2MoreChains
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Posts posted by 2MoreChains
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A 9+1 capacity 1911 sounds like one chambered in .40SW. Typcially .45acp is 8+1, 9mm is 10+1 unless you start getting into extended magazines.
Magwells are legal for USPSA's Single Stack division. The limitation they do impose is the pistol with unloaded mag inserted musy weigh less than 43 oz and must fit in the "box". Most of the magwells out there are aluminum so that doesn't add much to the overall weight and most of them are able to fit inside the "box". Why the STI USPSA model doesn't come with a magwell... durned if I know. But betcha if they put on one, some people won't like the one that comes with it and will opt for a different brand. So not providing one helps keep the cost down. (I just made that up, so no idea if it is true...)
Its not so much what I recommend as what the rulebook allows as far as things like dust cover length. Bear in mind, the gun needs to make weight, and a FLDC 1911 is going to be pretty hefty... good chance that it will be more than the max allowable. As far as things such as lightrails on the frame, you can have one but it can't be full length (3.25" long IIRC). Appendix D5 in the rulebook has all that info.
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under 2k should be fine, but it seems the only 9mm 1911 with a 10+1 capacity (if I'm going to shoot minor PF, the only advantage is max possible capacity, correct?) is the very nice S&W posted earlier in the thread by FreeJersey.
Are there other choices that are as good or better with the same capacity? The reason I'm concerned about the S&W is that I was told is has some Schwartz (sp?) Safety System, and I'll have to disassemble the rear sights just to take down the gun for cleaning, and then when I re-assemble the gun, my sights might be off. Is there any truth to this? Is it a big deal? Any other gotchas in buying a 9mm 1911 for single-stack minor competition?
Thanks for any tips
You should be able to find some pretty nice 9mm 1911's in your price range. Two that come immediately to mind are the STI Trojan or Sentry. My understanding is all 9mm 1911's have a 10-rnd capacity using standard 9mm mags. Tripp, Wilson, Dawson, Checkmate... take your pick. You are correct in that if you shoot Single Stack in minor PF you can load your mag to 10 rnds -but it must still fit the box (which if shooting 9mm it will unless you get mags with humongeous basepads). The pistol with an unloaded mag must also weigh less than 43 oz (some do, some need to be put on a diet).
Not sure where you got the information about needing to remove the rear sight for cleaning if your pistol has the Swartz firing pin safety, first I've heard of that. I will say that if you want to remove the Swartz firing pin safety you need to remove the rear sight to get to the plunger, block and spring. Some people don't like the Swartz or Series 80 firing pin safeties. None of the STI pistols have this ummm, feature.
If you're looking for a 1911 to shoot USPSA's single stack division, I say get any one of the STI 1911's that have a bushing barrel and a short dust cover (ie Trojan or Sentry). Buy 6-7 magazines, 6 mag pouches, belt, holster and let 'er rip. Maybe get a magwell, sights that help you see better, and a trigger job. Later if you feel like your equipment is holding you back you can look at upgrading to something you think will be better for you.
Oh, and if shooting minor... shoot a lot of A's!
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Thanks for the tip. The rattle bothered me so I went back to the plastic spacers. Can't say I noticed any real difference in reliability between the two. Perhaps overtime if the plastic ones wear down...?
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With the metal spacers installed, can you hear them rattling around when empty?
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Aside from changing thumb safeties on the gun, what else have you changed?
Last winter I did a make-over on a 2011 and had a new sear/hammer/disco installed. The stock thumb safety (which was fitted to the stock sear) did exactly as you described where the TS could be flipped up even when the hammer was down.
I ended up replacing the thumb safety and fit it to the new sear. I now keep the original TS along with the original sear as a matched set in my parts kit in the event I need a temporary spare.
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Not 100% certain on the exact dimensions, but I do know that these rear sights fit the Kimber Series II and pre-SII pistols.
http://www.dawsonprecision.com/CategoryProductList.jsp?cat=SIGHTS+REAR:Kimber+Rear+Sights
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My 2 cents: if you're going to get a 1911 in 9mm, why not get a bushing barreled 9mm 2011 (ala Eagle)? Other than not being able to shoot a 2011 in SSD, it can pretty much do double or triple duty in other competitions. Shoot it loaded to 10+1 in ESP. Shoot it loaded to capacity in Steel Challenge and 3-gun. Heck, shoot it in Limited-minor if you like (I have, but found my slight increase in speed didn't make up for the bigger loss of minor scoring...).
I shoot a 6" .40SW 2011 in Limited, but for all the other comps I shoot my 9mm 2011. The recoil of 135 PF 9mm ammo is silly soft, mags hold a healthy number of rounds (17 in a 126mm or 23 in a 140mm mag), and 9mm reloading components are cheaper. My 9mm 2011 is a semi-custom: frame started out as a Eagle chambered in .40SW but after I got that 6" 2011 I had a 9mm top end built for the Eagle. I put the .40 slide back on it when I need a back-up gun for major matches, but 99% of the time it wears the 9mm slide/barrel.
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I have four 1911 or 2011's with that same rear sight. Have not had the windage screw break on any of them, only the elevation screw on one but that was because the set screw came loose.
You're living proof that 3 is the new 2 in the phrase "Two is one and one is none"!
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I find the arched MSH helpful and have them on all my 1911/2011's. I use the STI magwell, and the arched MSH works with those magwells.
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I have an Eagle that was originally chambered in .40SW that I had a 9mm top end built for it. The original ejector (.40SW) can be used for either top end. The 9mm top end needed a new slide, barrel, bushing, firing pin, FPS, sights, guide rod, and extractor. The idea was to be able to pop the slide stop out, remove one top end and slide the other one on. My gunsmith fit the 9mm slide to the frame, and I haven't noticed any issues with the gun wearing differently between the two top ends (or maybe I should say: yet).
I still use the Eagle configured in .40SW as a backup gun when I shoot Limited at a major match, but the majority of the time it wears the 9mm top end to shoot 3-gun, Steel Challenge, and a little IDPA (whenever major PF is not needed).
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My experience with 9mm and .40SW STI 2011 mags has been pretty good reliability when I kept them in stock configuration. Issues seem to pop up when trying to maximize capacity.
Shooting IDPA or L-10 I just use stock mags since capacity is restricted to 10 rnds. For Limited and 3-gun I've had to change out followers and basepads to get max capacity, but had to do some tweaking (mainly with the followers) to get them 100%. Plus you have to make sure your extended mags fit the gauge.
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I only get to shoot probably 6-8 uspsa matches and 12 idpa matches a year. I want to get a nice gun and be able to shoot as much as possible with it. I think the eagle with the bushing barrel in 40 is the way to go. That way, I can get proficient with one gun and be totally awesome with it. Lol I would probably use the same holster for both sports just different belts. Mag holder is the same as well. The safariland 773's or 073's can't remember the number. What do you guys think?
That's what I did for a couple of years, and I had a hoot doing it. I modified the STI aluminum magwell by grinding down the sides a little to fit in the IDPA box, or supposedly the "Tactical" magwell that STI now offers is supposed to fit the IDPA box. Or you can just take the magwell off everytime you shoot an IDPA match.
For holsters I started out using a BladeTech DOH (removed the DOH bracket for IDPA) and Safariland 773 mag pouches for both USPSA and IDPA. But after about 6 months I got tired of taking apart my USPSA belt each time I shot an IDPA match and ended up getting a dedicated holster for USPSA (Center of Mass) for use with the 773s on a CR Speed belt, and kept the BladeTech for IDPA and bought two Comp-Tac singles for the STI 126mm mags. Incidently for a while I even used the CR Speed inner belt for IDPA until I got a different belt.
The cool part was the .40 Eagle with bushing barrel was the same for everything, and I made that work for a couple of seasons until I could afford to have a separate gun for each sports. That being said, if given the choice of a 9mm or .40SW for IDPA I would pick the 9mm (cheaper to reload for, plus you get more capacity when shooting 3-gun). So given that you shoot more IDPA than you do USPSA... that begs the question of should you just get the 9mm Eagle to start with (even though that means you shoot Limited minor in USPSA, but it sounds like you're more of an IDPA shooter), then in a year or two go get yourself a .40 as a dedicated USPSA gun if you still have the itch. In the long run it would be cheaper than doing what I did.
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I shot a .40 Eagle with bushing barrel for a couple of years as my do-everything gun for USPSA, IDPA, Steel Challenge, and 3-gun. It worked, and I feel like I was able to be competitive with it. I loaded major PF for USPSA Limited div, and shot minor for everything else. I bought three 126mm mags for IDPA, and used the 140's for everything else. As I recall, I also changed recoil springs when switching back and forth between major and minor. You can work up some pretty ridiculously soft loads in .40 minor... almost to the point where you feel like you're waiting on the slide to return to battery!
Then about a year ago I got the itch to build a 6" gun, and once I had that up and running I had a 9mm top end built for the Eagle. I still have the original .40SW top end but it only gets returned to that configuration when I need a back-up gun to my 6" .40 at a major match.
Personally I'm a huge fan of the Eagle in 9mm. This gun is a lot of fun to shoot, and 23+1 capacity is nice to have in 3-gun. I suppose the only downside to a 9mm Eagle is the inability to be scored major PF in Limited or L-10. But for everything else (IDPA, Steel, 3-gun) it is a great platform.
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About a year ago I had a .40SW gun built for Limited using a 6" STI unique cut tri-top slide on top of a STI 2011 Tactical frame. I spec'd a Unique slide since the ball cuts on a 6" Classic slide puts the cuts further back than the end of the Tactical's dust cover, but my eventual goal was to have the ball cuts milled into the slide once it was all broken in.
I shot the pistol for a couple of months (matches plus a bunch of practice) while it was still in the Unique form, and comparing the before and after I recall the gun shot flatter as I took more weight off the slide. Not knowing if I was going to like a heavy or lightweight gun, we planned to do additional milling on the slide in steps, and the first thing the GS did was mill the ball cuts to the slide to match the Tactical frame. Later he cut four additional FCS serrations into each side of the slide (this was more to put additional FCS where my hand goes than actual weight reduction), and finally after another three months of shooting I asked him to mill in a coffin cut into the top of the slide (think of the cutouts in a Glock 34/35 or XDM slide). Altogether I think we lost about 1 to 1.5 oz of weight, and the gun weighs in right around 38 oz without magazine. If I need more weight taken off, I could cut out a window in the FLGR/plug tunnel.
So to answer your question, I don't think the difference between Unique vs Classic slides is very much, even on a 6" slide. I think it more depends on which frame you go with. A 6" Unique profile slide coupled with a long FLDC wide frame would result in a pretty heavy pistol IMO, but a 6" Unique slide with a standard short dust cover frame not so much. Personally I like the looks of the classic profile ball cuts, but I would want those cuts to match whatever length dust cover on the frame from an aethetics point of view.
I think it took me a few months to get used to the extra weight of the 6" gun during transitions, but the 6" slide really balanced out the Tactical frame (weight-wise as well as visually). By comparison my 5" 2011 Eagle with short dust cover weighs 35 oz (without mag) and flips a little more in the hand with the same PF loads. But once I got used to the extra mass during transitions I really appreciated the 6" for the additional sight radius and softer recoil.
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Does this happen with bullets of a different profile? Might be worth a try. A year or so ago I had a new Limited gun built using a .40SW Kart barrel. The gun was fine with one maker's bullets (more of a RN) but with another brand (TC) it was just as you described. Upon ejecting the round we could see a mark on the TC bullet where it was hitting the rifling, and this is what was making it hard to retract the slide. So my gunsmith reamed the throat (not chamber) just a tad and now it feeds those TC bullets just fine. I think he told me it didn't take much, 1/2 a turn of the reamer maybe?
Try doing the plunk test with your barrel out of the gun and your ammo. If it is what I think it is, the back of the case will be a little proud of the barrel hood.
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I put a Marvel Unit 1 on a 1911 for Steel Challenge. Originally I wanted to put it on my 2011 frame, but the price of 2211 (TacSol brand) mags or even the ones from Marvel is what kept me from doing that. In the 1911 I can run GSG mags that cost $30/ea, and at the same capacity if I was running the conversion on my 2011.
That said, love the Marvel. It is a ton of fun to shoot in Steel Challenge, and has been fairly reliable with all brands of ammo that I've tried.
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I had to grind down the standard STI aluminum one to fit in the box. I like the narrowed profile. It still provides the index for the heel of the hand and is functional as a magwell. I went semi-modern day caveman and used a belt sander mounted in a vice.
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I've considering this myself as well. Currently have a Trojan in .45 that I use for SSD, but have been wanting a .40 since that is what I shoot in Ltd.
Price-wise what the others have said about a new Trojan being equal to the cost of a custom build is close. I have access to a local GS who does really good work and doesn't charge much (we argue everytime he does work for me and now I "tip" him in booze). Advantage for me with a custom build is I can spec exactly the components I want such as barrel, ignition components, safeties...etc. I am also partial to tri-topping.
So when you add up the cost of changing out parts on a stock Trojan to what you might want instead, that is where custom gives the benefit IMO. But if you'd be happy with the Trojan in stock configuration, buying a Trojan is probably the better deal.
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Bear Creek and Precision in my 2011's with Kart bbls. No issues.
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Agree with the above. I'm running Joe Hardy metal spacers with Grams 9mm follower & 11 coil spring kit, and a Dawson +1 basepad. 23 rnds reloadable in a 140mm mag.
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It is pretty subtle, but what the EB did for me was provide a wider beavertail that spread the web of my hand out a little further than the stock STI one did. Look at your WC and compare the width of the STI's beavertail to the WC's. Look at how the WC sits in your hand differently. Everyone is a little different, but for me the EB made a big difference with alleviating the hotspots caused by the corner on the thumb safety as well as preventing slide bite on the big joint of my thumb.
On my first STI I started to grind down the corner of the thumb safety to remove the hard corner, but I had to take so much off that I was worried about weakening the TS. Then I compared my STI to another 1911 where I didn't have this problem and determined that it was the relief cuts in the STI beavertail that was causing the gun to sit lower and deeper into the web of my hand. That allowed move contact with the corner of the TS, which led to the hotspots. With the EB installed I can run an unmodified STI tumb safety without any issues or discomfort.
Heck, its a fairly cheap part, and damn near drop-in. If it doesn't resolve your problem, sell the EB. I'll buy it if it hasn't been too molested.
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In that case, give the Ed Brown BTGS a try. It definitely helped me, and now all my STIs have the EB. Nothing against the stock STI BTGS, it's just not for me.
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Where is the thumb safety digging into your hand? I think I may have had a similar problem where the corner of the thumb safety wore a hot spot in the web of my hand if I shot a bunch in one session. I was also getting slide bite so those two factors led me to change out the STI beavertail grip safety for an Ed Brown.
Both my problems went away with the EB because the EB doesn't have those relief cuts on the beavertail like the stock STI one does. So before you change out your TS, might just try putting in an Ed Brown GS. Plus the EB one comes with a "memory" bump that helps to depress it. Relieving the underside of the arm of the GS helps to disengage the GS sooner without having to pin it.
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+1 to what everyone else said. Had a great time at this match. Shot with friends, shot decent (for me), worked one of the stages, and hung out with more friends in the evening. Perfect way to spend 5 days in Southern Utah! Felt like it all went really smooth. Hats off to Ken, the RMs, and all the support behind-the-scenes guys for all that they did to make this a success!
STI Eagle 9mm w/Bushing Barrel
in 1911-style Pistols
Posted
Shoot it until / if something breaks. If something does replace it with something else. Otherwise +4 to what they others have said!