Sin-ster

Too true. The only real experience I have with trigger freeze was a direct result of consciously trying to go pull the trigger as fast as possible, during an 18 round Bill Drill. Around shot 10-12, I guess I was trying way too hard! Did it again a few minutes later with much better results-- probably because my focus was 100% on tracking the sights, and I was a lot more comfortable with the idea of a full mag dump.

Yep, tension is the enemy. It seems counterintuitive when you first start out, but you soon come to realize almost every problem is a result of "locking up" something. This applies to your trigger freeze and flinching as well. The best way for me to realize this was to stop fighting the recoil. Then the concept started to make a lot of sense.

+1 to up and press out. The momentum of the swinging gun tends to pull me over the target as well, leading to some hesitation as I try to drive the pistol back into place. I'm also slower finding the front post with this method, which has to happen before I can even correct my overswing. That said, I probably do a hybrid of my true "up and out" press, like I use to draw from the holster. I can tell this because it never felt right/as fast to start from the low ready. My guess would be that I swing it some on the way up before pressing out-- so call it 25% swing, 75% press. (It's not something I ever practiced, and only used "seriously" for my first 2 attempts at our local steel plate match, before moving on to the draw class.)

Well, live fire today definitely confirmed it-- the splits are faster than before. Accuracy actually seemed to improve, although it's probably not entirely due to this new sight focus during the draw. At the same time, it is distinctly possible that I rushed a few shots without clear sight focus in the past that lead to some fliers-- and this particular (correct) method makes that much more difficult to manage. Still slow as all get out, though. What are GM splits from holster in Production again?

That's exactly how I've been doing it since your first suggestion. It's almost impossible to verbalize the process/sensation, but I'm 99% sure we're on the same page. Now it seems to be happening on its own-- which is a good thing while shooting, so I can be aware instead of concentrated on any particular thing. (Yep-- read the book. ) It's also made transitions a lot more natural; I'm sure they're faster as well, which we'll find out when my elbow heals up a bit more and I break the timer out again.

I've had the same problem as well, although it's almost exclusive to Glocks for me. (The contributing factor of frame drag is the likely culprit in my particular case.) I'll go ahead and second the issue of strong hand grip pressure being a large factor, as I played around with it and saw some changes. While it may not be "milking" exactly, it seems like the natural tendency is to bear down on the strong hand in order to work the heavier trigger (probably in an effort to AVOID milking entirely). I believe shifting your trigger finger around can be helpful as well, as it negates the tendency to push the heavier triggers a bit off line during the press. For me, visualizing more of a downward motion (instead of straight back) actually helped to correct this more than moving my finger around. Note also on the Glock that you may want to position your finger towards the very bottom of the trigger guard, to the point of lightly dragging it. The last 3 superb Glock shooters I asked about this all said that they did just that-- and it made a huge difference for me as well. (It not only negates frame drag, but makes it easier to accomplish a rearward press IMO.)

Don't do that. Yes. Before you draw, look right where you want the bullet to hit the target. As soon as you begin the draw, bring your focus back to where the front sight will appear. When you get it right the front sight will be in razor sharp focus as soon as it stops moving. Well, trying to speed up for the sake of trying new things! But yeah-- definitely a no-no. I never considered just shifting focus without moving the eyes-- that makes way too much sense! I think I was doing this by accident, although I was visualizing myself actually glancing down to find the post on its way towards the target. Now that I'm thinking about it the right way, it's a million times more natural and coupled with the practice I've put in since making this post, it's already starting to drop my par time a little bit. I will also evaluate the draw some more and see about pressing out from a higher position. Right now, I'm somewhere in the middle-- not too low, but not high enough to make the most out of the sight picture during the press out. Coupled with benos' advice, I think I've got a winner here! Thanks a ton guys!

So you start to pick them up on the way out, and then find them clearly indexed on the target once the weapon is raised. That sounds like what I've been working on today, and I've found thus far that my POA seems to be the same as if I wait until the pistol is steady before finding the clear sight picture. It's possible that for longer/more precise shots, I'll have to revert to the old method and slow down a bit in the process.

When I focus on a particular spot on the target during the draw, the sights align with it naturally-- hands following eyes, as the saying goes. However, when I try to speed up, I end up looking past/over/around the sights for the first shot. When do you all pick up the front post during the draw? I've been focusing on the target until the sights are aligned (and blurred), and then locking in on the front post. This afternoon (during dry fire), I tried picking up the sights during the press out and found it to be much faster. My only concern is that I won't be able to achieve my intended POA this way. Do the hands still follow the eyes if you move the eyes a split second earlier in an effort to pick up the sights?

Are you 100% positive you're right eye dominant? May be a silly question, I know-- but you'd be surprised how often it's relevant, even for long time shooters. I thought your current method was intended to change or strengthen eye dominance, or as a potential cure for cross-dominant shooters. Not 100% on that, so wait for a more expert response. Sadly, I can't offer any other advice. From what I recall, picking up a clear view of the front post wasn't a problem for me when I started shooting both eyes open, but it (obviously) took some focus and a lot of practice to make it second nature. Good luck!

Getting the pistol "higher" means bringing it up into your workspace. Some people align the mag well with the tip of their nose; others advocate being able to barely see over the top of the muzzle. EVERYONE understands that bringing the pistol in closer to their body provides for much better control. You obviously don't want to be handcuffing yourself, so see what feels the most natural for your body type, eyes, etc. When you start to get faster and more comfortable, you'll want to start picking up the next target well before the mag is fully seated. If you've got thousands of reps with your head down, it's going to be a big problem. Think of it this way. When you're doing something that calls for a lot of fine motor control-- rigging a fishing lure, getting a splinter out of your finger, putting a screw in your glasses-- what do you do naturally? Bring the work in close to your eyes of course. The same principle applies. It also looks like you're closing one eye in the second video, when you're focusing on the front post. That's something else you should try to train away, provided it's not a necessary evil due to some issue with your vision. EDIT to add: Watch Travis do it. The Man

If you're going to change, earlier is better. And while I'm sure it's not true 100% of the time, the overwhelming majority will prefer aftermarket sights to the factories-- especially in a competition gun.

I am right eye dominant-- but apparently not quite as dominant as most everyone else. Every now and again, my left eye will actually take over for a split second and my natural POA has me seeing the sights as if my right eye were closed. I noticed it first while messing around with night sights in the pitch blackness. Lining up ghostly, glowing dots with absolutely no point of reference revealed this phenomenon. It's never happened in a match or live fire practice, and only in extremely rare circumstances while dry firing. The two things that seem to come together to produce this effect is fatigue and a close, monochrome background. If I am standing within 3-5 feet of a wall and my eyes are a bit tuckered out, I can reproduce the dominance switch reasonably consistently. While it's never happened with a hot firearm in my hands, the effect seems tangible nonetheless. Although my sight picture was consistent and clear, I found that referencing it on the blurry background target often led me to hold left of center. I diagnosed it on one particularly aggravating range day, where my groups were super tight, every shot felt perfect... but most shots were about 1" left of center at 10 yards. I got my sight picture, held, and closed my left eye. The post was lined up properly. I broke a couple of slow fire shots, and repeated. Now my POA had shifted to exactly where the rounds were hitting-- to the left! Now a caveat. These may have been stand alone, unrelated issues. Perhaps my stance was off (I've tweaked it some) and my natural POA was actually a bit left of my initial sight picture. But I took steps to shore up my right eye dominance and ensure I was wasn't favoring one side of the blurry near-double image of the target. In short order, the problem has all but disappeared. YMMV.

Not uncommon with a Glock. I was in the exact same boat and only now feel like I'm making headway to get out of it. I spent a long time assuming it was something that had to do with my grip, as the problem all but disappeared with other pistols. Then I considered (more like realized) it could be an issue with trigger press, and the way in which my finger engages the trigger surface. What I discovered was that several aspects of the trigger were throwing me for a loop. Despite knowing that a Glock required it's own set of skills to shoot consistently and accurately, I had never really defined those differences. Given, it's going to be different for everyone based on several biological and psychological factors. So take my example as something to consider, and figure out what works best for you. Note that I'm still not as accurate as I'd like, but I've seen improvement in just a few nights of dry fire and a single 200 round range trip. I noticed that the ergonomics of the pistol were causing me to push shots to the left. Grip angle, width, trigger shape, size and placement-- even the tactile sensation of the trigger safety. Coupled with the size and shape of my hands/fingers, I had a tendency to move the muzzle a bit during my trigger press-- using the exact same position and mechanics that work so well on every other pistol I own/have shot. I put a bit more finger on the trigger, but more importantly, I really studied what it took to press it straight back. For me, visualizing that I was actually moving the trigger downward was the ticket-- it centered up the pressure quite nicely. Now, I toss a rare shot to the right, which was NEVER happening before. But in 200 rounds (slowfire, drills, pairs, etc.) I didn't put a single shot left-- where I often grouped enough shots to chew a ragged hole in the target. It stood out that I had definitely found the problem!

Indeed, I sanded the little cylinder/post and used the flat head of a screw driver to put a slope on the lead edge. Went into place with a lot of effort; I'm pretty sure they're going to stick around for a while. Coupled with the velcro I'm about to put on the rear of the belt loop, I'd be very surprised if they moved at all. Now I just have decide which of these two velcro types to use.

They came with toothpicks. I got them from a local guy (GM no less) as individual units, but priced more like the 5-pack that's out there. I picked up the Velcro today, although I'm torn again as to which I should use. Snagged some super-maxi-ultra-industrial strength stuff ( ), and the plain ol' standard use as well. I feel like the heavy duty might wear out the inner belt a bit faster, as it seems intended for something that goes up and stays that way (for the sake of not damaging the mounting surface/material with other fasteners). Going to do a bit of research before making the final choice, but I'll probably stick to the regular grade and if it doesn't work as I hope, I'll switch it out for the good stuff. I'm kind of surprised no one else has run into this problem. I have the standard Hi-Torque CR Speed Belt, and not the new one that I hear is a bit wider. Unless I'm a complete 'tard and I'm trying to set the toothpicks up the wrong way, someone else has to have run into this before.

Just got the CR Belt and Pouches, and started doing some fitting. I've got the right mag shim in place, got the cant exactly how I want it, and got them spaced properly on the belt. Tomorrow, the Velcro backing will be installed on the belt loops to help lock the whole thing together. While they are pretty darn tight on the belt (and I'm guessing the additional velcro will lock them in), there's still a little bit of play that I'd like to eliminate. I figured out pretty quickly that the little 2" toothpick was to take up all the slack between the belt and the pouch. But I'm running into a problem. On the flat surface of the belt shim (where it would contact the pouch's belt loop), there is a little post/cylinder/nub of plastic-- about the diameter of a small roll pin. It simply will not go past the edge of the belt loop. Extra force actually makes it more of a problem, as it flattens out and gets a bit taller. I'm considering shaving/sanding the lead edge a into a wedge shape so that it'll go in-- or removing that little scrap of plastic altogether. As I'd like to avoid going the set screw route (not too handy with the screw gun), I wanted to see if anyone else had some tips/tricks that would eliminate removing material. Or at the very least, see if anyone else had done some custom fitting of their own and still managed to keep the toothpick in place after the belt wore in a little bit. I'd hate to shave that sucker off to get it to fit, only to find it's no longer tight enough once the outer belt wears in a bit.

I had the exact same thing happen to me with a PMAG not too long ago. While I'm 90% sure I didn't overload the mag, downloading it 1 round will solve the problem. (Note that I had several very large guys trying to seat this thing, and no one could get it locked in with the bolt closed.) Sadly, I haven't had time to experiment with that mag. I would suggest you do some testing, and look into wearing in that spring a little bit. Repeated loading (to max) and unloading could very well loosen it up enough to make it work.

Don't give me all the credit! You and my B-class buddy helped me wrap my mind around the issue, and gave me things to think about to make it happen. I'm happy to say that in 400 rounds, this problem has all but disappeared. While diagnosing another random anomaly today while shooting pairs, I decided to freeze after breaking the first shot and see what my POA looked like. Whattya know, the post fell perfectly into the notch even though I KNEW I was only firing one shot. (And I fixed the secondary problem t'boot!) Thanks for the help and the kind words. If there's one thing I know for sure about shooting, it's that confidence is at a premium. And let me say that I'm feeling pretty good right now!

This, and of course the time you lose shoving the gun all the way in and making sure not to knock it around on the way out. However, as this was the last target of the stage, this obviously doesn't apply. While there's definite differences between our game and real world situations/training, there's definitely some value in it nonetheless. Core fundamentals obviously reach across all areas of shooting, and anything you can do to improve them will go a long way. While we may be developing bad habits for defense handgun applications, we are strengthening key fundamentals at the same time.

So I focused today on imagining I was firing pairs even when group shooting. A friend suggested I should never plan on firing "just one shot", even if I only pressed the trigger one time. It seemed to make a lot of difference, and while still a bit sluggish for my tastes, the sights realigned much easier and faster than normal. I also worked extensively with more forward cant to my wrist. Even when I spaced out on visualization, it made a notable difference as well. Combined, the two showed marked improvement in my 200 round session. I noticed something else that is almost certainly a huge contributing factor. While filming 5 shot strings at a reasonably slow speed, it became apparent that the recoil was not only lifting the gun, but driving it backwards (as it's supposed to); my elbows and shoulders were absorbing recoil as intended. HOWEVER, the muzzle never returned to its original lateral position. I was actually being moved back by the recoil, which equated to an issue with my stance. I went more aggressive and focused in on this aspect and saw improvement all around. The first shot still put me back a bit, but the next 4 saw the muzzle return to its former position with only minor rearward deviation. I filmed 50 shots in controlled pairs, as fast as I could shoot them while properly indexing the sights. Not only did I shoot an impressive group at 10 yards, I noticed that none of the problems existed at speed. The recoil didn't walk me back and the sights realigned perfectly each time. I'm sure it's a combination of getting the grip and stance right, coupled with the twitch muscle response to knowing a second shot was necessary. Obviously, I'll continue to work on these aspects until it becomes second nature. Thanks for the advice and insight, Powder. I not only understand the concepts more clearly, I've got an effective way of thinking about and analyzing them.

When I shoot at "full speed", the sights always return to their original position. (Not always perfect of course, but they do come back down.) It's only during slow fire when they "stick" a bit too high. I have indeed visualized/pretended I'm going to fire a pair, but only broken the first shot instead. The sights returned to their original position, but it seemed a bit slow and deliberate. In fact, at anything but wide open speeds, that's the sensation I get-- that I'm forcing them back into place, and can actually watch the front post lower as a direct result of my efforts. From time to time, this results in a low shot as I let the front post dip too far but still break the shot when I feel as if they're aligned. However, I will continue to work on the visualization aspect. That makes a lot of sense. There's also a good chance I'm relaxing too early and unlocking the stance or grip, just as you say. That makes a ton of sense, in fact. What I gather from the gist of your post is that it's a matter of perception that differs between shooters. Some (like me) feel as if we're returning the sights to the proper position; others feel as if it happens naturally. But as long as it HAPPENS, I shouldn't sweat the how and why. That also makes sense. I am also going to mess around with camming my support hand more. Right now, it's only angled a tiny bit downward and an adjustment could result in a more natural return of the pistol to its starting position.

I do tend to slap the trigger a bit on follow up shots, which is something I've worked at quite a bit in order to make it a rare occurrence. A smooth and steady trigger press is paramount for a Glock, as any pause after the slack has been taken up will push the shot left more often than not. I'm definitely tweaking my grip strength and support hand placement a bit in the very near future. While I shoot thumbs forward, the left wrist isn't cammed very much at all and might relate to the problem I'm having resetting the sights. I figure I'll play around with it, starting and super aggressive and working backward to see if it makes any difference. Thanks for the tips, Jack.

First off-- long time reader, first time poster. Greetings to all. I don't really consider myself a true "beginner", but this is almost certainly a beginner question. It all revolves around a particular issue I've noticed in my live fire practice. During slow fire, the pistol recoils and I track the sights upward. However, they do not return naturally to my original POA. Firing pairs, failure to stop drills or in competition, I never notice. But I have to physically index the gun-- it's not happening naturally. I've never had any formal training, and (for some stupid reason) have never picked up a detailed book on competitive shooting. Instead, I have picked the brains of the successful shooters I know and searched the Interwebz for every post, discussion and video on the subject. What I've found is that I'm having trouble wrapping my head around my current situation. I hesitate to call it a problem, because frankly, I don't seem to understand a few key concepts-- which is really frustrating for someone who NEVER struggles with critical reading. (I think I might be taking tidbits from different schools of thought without even realizing the distinction, TBH.) Specifically, here's my questions/conundrums. 1) Recoil Management "Don't fight the gun" seems to go against this term. If you establish a proper grip and stance, and simply wait for the sights to return to their proper index point, what's to manage in the first place? Is this an active process, or simply a term used to describe the proper fundamentals that allow you to AVOID fighting the gun? When I drop the striker/hammer on a dud primer, snap cap (cap-n-ball drill) or empty chamber (strong thumb disengages the slide catch from time to time), I definitely move the empty pistol. This is most pronounced "at speed", and almost imperceptible during slow/deliberate shooting. It does not effect my accuracy in any way, shape or form-- my flinches heel the shot high and left, trigger slaps low and left, and lazy support hand the standard "Glock push left". (Right handed shooter, BTW.) There was a time when I was hitting below POA, and I attributed it to this "fighting". I seem to have naturally worked that problem out, but only in terms of timing. It doesn't happen before the shot breaks, in other words. Am I supposed to be doing this? As I've said, it is the way in which I return the sights to their proper alignment. Otherwise, as per my slow fire evidence, they will always be a bit off vertically. 2) Recovery This seems a better term in light of the desire to not fight the gun. The shot breaks, the sights jump up and you naturally recover your original sight picture by way of proper technique, firm grip/wrists, etc. At the same time, I suppose it could mean a physical readjustment of the gun to get them in place. Are these two concepts conflicting? Are they different ways of talking about the same thing? Are they supposed to be happening in unison, at all, independent of each other? I could go on and on, but it seems best to stop here-- for the sake of brevity and clarity at the very least. Perhaps if/when the topic develops a bit more, I can get some insight into a few more (related) things. Thanks in advance to any who may reply!