Carlos

This comes through second-hand information, not my personal experience. However, the source is our host, Brian, who shot Clays in .40 & stated that it became "spikey" when really hot - if for instance your reloads were left in the trunk of your car in the Arizona sun before you used them. There are also anecdotes about Clays users keeping their loads in ice coolers w/ cold packs. Was this 9mm ammo? No. Apples to oranges so to speak, these anecdotes are from before the existance of Production division and all involve .40 caliber at the old PF of 175. HOWEVER, my own experience indicated some Wichester primers as quite flat while others were fine when loading Clays into 9x19 w/ 147s (TMJ or Plated). Was it the Clays or was it inconsistent powder throws of only 2.9 grns of flaky Clays by my Dillon? No way to tell. However, I have not seen the same results using the other powders I listed with 9x19mm & 147s. What we need is more info from 9mm 147 loaders using Clays. Perhaps they can shed light on how it reacts when the temperatures go up. Regards, D.C. Johnson

As many rounds and as much movement as possible. Regards, D.C. Johnson www.shootersparadise.com

A little drift here, but David wrote: "The practice of picking up brass for the person who just shot seems to have been lost at all the local matches I go to - people now just pick up their own.When I first started in '95 and for quite a few years afterwards, the person who just shot brass was always picked up, the RO made sure that someone was assigned the task, like they would to tape and reset the steel. " In the VA/MD section, this practice has stopped altogether. Many of the larger competitions are now designated "lost brass" for the reason that picking up brass really slows down the match. At my match, time is critical since we are an indoor match & have to keep to a tight schedule of 6 shooters per hour through 4 stages. No picking up brass is allowed. The upside to this is: speed of the match & convenience + picking up brass in mud/cut grass over a large field course is not at all easy to do in a hurry. Downside is: it makes .45 & .38 Super (all varieties) less attractive since all match brass is lost. Some fired .45 ACP is up to $50/k; 38 super is more costly still. I am not taking a position on this since I shoot .40 & 9mm primarily. Perhaps this thread should be split off & merged with the many threads addressing lost brass. Regards, D.C. Johnson www.shootersparadise

Cliff wrote: "for my production load" You did not mention caliber. However, you gave us a clue when you wrote: "only 2 months to the World shoot" and "Canada" IPSC Production is virtually 100% 9mm due to the use of normal capacity magazines. Canada is 100% IPSC. A favored Production load is a 147 grn bullet at 125 to 130 PF. The original question pertains specifically to Clays powder. Appears that Cliff is using Clays in 9mm. Be very very careful useing Clays in such a load. There are published loads for LEAD 147 grn bullets. See, Lyman, Pistol & Revolver Reloading Handbook, Second Edition, p. 137; 147 grn cast, Alloy #2, Clays 2.8 grns/ 873 fps. I strongly suggest an OAL of at least 1.150" in spite of what the Manual lists as the OAL for this load. However, I have not found published data for Plated/TMJ or jacketed bullets. What is worse is that I experienced very flat primers with Clays and 147 plated bullets & winchester primers. I think that N310 is far more safe & N320 safer still while still providing a very competitive load. Safer still? Titegroup. One more caution: keep your Clays loads OUT of the sun on hot days. Regards, D.C. Johnson www.shootersparadise.com

Oh well, thanks for your efforts. I followed your suggestion re: a 25-2 w/ a 6.5" barrel & found an old thread on these guns; it does seem like a better & more viable option. As for that barrel length, it may seem a bit long as first, but I had to remeber that in revolver, everything happens just a little slower than I am accustomed to w/ a semi & would that longer barrel really slow me down? Besides, the 25-2s I saw on gunbroker.com did not have underlugs so there would not appear to be too much weight out front. I might just take the plunge. Thanks again, D. C. Johnson www.shootersparadise.com

Phil Strader, the owner of Shooters Paradise (www.shootersparadise.com) has recently begun to host a fully affiliated ICORE match in Northern Virginia near Quantico (Woodbridge VA; just off Rt. 95 between Quantico & D.C.). The indoor club holds monthly matches following all ICORE rules & usually featuring an ICORE classifier. Weekends are the bussiest times for the public range so the competitions are held on Wednesday nights. Here is a link to the forum on Phil's site that addresses this new ICORE match: http://www.shootersparadise.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=40 I hope that anyone in the area (or even just visiting) can join us for some friendly revolver competition. Regards, D.C. Johnson www.shootersparadise.com

Problem seems worst with contoured & undercut grips. Any modification to your gripframe?

I asked the vendor for a price (for comparison) but he was not selling the gun; just using it as a model for the grips he was selling; if I recall, the grips were out of Germany & called something like "Nill" grips; the grips were modeled on the s&w "coke bottle" shaped grips & he wanted $210 for just the grips. They were, however, very nice grips. This was at the Richmond show last weekend. Regards, D.

I have about 1.5K through one of Brian H./expiramental machine Ti comp w/ NO appreciable wear despite 9major loads. The gun is an open Glock so I cannot comment on weight distribution as to 1911s.

stingerjg - thanks very much for the link. BTW, the link also includes some of the lengthy history of this barrel/rules for those interested. Regards, D.C. Johnson

That is the very gun I am seeking. I happen to spot a .45 LC one at the show & just kept thinking how sweet such a revolver would be were it in .45 ACP; low and behold a buddy lent me the guide & confirmed your catalog. Now to track one down. Thank you very much for posting the question to the forum. Regards, D.C. Johnson

I have a 625 (a 1989 model 5") & it great for USPSA & ICORE. However, I just discovered that S&W made a limited production run of 25-6, Model of 1989 in carbon steel & a few of them were made in .45 ACP (according to the collector's guide). A search of the major online markets failed to turn up even a single gun. The S&W Forum is closed to non-members & they blocked my membership request on account of AOL. Anyone have any advice on tracking down this unusual gun? I don't need it, but would like to own it nonetheless. Regards, D.C. Johnson

Dirtypool wrote: "They are only approved in SV guns and kinda "went around" an older aggreement they had." Is that the current rulingt? I own an STI Edge & plan to put a different top end on it. I plan to use the existing Edge slide but I am having the Schuemann barrel installed (the "sight tracker" barrel) instead of one of those tungsten sleeved barrels. I already own the barrel. Since the barrel is now approved, why would it not be allowed on my STI, or any other 1911 for that matter? If I am allowed to swiss-cheese my slide to any configuration I like, then why is the sight tracker cut only for the SV owners? I must have missed the interpretation on this one. Please advise & thanks for bringing this up BEFORE I start building. Regards, D.C. Johnson

I am curious about this too, Trevor. I first shot USPSA in 2001 & to me, there has always been a Production division as well as L-10 & 165 major. I am curious as well about reasons for the very first split rules for IPSC/USPSA. It seems the majority of non-competition shooters know are sport only as "IPSC" (or "is-pic" - I hear that often). It would be ideal if the IPSC rules could changed to conform to our current rules; a sort of re-unification of the sport. What do you think? D.C. Johnson

They measured at .355?? GREAT!!!!! - I may have a new 9mm production bullet!! Thanks for the heads up. How do these shoot in your revolver? (obviously, you will have to test one round at a time or experience sever bullet pull). If they otherwise work, maybe the $15 Lee brand U or Undersized die will allow the cases to grab these bullets. Regards, D.C. Johnson

When I shot Clays, I used electroplated West Coast 200s; either SWCs or 200 RNs; the OALs were: SWC: 1.245" RNs: 1.260" I recall getting away with 4.5 grn for the SWCs but I had to bump the RN charge to 4.6 grns to make 165+. Gun was STI Edge 5.0 Regards, D.C. Johnson

The manufacturer's warning about TiteGroup & moly coated bullets likely comes from the increased heat that TG produces when it burns. That extra heat, in turn, is caused by TG's high Nitro content (~37%; the highest of the double based pistol powders) and its fast burning speed. This figure comes from Duane's article in Blue Press & from Hodgdon. In general, such heat can be reduced by swithching to a slower burning powder with moly coated bullets (though charge weight & recoil may increase) or, to some extent, using a single based powder. All of the V V pistol powders are single base. D.C. Johnson

Re-read the 1st post; thanks for the clarification. I meant to say "proposed set up sounds optimal." Lee Undersized or U Die in 9mm: why use it? I use the U die because of the powder I shoot: V V N-310 & 147 grn bullets & mixed brass. This combination is NOT approved by Vihta Vouri or by any published source of 9x19mm data. In addition, this combination is predicted to generate +p+ pressures even loaded to the max OAL. I use the Lee die as a safety precaution to prevent the possibility of setback. If you are useing a listed or book load to 125-130 PF, this precaution might not be necessary. Accuracy: in 147grn 9mm bullets, I have noticed that only the hollow point varieties will group better than your current standard: "at 25 yards from a sandbag I shoot approximately 4 inch groups. . .I am fairly sure that my pistol brand new Sig-226ST(done up by Bruce Gray) is capable of better groups than that, hence my interest in loading different ammos to find the most accurate load for my gun, with a decent Minor PF, with total reliablity, and manageable slide velocity." As for slide velocity, heavier bullet generally means reduced slide velocity, given similar power factor (do a search on "momentum" for a lengthy & specific discussion of the bullet weight/slide velocity relationship). As for OAL variance, I agree, your current variance is abnormal. I get less variance with a regular RCBS seater - particularly with the correct seater stem installed. Friends with the Redding report excellent results - no doubt its a quality die that works. Only die I've had difficulty with is the Lee seater die; OAL varied quite a bit. Regards, D.C. Johnson

I think at least 4 different disciplines deserve credit: 1)USPSA, 2)IDPA & 3)SASS/CAS. All 3 of these sports have proven to host clubs that it can be perfectly safe to draw from a holster, shoot fast & shoot on the move. 4)I also give credit to GSSF for introducing the beginner to competition pistol shooting on a timer and for showing people that its safe to shoot at steel plates (not to mentionthe fact that its a lot of fun). In addition, the American Shooter TV show has publicized all of the action pistol shooting sports without making negative comments about one over the other. Show is not perfect, but what show is? Overall, I think it makes a positive contribution to sport shooting. Good job to all & keep up the good work.

How much of a variance in OAL & velocity are you getting? Your current set-up sounds optimal to me. How is the 50 yard accuracy? Which gun?

Excellent! THanks for the update. As for the Hornadys, do a search here on the reloading section for the new website for "T&T Reloading" out of PA - they have great prices or check some of the really old FrontSights for Emidio Gaspari's number - he also discounts Hornady in bulk.

Precision molycoated work well (even in Glocks). National bullet in OH makes a quality lead traditional hardcast lead bullet. Also, Midway might still sell the D&J brand traditional lead bullets out of maryland; these seemed to work OK though I would not try these in a GLock.

"There's a small misunderstanding" Neil, thanks for the clarification & I take responsibility for the error or, as some people on this side of the Atlantic might say: "my bad." The debate does indeed go on with EricW sensibly calling for the box rule to be added to Production instead of the other proposals such as: - a "feature list" (this feature or combination of features is OK but this other one, is not). Sounds a lot like the the AWB or assault weapon ban "feature list". No thanks. or, - a "spirit of the division" test; no one can objectively say what the "spirit standard" is or what it will be, but we are supposed to place our faith in the Production Rules committee members to magically aquire the ability to determine a gun's spirit content; in other words, they can't say what it is, but they know it when they sees it." Besides box rule, I personally would NOT have a problem with something like the "2000 produced" rule nor would I object to an "available to the public" rule - a criteria which a certain S&W Perfomance Center gun seems not to be able to meet currently. Thanks again for the clarification Neil & nice work on the shotgun rules; I appreciate the work work you do in support of our sport. Regards, D.C. Johnson

The particular topic linked above has been locked on the IPSC Global Village board. For whatever reason, the admins over there seem to have concluded that there has been sufficient discussion of this topic to decide the matter at the World Shoot. I do hope that the GA maintains an open mind about this issue up until the day of the vote. D.C. Johnson

Shalom Cybrosh! Great pictures & looking forward to the rest. Can post a brief match report? How were the stages? BTW- the 7th or 8th photo appears to be a Jericho 941 but has it been chromed? Stainless? Standard or Production? Regards, D.C. Johnson