2009 30th Anniversary NRA Bianchi Cup

[NRAActionPistol]

All Action Pistol Competitors,

We have decided to release the dates of the 2009 30th Anniversary NRA Bianchi Cup to be held for the 31st time in Columbia, MO.

The dates of the 2009 NRA Action Pistol Championships will be 22-27 May 2009, as of today's date we have over $66,000 in Cash & prizes for the Championships.

We are currently working on the Official Program for the Championships, and everyone that competed in the 2008 NRA Bianchi Cup will be getting an invitation and a program sent out sometime in early fall.

There will be some format changes, but the (4) main events, Mover, Plates, Barricade & Practical Events will remain in the Program. We will be adding a match called the NRA Action Pistol Championship, it will have reduced entry fees and reduced distance's for those of you that want to shoot Action Pistol, but were not sure wheather you wanted to do it. This Match will be fired before the NRA Bianchi Cup, but will be conducted in the same tradition of the Bianchi Cup that Ray Chapman & John Bianchi started in 1979. We have Country Music Artist - Mark Wills competing in this event, and expect more celebrities as well.

For questions about NRA Action Shooting please feel free to contact us anytime, we are looking forward to seeing you all again at the NRA Bianchi Cup.

Tom...

Edited August 21, 2008 by NRAActionPistol

[Allgoodhits]

Tom,

Thanks for posting and including the dates. I am somewhat confused.

The Bianchi Cup so to speak will be as we have known it, but the NRA National Action Pistol Championships will be as John Bianchi & RAy Chapman intended it to be? This may include people who are not sure they want to shoot NRA Action Pistol pistol and will be a reduced COF? I must be misunderstanding something

I'm sure you will set us (me) straight

Martin

[Alan550]

+1 on the confusing part! Not much of that post made sense to me either, so I guess there are at least a couple of us who are a bit dense.

"30th Anniversary NRA Bianchi Cup to be held for the 31st time " Now what does that mean exactly?

Oh well, I'm sure Tom will set us straight before long.

Alan~^~

[Allgoodhits]

+1 on the confusing part! Not much of that post made sense to me either, so I guess there are at least a couple of us who are a bit dense.

"30th Anniversary NRA Bianchi Cup to be held for the 31st time " Now what does that mean exactly?

Oh well, I'm sure Tom will set us straight before long.

Alan~^~

Alan,

I got that part! The 31st BC will be the 30th Anniversary, since the first would not be an anniversary. Tom was testing us on that one. I stepped into that trap, but was able to pull out, before I hit the send key.

MJ

[NRAActionPistol]

Tom,

Thanks for posting and including the dates. I am somewhat confused.

The Bianchi Cup so to speak will be as we have known it, but the NRA National Action Pistol Championships will be as John Bianchi & RAy Chapman intended it to be? This may include people who are not sure they want to shoot NRA Action Pistol pistol and will be a reduced COF? I must be misunderstanding something

I'm sure you will set us (me) straight

Martin

Martin,

I had a feeling this would happen, thanks for clearing up the Anniversary issue, as you already know the Bianchi Cup has grown to be the NRA Bianchi Cup, in 2009 we will have a Action Pistol Championship (had to name it something, if you have a better name, let me know) will be Mover, Plates, Barricade & Practical but only out to 25 yards. This comes from suggestions from many others to intruduce Action Shooting to new and inexperienced shooters, it will be a way to get some experience, at a fraction of the cost of shooting the NRA Bianchi Cup, with all the same traditions as the Bianchi Cup, Awards, Ceremony & courses of fire.

As of today the Cash & Prizes for May 2009 are at $111,000, and we are only in August of 2008.

I hope this clears up some questions that you and other might have, thanks for all you do for this sport.

Tom...

[Griz]

NRA Action Pistol seems very secretive and mysterious to newcomers. So much information is passed by word of mouth that if you are not in the inner circle of elite shooters, you are left in the dark wondering what's going on. If you really want to make NRA Action Pistol more friendly to newcomers, the first thing you need to do is to update and clean up the rule book and web site, and keep it updated. (Not to mention how hard it is to even find the rule book!) Particularly in the courses of fire section, there are so many things taken for granted that a new shooter doesn't know what to expect. A few examples from the July 2008 rulebook published online:

7.6 Practical Event - Competitors must fire the 10 yard line segment in the standing position. Competitors

may fire the 15, 25, and 50 yard segments in the prone position at their option. This course is divided into four

stages. Each stage has three strings and 12 shots per stage. 48 shots:

(a) 10 yards - one shot each target within three seconds, two shots each target within four seconds, and three

shots each target eight seconds.

( 15 yards - one shot each target within four seconds, two shots each within 5 seconds, and three shots

each target within six seconds.

© 25 yards - one shot each target five seconds, two shots each target six seconds, and three shots each

target seven seconds.

Action Shooting

(d) 50 yards - one shot each target seven seconds, two shots each target ten seconds, and three shots each

target fifteen seconds.

No weak hand at 10 yards?

7.12 Crawford Barricade Event - This course will be divided into four stages, two strings per stage, six shots

per string. 48 shots; all shots will be fired from behind a barricade:

(a) 10 yards - 6 shots in 8 seconds, 2 strings.

( 15 yards - 6 shots in 9 seconds, 2 strings.

© 25 yards - 6 shots in 10 seconds, 2 strings.

(d) 35 yards - 6 shots in II seconds, 2 strings

OK, I think I just need to fire 6 shots from behind the barricade... Then I show up to my first match that includes this course of fire and see people firing 3 shots around one side of the barricade and three shots around the other side even though there is no mention of this in the rule book...

7.16 Unsupported Standard Match - This course will be divided into four stages, two strings per stage, six

shots per string. Three D1 targets.

(a) 10 yards - 6 shots strong hand only, unsupported, 6 shots weak hand only, unsupported. 6 seconds time

limit per string.

( 15 yards - Same as 10 yards, 7 seconds per string.

© 20 yards - Same as 10 yards, 8 seconds per string.

(d) 25 yards - Same as 10 yards, 9 seconds per string.

I guess I can fire all 48 shots into one target, dunno why it mentions 3 targets...

Edited August 23, 2008 by Griz

[Alan550]

Griz,

You are right about the rules being a bit hazy, but if you go to section 10 in the rule book, the COFs are explained in detail. In section 7 that you referenced it only gives the highlights of each event. The particulars are in section 10. This is because the NRA has all their rule books on the same format, and Action Pistol was added after the other match formats had been set. That format isn't "user friendly" for AP.

Alan~^~

[Griz]

Griz,

You are right about the rules being a bit hazy, but if you go to section 10 in the rule book, the COFs are explained in detail. In section 7 that you referenced it only gives the highlights of each event. The particulars are in section 10. This is because the NRA has all their rule books on the same format, and Action Pistol was added after the other match formats had been set. That format isn't "user friendly" for AP.

Alan~^~

Alrighty then, no more drinking and posting.

Edited August 23, 2008 by Griz

[Allgoodhits]

Tom,

I think the concept is a great idea, but refining it so as not to intend to accomplish one thing, yet shooting one's self in the foot because of some other not so well thought out requirement. Such as the Open Modified to attrack the USPSA crowd, but then throw a wrench in it by other equipment restrictions with the trigger and safety device issues, as an example from the past. The part I guess that threw me was the BIANCHI CUP as it has grown into has been argued that "it" has gone from what was intended in 1979 to an all out Race Gun type race, yet that format will remain the BC.

Meanwhile, the NRA Action Pistol Championships will then be closer to the orginal BC format, but with reduced distances and no doubt more basic 1979 intended equpiment. I don't think any National Championship should be "intended" to attrack "entry level" shooters. Certainly they are welcome, but afterall it is supposed to be a Championship. I believe that a serious introduction match or tournament can be accomplished without dumbing down the "Championships Match" side of Bianchi week.

Perhaps call the non-highly modified, non-race gun tournament the NRA Cup, or Action Pistol Cup, or the Columbia Cup, Chapman Cup or the Show Me Cup. The Show Me Cup could be in honor of the host state for 31 years as well as a suggestion to show me this action pistol game, show me that a production gun can compete with other Production guns in an equipment modification limited manner. Show me that I can shoot at 25 yds or less with this from the box equipment. Show me the exitement of shooting a truly world class tournament with huge international flavor. Show me that I may want to move up to different equipment, and show the manufacturers that NRA AP shooters are potential profit center for them, as these shooters likely buy other guns, and better yet make recommendations to oithers at their local clubs through out the world! Yes the manufactures could "show off" their wares. Could or would an IDPA Class event work, a USPSA Limited or Production Class, even a Bullseye Class, a PPC Class. I'm liking the Show Me Cup idea for the intoduction tournament of Bianchi Week. The Chapman Cup event, the Bianchi Cup event during Bianchi Week. Bianchi week, bike week. It has a nice ring to it!

Maybe Bianchi Week is something to consider. Wasn't this what Chapman and Bianchi had in mind? Bring shooters from all over the world to participate in 4 completely different shooting events. At the time it had an Olympic flare for the concept, with a Decathalon approach to the COF. Match organizers could maintain this flare and concept with two completely separate & slightly different matches. But keep the matches separate. A new shooter with an out of the box gun, should not be listed amongst places when Doug, Bruce, Carl, & Kevin or Robert, Jerry and Rob are on the same list.

The Bianchi Cup, NRA Action Pistol Championship would be for those of us who choose to accept the expense and or the challenge to step and try to run with the big dogs with the state of the art equipment.

Just some thoughts, perhaps others have better thoughts or ways to improve on these. I think this would keep it interesting, open up possibilities for sponsors, new competitors, or old competitors who want to get back to basic guns, but don't want to have to shoot their outofthebox gun against Rob, Jerry or Robert.

Thanks for stepping up to keep BC alive.......it is worth preserving!

martin

Edited August 23, 2008 by Allgoodhits

[Pin Shooter]

My calendar shows that as being Friday 22nd to Wednesday 27th. Is this correct?

[Toolguy]

+1 Martin! A lot of really great ideas!

[Alan550]

Pin Shooter,

I think there's a screw up on the dates too! Usually the Cup runs from Wed.-Sat. of the same week, and the dates listed are from Fri.-Wed. as you mentioned in your post. Looks messed up to me! Guess Tom will straighten me out on that one too, since I didn't catch the "anniversary" part on the last post!

Alan~^~

[Action Pistolero]

Nope. Pinshooter has the correct dates. This is one way to make the Cup a little later without getting in to June. It's what I was told anyway.

Martin has some good ideas. If Tom wants to implement them then so be it. Tom is doing more for the Cup than any of the others that were in charge. As far as I'm concerned, I'm 100% behind Tom and his efforts. Whatever he wants to try to make things better. The point is he knows where things need to be improved and is doing something about it.

Kevin

[Bafaction]

Nope. Pinshooter has the correct dates. This is one way to make the Cup a little later without getting in to June. It's what I was told anyway.

Martin has some good ideas. If Tom wants to implement them then so be it. Tom is doing more for the Cup than any of the others that were in charge. As far as I'm concerned, I'm 100% behind Tom and his efforts. Whatever he wants to try to make things better. The point is he knows where things need to be improved and is doing something about it.

Kevin

I could not agree more. The match needs to be promoted a lot more so allow us to get more and more shooters to the cup and every ones local shoots.

[NRAActionPistol]

Nope. Pinshooter has the correct dates. This is one way to make the Cup a little later without getting in to June. It's what I was told anyway.

Martin has some good ideas. If Tom wants to implement them then so be it. Tom is doing more for the Cup than any of the others that were in charge. As far as I'm concerned, I'm 100% behind Tom and his efforts. Whatever he wants to try to make things better. The point is he knows where things need to be improved and is doing something about it.

Kevin

Kevin, and all my other friends in the Action Biz,

Due to a couple of points made by you all here and looking at some possible Logistical Nightmares trying to shoot a Championship over a Holiday weekend, we have decided to chnage the dates back to 18-23 May 2009.

In a nutshell, Bianchi Nostalgia Match (Production Only) 18 May, Practice Day 19 May, 1st day of the Bianchi Cup 20 May. We will be running a Pro-Am 20-23 May during the Championship we will have 5 to 6, 3-4 Man Teams, Pro/Celeb, Press, Industry & a Newcomer picked at Random will be squadded together. WE will get the details out in the letters & invites sometime this fall.

Thanks for all your help, this is not a one person gig, I hope we all can step up to the [plate and make this the biggest & best Pistol Championship in the World.

Tom...

[NRAActionPistol]

All,

Here is some information about the 2009 30th Anniversary NRA Bianchi Cup 18-23 May 2009.

http://www.shootingwire.com/

http://www.theoutdoorwire.com/tow_release.php?ID=134914

[Allgoodhits]

Nope. Pinshooter has the correct dates. This is one way to make the Cup a little later without getting in to June. It's what I was told anyway.

Martin has some good ideas. If Tom wants to implement them then so be it. Tom is doing more for the Cup than any of the others that were in charge. As far as I'm concerned, I'm 100% behind Tom and his efforts. Whatever he wants to try to make things better. The point is he knows where things need to be improved and is doing something about it.

Kevin

Kevin, and all my other friends in the Action Biz,

Due to a couple of points made by you all here and looking at some possible Logistical Nightmares trying to shoot a Championship over a Holiday weekend, we have decided to chnage the dates back to 18-23 May 2009.

In a nutshell, Bianchi Nostalgia Match (Production Only) 18 May, Practice Day 19 May, 1st day of the Bianchi Cup 20 May. We will be running a Pro-Am 20-23 May during the Championship we will have 5 to 6, 3-4 Man Teams, Pro/Celeb, Press, Industry & a Newcomer picked at Random will be squadded together. WE will get the details out in the letters & invites sometime this fall.

Thanks for all your help, this is not a one person gig, I hope we all can step up to the [plate and make this the biggest & best Pistol Championship in the World.

Tom...

Way to go Tom . Kevin is dead on when it comes to Tom not being afraid to try things to keep hope alive when it comes to the Bianchi experience. Tom is really beating the bushes.

I had a talk with Tom this past week and it sounds like a lot good ideas. My understanding is that the dates are back in line with normal with the match as as been in the past beginning on Wednesday and ending on Friday for most, Saturday for some.

One exception is the Nostalgia PRODUCTION Match which will be on Monday preceeding the other events. It is open to all shooters with production guns. This event will be a "normal" 1920 but must be fired with a PRODUCTION gun, meaning no comp and metallic sights only at a minimum with defined "production" definition to come out shortly. The intent, I think, is for it to be an out of the box gun with very few if any mods permitted. Stay tuned from Tom & gang on that. USPSA, IDPA & NRA rules for production, stock service and distinguished are some models that are being considered for the "language". My opinion would be to pick the standards that will fit each of USPSA, IDPA and NRA rules so that someone with one gun can play in each of the games if they choose. Sounds like an easy task, but I think it is more complex than it appears.

The Bianchi Cup match (starting Wednesday) will be as we have known it. A 1920 fired with either an open or metallic gun, not sure on the sub categories of open modified and metallic production. Not sure on the aggregate as has been in recent past either, but again a guess is yes.

The team concept may be an improvement over what we have done in the past, time will tell on that. One thing that that has never taken on at BC is the way teams are shot in most other NRA shooting sports. That is a team is classed by the classification of it's shooters. Each classification has a point value assigned. Marksman=1 and HM=5. If team has a combined point value "average" per shooter of 3 then they are an Expert team. Average of 4 they are a Master team etc. Perhaps something like this could work with the approach that Tom has in mind, whereby picking up teams the average of the shooters on the team must = some base number range. Not sure but I think NRA AP is one of the only shooting games where there are more HM than other classes. At least I think that is the case at BC. Perhaps the shooters not yet at HM do not bother to come to the Cup due to whatever their reasons are. We need to fix that too.

Keep up the good work Tom.

[Carmoney]

Question: Is there anybody out there who has shot every Bianchi Cup over the past 30 years?

[SRT Driver]

Carmoney,

I think the closest is/was Tom Carpenter, but I could be wrong.

[Guy Neill]

My recollection was Tom Campbell was the longest lasting competitor, starting from 1. There may be some now that have shot more, but did not shoot in number 1.

My wife has worked every one. I shot or worked through 26.

Guy

[Action Pistolero]

It was Tom Campbell. Although he hasn't been there in the past few years.

The only person that was there was Loren Neill. She scored the first one and has ever since.

Kevin

Look like Guy beat me to the punch.

Edited August 31, 2008 by Action Pistolero

[Allgoodhits]

Question: Is there anybody out there who has shot every Bianchi Cup over the past 30 years?

Guy and Kevin are correct in that until recent years Tom Campbell was the only person who had never missed any Cups. However, in recent years he has missed several. Therefore, maybe John Pride is about even with the number of Cups fired. Perhaps Loren can set the record completely accurate.

No question, that Tom Campbell had the most consecutive Cups. I'm thinking it was 25-27. Has John Pride missed more than 3-5 Cups? I'm pretty sure that Micky Fowler would be in that 3rd spot either way. Of course there is Frank Glenn too, who could be in that 3 or 4 most Cups ever club.

Guy, do you or Loren have match bulletins? I would love to have a copy of 1981 Bianchi Cup. That was my first and only until 15+ years later, since I quit shooting for over 15 years. Ironically, I did my PB placement the first time out, no practice for the game at all, just shot a K-38 with 158 RNL bullets. Came in 21st, got money and an engraved gun. Micky won that year, no one had broken 1900. I think it came a couple years later.

MJ

Edited August 31, 2008 by Allgoodhits

[Guy Neill]

I can't say I don't have those results, but it will take some looking to find them. I'll look around for them.

Guy

[Allgoodhits]

All right just because the economy is in the toilet and just because we are being dazzled by a socialist it is no cause to stop sending the message of CHANGE for increasing the attendance for the 2009 Bianchi Cup.

Let's not wait, instead start getting out there and encouraging shooters that you know to enquire about, then sign up for the 2009 Bianchi Cup. The 2009 event will be the 30th Anniversary or the 31st shooting of this spectacular shooting contest.

The revised PRODUCTION category should bring 50 to 100 people alone to add to the current count of regulars. Now suppose 1 in 3 regulars bring someone new and we will be above 250 shooters. If an unheard of politician, with limited experience, can raise the money that he does and get the support that he does, then certainly we shooters should be able to get 250 people who are most likely 2nd Amendment fans to participate in a little shooting contest in the heartland of America. Can't we?

Contact Tom Hughes or Brian Zins at NRA HQ for your personal private Invitation. Tell them I sent you.

MJ

Edited October 21, 2008 by Allgoodhits