before the focus comes all the way back to the front sight, enough is seen to release the shot. And that less-th-sharp front sight image is enough to call the shot. We still always SEE the front sight , if our eyes are open, just not necessarily in sharp optical focus. In the video, Doug says as much. He also makes it clear that it is a slower way to acquire targets, using one eye closed, therefore a competitive disadvantage generally speaking. Take a look at this very interesting post made on another topic today, which exposed me to a whole new concept and area of potential advantage. Visual Development. Amazing. Here is that post by link by rowdyb: lhttp://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=210804#entry2344969 Thanks