dirtdarte

The interesting thing to me about this discussion is the OP's desire to produce zero runout to increase accuracy. The assumption being that a perfectly strait cartridge will sit in the chamber perfectly strait. This revels a fundamental misunderstanding of what the actual mechanism is that allows alignment of the cartridge in the chamber to the bore of the rifle. Sure, a zero runout round of ammunition will contribute to accuracy, however, that goal should be considered a secondary priority to the fundamental imperative of proper sizing to allow proper alignment to begin with. The case headspace's off the shoulder. A properly sized case will naturally align in the chamber provided the case isn't over-sized (shoulder pushed back too far) and the bolt can close on the cartridge. As long as your rifle is built correctly (strait, square etc) alignment problems wont be a problem. With a gas gun (semi-auto) it is necessary to size to factory spec (or close to it) to allow feeding/chambering. A major limiting factor with a gas gun. You must work within the limitations of your platform. A progressive press is a ammunition assembly machine. If you move the precision reloading steps off the progressive press and use it (the progressive press) as a assembly tool, you can assemble extremely accurate ammunition. 550...650...both are great. As far as powder and a progressive... in most cases it's simply not going to matter if you use a powder that flows well. The benchrest guys load by VOLUME not weight,... and frequently load at the shooting bench during the match... that should send a message. A smooth flowing powder through the powder measure will give you very good consistency. If you find you need more, you wont be using a progressive press anyway... you'll be further down the road at that point.

LOL.... yes.. that is correct.... somehow in my geriatric fog I confused bullets with presses. Thanks for the correction. It could be worse though... we could be discussing toothbrushes and toilet brushes,

If you want "zero" runout, the two steps you need to consider are sizing and seating. Don't pull your cases through a sizing die button and fully support the bullet while seating in a floating type setup so the bullet and case can align during the seating process. Neck turning is about neck tension and not about alignment. If your weapon is a gas gun/AR platform, the act of feeding can cause some alignment issues but it is unlikely that bullet alignment is that big of a deal. Anneal your brass for neck tension... play with seating depth... don't try to push the load too hard and use a powder measure like a redding master for more consistent powder throws. The 650 is a perfectly good press for alignment 99% of the time. If your going for real precision then loose the AR/gas gun platform and use a Forster A-Max, don't full length resize and weigh everything out individually. Precision is about preparation not assembly. You wont achieve zero runout consistently on a progressive press ever. A few rounds here or there... yes... every time ? No way.

Yup... BIG waste of time ... money... for nothing. Maybe the next tool of improvement we should be discussing should be what tweezers and razor works best for trimming powder grains...

I bought a large through Brian a couple of months ago... It came with the brass roller. I don't know why Dillon would tell you that they aren't shipping the large yet.... They did in my case... and I didn't even ask for it.

Of course you can.... Just trim to minimum length... Your rifle won't blow up like a grenade and you will be within specs even after resizing. No big deal at all. Often, when I am forming cases from one caliber to another.. (.22 hornet to .17 hornet or .204 Ruger to .17 Remington) I trim the formed case a little short before fireforming so that after fireforming the cases will be at the correct length.

I cast and coat my own. I use Hi-tek coating in the powder form and add Acetone then coat and bake. I am very happy with the results. I can realize significant cost savings and achieve better results than purchasing plated bullets. Even buying the lead I can cast 4000 bullets and coat them for about $120. Pretty good savings.... if you have the time to do it yourself... I do.

Ya... you'd be set with what you listed.... One suggestion.... get the AT 1500 instead of the 1200B. Just a little more money for a more powerful trimmer that offer more options. (Im thinking 300 BLK trimming) 3 years down the road and you may want the option.... Super swage 600 is great.... You won't need the low version of the case prep toolhead if you are working .223. Just get an extra toolhead and stand if you want it. You will gain more options as you will have 5 threaded holes in the toolhead that are pretty much usable. One other suggestion.... Get an M die to knock any burrs off the neck and expand the mouth of the case after passing through the trim/size die. I use a Lyman M die. If you decide to use the swager that mounts to your 650.... it's my understanding that Dillon wont honor your warranty and I've heard reports that it doesn't really work all that well anyway. Stick with the Super Swage 600.

I'm with jmorris... ALWAYS clean rifle brass first thing. If you want clean primer pockets... for instance your going to wet tumble the cases... run the brass through a universal deprimer die to knock out the primers... them clean the brass. Dirty brass and resizing dies don't play well together.

Ive ordered a lot of stuff... A LOT.....lol. I always receive all the packages on the same day... without fail. BUT... I order through Brian and I live in Utah.... so there's that factor... adjacent state. Must make a difference.

From the sounds of it, you are producing really good ammo. If it meets your needs.... and it sounds like it does... great. This whole handloading process and pursuit of accuracy is half the fun of firearms and shooting for me. It can be a real challenge to squeeze a little more accuracy from a firearm and improve it's performance. I'll stick my neck out and suggest that if you were to experiment with a different bullet or three your accuracy will improve. Once you really drink he Kool aid and start driving for higher levels of consistency, the FMJ will just hold you back.... provided you have a rifle capable of sub MOA accuracy. Bullets matter, and the Hornady FMJ.... while a good bullet... with excellent performance within its design and purpose... isn't a target bullet... or a particularly consistent or accurate bullet. I use them for blasting. I like to do my accuracy testing at 200 yards at the minimum. 100 yds is ok for chrono work.... not accuracy. It takes a little distance for a bullet to settle down. It is not uncommon to fire a 1 moa group at 100 yds and then fire a sub moa group at 200 using the same load.... consistently.

Here are my thoughts.... Unless you are sorting brass by weight or volume.... neck turning.... neck sizing etc.... don't get wrapped around the axle over spreads up to and a bit beyond 50 fps. Actually, 50fps is pretty good. We're talking extreme spreads here in a sample of 10 or so rounds. The temp of the barrel and the rate of fire will have an effect this measurement. The pace of your shot string... the temperature... the volume of powder in the case and the position of the powder... lots of variables. Your loading bulk in a progressive machine and dispensing powder by volume. Your doing very well to get those spreads considering all the balls in the air that are out of your control. If you don't feel confident that you are producing pretty good ammo... try this experiment. Load up 20 or so rounds... and measure the powder by weight. Intentionally vary the load by a few 10ths every other round or so... of course be safe... don't conduct this experiment on the edge of max charge. Now on a nice day... go the range and set up a target at 300 yards or so. Set up you chrono and fire your test rounds. Go down range and police up your target. You will feel pretty confident then. Incidentally, I feel like I've hit on a pretty good load when I can get SD's in the 10-11 or less range. That however doesn't mean that you have an accurate load for that rifle.... not by a long shot. You need to fire the loads AT DISTANCE in good conditions. Look up latter testing. It's a process that will teach you what you need to know in order to produce the best ammunition for that particular rifle. Targets don't lie. Ill edit this in... When you begin to get serious about producing accurate rifle ammunition, you have to realize that it's a whole new game with regard to handloading. I would bet that at least 90% of all handloaders of rifle ammunition either never produce ammunition any better than off the shelf bulk stuff or get real lucky and fall into a load that surprises them. The trick is to understand that you have to build the ammo for the rifle.... and if your lucky, it will work well for another rifle too. The experiment I suggested was intended to demonstrate how little some of the elements (like powder charge or SD's) have any real effect on accuracy up to about 300-400 yards. They don't matter much. Finding the node of your rifle will be FAR ,FAR AND AWAY more valuable to increasing your accuracy. This is the secret that will allow you to produce the most accurate ammo for your rifle and will show you the potential accuracy of the rifle itself. Don't fall into the 100 yard groups for accuracy mindset or the magic number on the chrono crowd.

I use a Mr. Bullet in .223 on my 1050. Works great....no problems. Buy with confidence.

I bought 8 lbs. This stuff is good. It's slower than titegroup... by just a little. No smoke... VERY CLEAN. I'm not loading hot... but found it easy to make PF with a .40 and no pressure signs. SD's in the single digits. I'm happy with it. ANd it meters very well in the DIllon PD's.

I use the large bins from harbor freight... They are actually LARGER than the Dillon 1050 AKRO bins... and cost $2 bucks... they aren't as pretty though.

Thanks for all the great comments and suggestions.... As far as divisions for IDPA.... thanks for that suggestion. Makes perfect sense. Now to research magizines etc... There is so much info out there for the 1911 that for a relative newby to the platform, it can be overwhelming. Thanks so much for the help.

I have been toying with the idea of playing in both ESP IDPA and SS USPSA with the same gun. I've been trying to decide between a Dan Wesson Valor and a STI Trojan, both in .45. Am I missing anything. I understand they would both be legal and make weight etc..... Which gun would you choose and why? I'm really leaning towards the DW. I like clean lines and simplicity. I'm too old to win anything... just want to have fun. Thanks.

I've got a little twist to add to this story. For .40, I use a Redding G-rx die for all my new range brass or pick-ups. I sort them at the same time etc. When I load the cases, they get re-sized again and then receive primer power etc. When I gauge the loaded rounds, they fail to fall fully inside the gauge. I use a EGW gauge. The reason they fail the gauge is because the bullet fails the throat constriction inside the gauge. I cast, coat and size all my bullets to .402.. and that is enough for them to fail the gauge. I can seat the bullets deeper but then other problems arise like feeding and pressure. I've learned to live with it and can do a fair job at the eyeball test when gauging. The greatest factor I've found when reloading is a consistent repeatable procedure that automatically eliminates errors. I still gauge every round.

It's all about volume and speed. The Dillon full length re-sizes and trims in one operation. I've processed 2000 cases in less than 2 hours without breaking a sweat. Also, be aware that you are limited to just a few calibers with the 1200/1500... but the calibers that are available are high volume common calibers. It's possible to have a toolhead set up and adjusted.... load cases in the casefeeder and process without touching a single case. Adjusting is really no big deal at all. First, adjust the trim die for full length resizing and proper headspace. Run a case into the die... screw the trimmer down till it just makes contact with the case... trim... measure.. and adjust a little more if necessary. Done. Get extra lock rings and drill/tap them with a set screw to leave on the trim die if you never want to have to set up the tool again. I haven't done that because the set up is so simple and fast.

You will need to get a conversion kit,,,, unless your handy and can find a way to get the bullet dropper for 45 to drop 40. I really think you'll be better off with a conversion kit. That will add about $150.

I have 2 Mr bulletfeeders. Both are really good machines and I don't for a moment regret getting them. They aren't inexpensive but a good addition to your handloading operation. I've found that with a bulletfeeder, your attention can be more focused on all the other operations going on while handloading. Conversion kits for other calibers are available and not too expensive. Thats my two cents... Honestly, adding a bulletfeeder was the single biggest upgrade I have ever done with the highest gross benefit overall... excepting the addition of a 1050.

Congratulations on the press.... you'll love it. The bulletfeeder will have you giggling like a little school girl. I predict that you will go into a type of shell-shock that will bring on panic attacks with thoughts that your supplies of primers and powder are insufficient and nearly depleted. This will cause hours of anxious searching on the internet for handloading supplies... an almost desperate quest that will occupy your every waking hour.

I've always looked at the name of the press for an indication of rounds per hour loaded.... And it's pretty accurate in my experience. XL650... yup.. right around 650... 1050... yup around 1050. Primers are the bottleneck... I recently upgraded to the RF-100 primer filler... now I spend seconds per primer fill-up and not the peck peck peck minutes I used to. But it isn't a race after all and I enjoy the handloading process.

Last week, I ordered a large primer conversion for the 1050 thru Brian... I received the package today. Guess what... no rubber .... instead it has the brass roller. This is for LARGE primer... so apparently, Dillon has converted to the brass roller for both small AND large primer slides. I now have the brass roller for both of my primer slides.

I've had my 1050 for about a week. In that week, I've processed 4000 5.56 cases... and then loaded 4000 rounds. Hanging spent primers were the only problem I had in the brass prep phase... and I had 4 or 5 little hang-ups during the loading phase... and every problem was brass related... damaged brass that I missed. I've been loading ammunition for 40+ years and have used all kinds of handloading equipment. The 1050 is the king of the hill as far as I'm concerned. I suspect that most people who always seem to have problems with their press are having problems they create or don't adjust the machine correctly. Time spent in the setup of the machine and maintenance are pretty important... this isn't a rockchucker after all.