3 gun at night?

[barrysuperhawk]

Is it possible to design a 3 gun match that would be safe to shoot at night?

Obviously Lights on the range would be required as would the permission of neighbors, but what other considerations could there be?

Also, what if the light was intentionally limited to challenge the competitors low light abilities?

How would weapon mounted lights be factored versus no lights.

Obviously I am talking a club level fun-match, not anything sanctioned.

[iainmcphersn]

Sounds interesting. Love to see some photos of comps vs. flash hiders.

[jbullgpd]

We used to have dark stages at our weekly evening match in Phx. Range lights for all the stages except one. That one we would run alternate light sources, strobes, wep mounted lights, whatever. It was fun. As for 3 gun that would be a whole other basket of chicken. Not sure how you could do distance rifle targets at night without night optics. Biggest thing when running night shoots, which I have done multiple times during my LE career, is safety safety safety. We always had extra RO's on hand to manage people. It is fun training but it has added safety risks. With LE work we had the luxury of all out weps having flashlights on them so I guess in essence we did night 3 gun on occasion. Rifle was kept to 50-75 yards and in. Iron sights are your friends. Don't know how optics guys would do it.

[Yankee Dog]

If you are going to do a night match then go all the way. No light on the range at all. Red lens flashlights only. We did this a few years back and it was great.

For safety sake, we kept the movement to a minimum but everyone still had a blast. We used candles to illuminate the rifle targets. Worked great until some bastages with optics started shooting out the candles.

We also had a belly gun stage. Shot with any small gun to include 22. Five shots all on the same target from about ten feet. The trick was you had to look into a camera flash just before the buzzer. Few people got all five hit.

A good time was had by all.

Yankee dog

[el pres]

We have a 3gun night match once a year in our remote range where no one would be

bothered. Full dark shooting but everyone has flashlights after the unload and show clear. We also were

going to have everyone wear lightsticks on a necklace for safety. It is a very fun and challenging match

with chioce of 3gun or optional pistol only so more people can play, all pistols start low ready or on table

to accomodate use of standard holster. Lights are put on before loading and removed after clearing then

reholstered ...

[buzzworm]

We shoot in a big gravel pit far (miles) from any houses, businesses, etc. During daylight savings time we run night HG once a month, with HG/rifle twice, and HG/SG once during those months.

We have used flashlights, ambient light, (on a full moon, you would be surprised how well you can see) weapon mounted lights, headlights, flashing lights, even strobe fireworks thrown out in front of the shooter just before the buzzer. I set up a HG stage with four spot lights shining in the shooter's face, run by a generator off in the woods. The targets were behind the wall the lights were mounted on. When the shooter flipped off the switch for the lights, it went dark, and the buzzer was hit. (the RO faced him until that point to make sure he didn't close his eyes to get accustomed to the dark) He then had to engage his targets in the dark. This was to simulate running into a dark building from out in the bright sunshine. Just a hint, good night sights are your friend in the dark.

We do dark rifle at close up out to 90 yds. On some targets we mount a flashing red LED on the targets rt. shoulder to show "muzzle blast" and the shooter has to figure over and down from there to get his hits. Some times folks fixate on the LEDs, so keep some spares. ETA: Also, rifle steel at around 60-70 yds with some type of low lighting on them (I use a lantern a few yds away) is lots of fun, esp. when hit with mild steel jacket ammo such as wolf. Can you say SPARKS?!!)

Iron sights on rifles work OK if you have ambient light to see them. Optics work well, esp. if you have some light to see your reticule. Dots work best, but you need one that can be turned WAY down. Many will "bleed" into the entire screen even on the lowest setting, so you need to play with them to see which work best.

This can only be done in a remote place that has secured access. It is also done with high walls, and the shooter is watched very carefully, by ALL on hand, not just the RO. Extreme care must be used. This is for information purpose only, to tell folks what we do, and not meant to encourage anyone else to do so.

Good luck.

Edited December 8, 2008 by buzzworm

[Carlos]

We used to do indoor 3gun, and it was often done in low light.

Our indoor range was limited by a 25 yard max range. BUT, at that time, the max distance for most weapons-mounted lights was not much more than 25 yards (yes I do realize there are better and better flashlights coming out every day).

Sure - many AR's are accurate out to 350 yards - but what good is that if your light only really illuminates well to 25 yards?

Movement was a problem for the RO. Imagine a competitor releases the light button during the reload: YOU have no idea where the muzzle is pointed or where the shooter's trigger finger is. Even with the weapon light on, its difficult to see the trigger finger - which is why we went with "low light" instead of "no light".

Better yet - try to limit movement as much as possible.

[ShooterSteve]

They used to have a fun match down in Fayetteville NC, and they used the police shoot house. It was a 360* shoothouse and they would turn out the lights. It was a blind stage with no walk thru. They had a map of the house outside that you could look at, and they had photographs of the bad guys outside. Once inside they had stapled pictures of the badguys to USPSA targets that had t-shirts on. There were also good guys in the house, so you couldn't just hose. You entered RO free with a timer on your back and cleared the house using headlamps, flashlights etc... get to the back door and shoot a stop plate to end. Safe your weapon and give a shout to the RO who would come in behind you and make sure it was all safe for everyone. Man it was fun. It was also extremely educational. I will never look at clearing my house the same way again. Wish they still had that match. The whole match was great. Miss it a lot.

[barrysuperhawk]

Man, Y'all sound like you have had alot of fun matches..

As far as stages, making our 200y rifle range safe in the dark would be problematic, so I would limit myself to all stages in our bays, and simulate distance by using 1/4 scale IPSC targets for Rifle. I think the biggest hurdle would be getting permission from the club and the neighbors. Some of our neighbors are kinda close and have a history of not liking the club much. I suspect the noise of a 3gun at night wouldn't help that image.

Plan B was trying to figure out how to build a bisqueen dark house that would be workable, safe, and would survive the match, but that would only give me one stage..

[ShooterSteve]

There is another range near Carthage that built a big pole barn and pushed berms up all around it. A little black plastic and some creativity with some portable plywood walls and you would be in the dark and in business. I don't know, just another idea...Good luck with your project.

PS, after the match have a little cookout and invite the neighbors, let them run a stage, (well supervised of course) you never know, you may recruit some new shooters.

[lucas]

Sorry,wrong forum.

Edited December 16, 2008 by lucas

[toothandnail]

We went to one in Ks. last fall, it was a zero white light except for the shooter, RO's had red lights, there was a tarped area with light for those who needed it .

Movement was limited in most stages, I think the furtherest rifle target was 40 yds.

saftey didn't seem to be a problem, the one stage every was concerned the most about ended up not being a problem at all.

It was , shooter lying in bed, buzzer, pick up pistol off bedside table load, shoot 2 bad guys in room, move to window engage 6 more outside, move to another window engage 6 more.

It was the most fun I've had in the dark with clothes on

[claud van gessel]

Recently we shot a 3 gun match with a DOOM (remember the game?) theme.

Obvisously it was very dark and all kind of surprises were hidden for the competitor.

Final goal was to shut down the "reactor" by shooting at a linear fluoriscent striplight...

Yes, it was great fun... And YES maximum attention by all on the range was required.

Photo's at: http://www.aps-dsr.nl/site/nl/index.php?categoryid=3

Shooter had the option of shooting with or without a head mounted LED

http://aps-dsr.nl/fotoalbum/displayimage.p...&fullsize=1

Edited October 2, 2009 by claud van gessel