Carmoney

Well, Craig has courageously acknowledged that he was one of the shooters who petitioned IDPA to change the revolver rules. Would anyone else like to 'fess up? Ted, you seem awfully triumphant about this, too. Were you a campaigner on this also? Who else do I need to thank for these changes? (First and last names, please...) Mike Carmoney

Mike Carmoney Revolver Friday

Yeah, we might all be shooting "Dad's old Model 10" in SSR because all the rest of our gear has been obsoleted by the new rules. Sounds like in order to be competitive in the new ESR division, you're going to almost have to use an 8-shot.

That's great news, considering I just paid TK more than twice that for a packet of 10 of his little gems. Now--huge question--are the Ranch Products clips the solid style? Or the split kind? (Solid is the only way to go....) Mike

Jeff--Cool--So are we actually up to 9 revos now? Cliff--As of today, Sam's going. I'm going to try to coordinate it so that all of us wheelgunners are on the same squad on Friday, if at all possible. Sly Dan C. is shooting Sat./Sun. so he'll have a chance to go to school on all of us! Guys, this is cool. I'm excited. My plane ticket is booked. Mike

That's great news Cliff--thanks for replying! I'm booking my plane ticket this evening--I'm planning to shoot on Friday. I think Sam Keen (Hopalong) might just be atttending the match as well--hey, that would make 8 wheelgunners! As a beginner in IPSC revolver, I figure it's worth the plane ticket and entry fee just to be able to see you experienced wheelgunners in action first-hand! Mike

Any other wheelgunners going? It would be really cool to have a real revo. squad this year!

Spook, the floating hand is a "female" unit which fits over a post that is press-fit into the hole on the trigger which normally accommodates the pin on the hand. dj, the floating hand causes trouble with the DA trigger pull in many, but not all, specimens. I've only seen floating hands installed on 625-2 "Model of 1988"s, but I've heard they show up occasionally on earlier 625-3s. Somewhere along in there the factory shitcanned the whole floating hand idea, mercifully. My thought is if your gun has a nice DA pull, don't worry about it--if you decide to put in a regular "male" hand, it may need to be fitted. The separate pin on the trigger will pull out easily with vise grips. Mike

OK, guys, since we're talking loosely about revolvers at this match, does anybody know whether there are enough revolver shooters planning to go this year to justify any sort of division recognition for Revo? I keep finding myself looking at plane ticket prices on travelocity, and this match might just be at the edge of being do-able for me, but the only USPSA class card I have right now is in wheelgun. At the risk of sounding just a tiny bit mercenary, would I be shooting just for fun if I show up in Frostproof with a revolver, or are there prizes/plaques/etc. being awarded in the Revo class? Thanks, Mike

Must be nice to be 11 years old, and having all your bullets and primers for free... L-10

Jake--my point exactly--it's so much easier shooting with that dot! So aren't you glad you learned to shoot on a gun with iron sights first?? My thinking is this: Shooters who start out on the dot tend not to ever do very well with iron sights, because they are never forced to learn front-sight focus (which is not a natural or instinctive thing--the human brain tends to make us focus our eyes on the objective, i.e. the target). Which is fine if you're only going to shoot Open and maybe Steel Challenge, but if you want to play other games, you sorta have a problem... If Sam were getting discouraged by shooting an iron-sighted revolver, I'd switch him right away to something else (like probably an open gun of some sort). But he loves the wheelguns, and I think it is teaching him to learn the fundamentals (trigger control and sight picture) early, without developing bad habits. Having only 6 minor-power-factor shots available is also training him to get A-hits, and to carefully think through stage strategy. I figure he'll learn to hose soon enough! This summer when we shot the Iowa Single Stack match, I switched him to a .45 with major loads a couple weeks beforehand--he had no problem whatsoever (except for a tendency to start to reach up with his left hand to "open the cylinder" when it was time to reload!) and brought home a plaque for high D (Lewis scoring). I don't think it would have worked nearly as well to start him on an auto, and then ask him to handle a revolver on demand.... Anyway, I figure there's no wrong way to introduce a young kid to our sport--my theories above are just my own personal thoughts on the topic. Merry Christmas, everybody! Mike

Cam--Great job on your first IPSC match! I think it's particularly cool that you're shooting L-10. Most junior shooters get addicted to open guns too early in their shooting careers, and never really learn how to handle iron sights. I see some familiar names on those match results--looks like you have some stiff competition at your club. My son Sam is 11, shoots Revolver and L-10. Maybe we'll bump into you at some match one of these days! Best of luck, Mike

I just put together a sweet trigger package on my Springfield I'm working up for the Single Stack Classic, and it sounds like 300lbGorilla and I have similar tastes: Koenig premium match hammer (by EGW) EGW hard sear Briley disconnector Nowlin sear spring Wolf 17# mainspring STI titanium hammer strut In my case, these parts did not quite drop in...after cutting the sear relief angle and tuning the sear, I still had some creep. So I gave the hammer a few passes with the stone, stuck the sear in my Ed Brown jig and gently re-cut the sear, re-did the relief angle, boosted it twice, and now I have a perfectly reliable 2-pound trigger (I don't care to go any lighter on this gun) that is nice and crispy and just right for me. Have fun--with the high-quality aftermarket parts on the market today, trigger jobs these days are so much easier than they used to be..... Mike

Sam, I think maybe I can help: All modern S&W revolvers have a hammer block--that's the part that falls out when you remove the sideplate. The little piece in the frame you're talking about was first used on the 29/629 Magna-Classic series (now collectible) and for a few years was worked into a variety of other N-frames and then eventually went by the wayside, I think--anyway, it was designed to keep the center pin coming backwards under heavy recoil and popping the cylinder open--which was never a problem with .45 ACP anyway. I'm not sure what the little part is called, but I can tell you that the gun will function fine (and be perfectly safe) without it in there. Since it is fitted with this little center pin lock, your 625 will not have the floating hand (the 625-2 had those, but they were phased out somewhere near the front end of the 625-3 series due to the horrendous DA pulls created by the sloppy floating hand). You'll see that your hand has a pin long enough to extend all the way through the trigger and operate the little lock thing. So, I'm fairly sure the .400 MIM trigger should work fine as is. BUT, better yet--if you want to go with a flash-chromed carbon steel part that is similar to the original one in your gun, order your option 1, the "SS" trigger for floating hand. It's going to have the post installed for the floating hand, but you can just pull it out with a pair of vise-grips, then just install your original hand. You might need to do a little fitting work on the new trigger to get it running smooth, or it might drop right in and work fine right away. I would recommend that you visit S&W's website and download their parts catalog--it's a fairly long print job (about 1/2" printed on one side of the page), but it's worth having around for reference. Good luck on this--if I can offer any further help or clarification, call me at 515-967-6126. Hope y'all have a great holiday--we'll see you in 2005. Mike

Hopster: Hey now, B-class isn't too bad for a beginner like me!!

After all this excellent feedback I'm sorta embarrassed to report that Young Sam and I didn't get to shoot this stage after all. The night before the match the actual temperature was in the single-digits and the wind was howlin' like crazy. The match was a 2-hour drive from home, and the match the weekend before was canceled because they couldn't keep the targets standing upright. (Frickin' Iowa, I'll never get used to the wind out here on these prairies....) Anyway, I wimped out and turned my alarm clock off and slept in. Sam wasn't very happy with me. Still--one of the biggest areas we need to learn is course-of-fire strategy. Having learned to shoot on bowling pins, I have this natural tendency to stand in one place and shoot everything left to right, and reload only when the gun is empty. So everybody's input has been very useful to me, even though I haven't been able to apply any of it just yet. Spring is only a few months away, right? Mike

Sam, keep us posted on this. I know at least one junior revo. shooter (and his dad) that would really like to shoot this match. The earlier we know the dates, though, the better the chances--scheduling can be real difficult around this house. Mike

Sam: I've looked over the list of Revo. Masters, and the only one I know well is fellow Iowan Barney Niner. Barney is another hard-core pin-shooter from the old days, like me. Good guy, real nice family, works hard and spends time with his kids (none of whom are serious shooters). When he takes time to shoot these days, his game is sporting clays. By the way, I finally got 4 classifers shot, and I find myself a B in Revo. Which is probably about right, given my current IPSC shooting level. I was pleased to see that my last classifer came in at 85.7%, so that gives me hope that a Master card is not a completely unreasonable goal somewhere down the line! Meanwhile, Young Sam still needs one more classifer before he gets a card, but it looks like he's fixin' to wind up a good honest C-class Revo. shooter when that happens. And given that he's still only 11 years old, and shooting minor without the benefit of moonclips, I'm real proud of him! BTW, Ron: I gotta tell you that I am very impressed with your M ranking in all 5 equipment categories. It's a rare shooter indeed that can do so well with literally any type of handgun. I hope we wind up at the same match one of these days--Area 3 in Kansas City, maybe?? Mike

ipsc1: So you would endorse Plan A as legal, right? I wondered about that, too, which is why I posed it--seems the argument against is that the stage requirements say "...THEN make a mandatory reload..." describing exactly when the mandatory reload has to occur. I'd say this is a poorly-written classifer stage. Course designers should remember that stage instructions should make sense for all classes, including Revolver.

His website is: Apex Tactical

I disassembled my Uncle Mike's mag pouches and put them back together using nuts and washers as spacers to make them big enough to fit my Para mags--they've been working just fine for several matches now. If push comes to shove, that might give you an option since you can locate the UM stuff about anywhere. Shred--I think UM is actually Kydex, but it's injection-molded rather than formed from sheets. I happen to think the UM holster for the 1911 (the one with belt loops, not the paddle) is actually a very good competition holster.

Troy: I hear ya. I do "discussion and controversy" for a living....so I'd much prefer to avoid adding any unnecessary doses of either into my recreational life! Mike

Perhaps this is the real question I was getting to along--would I have to shoot at each target at least once in order to "engage T1-T4" before making the mandatory reload? wide45 says no, just as long as I engage some of the targets in the array. jake and chuck seem to agree. flex says yes, must fire at least one shot at each target. several others, via private email, agree with flex. Can anyone offer a cite to a rule in the book that I can point out, or will I just have to accept that it can be interpreted in a couple different ways and I'm at the mercy of the RO's viewpoint? Thanks again, Mike

Thanks for everybody's input. OK--I think I'm understanding that my Plan B above is illegal unless I actually engage each target on one array with at least one shot. I can see several legal variations on Flex's Plan C that would seem to work fairly well and will save that extra reload. Cool!

CM 99-05 Mob Job (16 rounds): "Upon start signal, from Box A engage only T1-T4, then make a mandatory reload and from Box A engage only T5-T7, PP1, and PP2. Competitor may engage either array first, but a reload must be done before engaging the next array. Competitor may go back to pick up misses without doing another reload after completing the initial stage requirements." My question is how the heck do you legally shoot this with a revolver? My son Sam is shooting this classifier tomorrow, and I want to give him good advice. He's obviously going to need 2 reloads minimum, but must he make 3 in order to avoid drawing a procedural? Can he legally do either of the following: A. Shoot six rounds on the left array--reload--finish up the left side with two rounds and immediately move on to the right array with the remaining four rounds in the gun--reload--finish up the right side. B. Shoot six rounds on the left array--reload--shoot six rounds on the right array--reload again and then finish up both sides. Thanks, Mike