Beretta 96 Combat Combo

[JThompson]

Strange... I see no post?

[Blueridge]

I don't know what happened to my original post, but I was trying to get some info and opinions on the Beretta 96 Combat Combo. I understand that it is not imported to the USA, although I do not know why. It is the first handgun that has interested me enough to consider open division, but I have no idea if it would be worth using for that purpose. Or if it would be worth the bother of finding out what it would take to obtain one. Edited December 30, 2007 by Blueridge

[wide45]

http://www.beretta.com/index.aspx?m=74&idc=2&ids=37

Not a good choice for open.

Barrel weight would not be as good as a real comp, and mag capacity will leave you wanting more. Target irons are superfluous, need to replace them with a red dot.

Might work well for Lim 10 without the barrel weight, if they meet the 500 produced/available rule.

[Blueridge]

Ah... Okay, I was curious. It would not be worth the effort to get it for Limited 10, as I have other option for that purpose. Outside of revolver and production I don't really have much interest in the other divisions.

[Chills1994]

I don't know what the current Beretta made/marked 11 round .40 mags measure. Theoretically, I think you could cobble something together using Mec-Gar 20 round mags, but, well, it would be cobbled together, but at least you would/could get your capacity up. I'm not all up on the mag lengths allowed for open.

As far as making an open gun out of a 96 Stock/Combat, you would probably be in unchartered waters all by yourself and you'll have to learn stuff on your own via the "School of Hard Knocks".

It would be easier for you to stick with an STI/SVI type gun for open, as a first choice, and then a CZ or Witness for a second choice.

With respect to price on the 96 Stock or Combat, you should figure in the 1,000 to 1,500 bucks range. I always get the Stock and Combat models confused and which one is rare-er than the other.

IIRC the 92 (9mm versions) of those guns are more coveted by collectors for some reason and fetch a higher price

I do NOT know if a 92 would stay together for very long shooting 9mm MAJOR loads, if you wanted to try a 9mm MAJOR open gun, that is. At least with that, the regular length Mec-Gar mags will let you stuff 17 9mm's into 'em.

[PB92]

I'm almost done building my Beretta 92Compgun Open Class. Took about a year, its still out right now getting some CNC work done. Then its a Burris FastFire on the slide and whala, were done. I'll post pics when its all said and done.......

>Bob

[Flexmoney]

That is quite a load of marketing BS that they have on their website.

Kinda sad to see.

[HoMiE]

I shot a beretta for the first time last week. No further comment.

[PB92]

Homie, what did you like/dislike about the Beretta? Which pistol was it and what class were you shooting?

I shot a beretta for the first time last week. No further comment.

[Chills1994]

It is what it is. A true double action to single action semi-auto full size duty weapon with a police department lawyer friendly trigger in it.

I'm trying to choose my words wisely here, as to not hurt anyone's feelings... I used to be in the military myself and the small arms training just isn't there like it should be.

Which pistola would you rather give to a bunch of older teenagers (18 and 19 year olds) who haven't had much training besides this is where you insert the mag, the bullets come out of this end, and the target is over there, in a branch of the military that at times seems to be run more like a corporation (cost analysis bean counting): a cocked and locked 1911 in .45 or a loaded M9 with a very long close to 12 pound double action trigger pull?

I think there are probably enough AD's / ND's already.

Don't like the trigger, put a "D" spring in it or a 1911 main spring in it.

@Homie, you have seen Ben's video's, right?

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=ben+...amp;sitesearch=

[Flexmoney]

Let's stick with comments on the viability of the particualr gun in question for Open division, please.

- Admin

[PB92]

My Beretta 92Compgun Open class should be in this week. Mount the J Point 8 min and do some testing with the custom lite 9mm loads I had made, and see what recoil spring I will run. I did this project because some had said to me it couldn't be done. That drove me even more to prove it can be. Right now I'm running on the plates 2.88, with my 92compgun its gonna go lower. You can get 20 rnd mags for the Beretta................but I run 15 rnders.............I'll post some pic when I get her all set.................

I hope to be doing some demonstration/exibition shooting for Beretta in October here in CT, not sure yet.

>Bob

Edited August 6, 2008 by PB92

[rvb]

I shoot Beretta in Production and when I decided I wanted to play in Open and started looking at options, I considered building one of my 92s up to make an open gun.

To do it so it turned out less than half-assed (hard fit a good jarvis or barsto barrel (preferably w/ a bushing), an optic, comp, I'd have spent nearly as much as a stock STI or decent used 2011 (if you include the cost of the 92). What I'd have ended up with would have been, well, an open gun w/ a trigger that will never compete w/ a 1911 trigger, limited mag capacity w/o some cutting/welding, and a gun that would probably require new locking blocks every six months to handle major-9 (esp w/ a comp hanging off the end of the barrel).

Top that off with very poor selection of -good- holsters. The only options are to use a jpoint dot on the slide w/ a bucket holster or to start cutting-up/shaping a kydex around a scope mount.... and the idea that the aluminum frame which is known to not handle a major-pf well could last at all when drilled/tapped scared me away. Something to tinker w/ if I had disposable cash and didn't shoot a ton of rounds/yr? hmmm.. maybe not even then.

I personally wouldn't trust a major-pf Beretta to have the necessary durability (frame or locking block).

I bought a Trubor and haven't looked back. Biggest cost discrepancy was the mags and ghost holster. It runs like the energizer bunny and there's a wealth of after-market support and knowledge out there.

The 92s make good minor-pf production guns if you aren't scared off by the DA/SA trigger (which can be tuned quite nicely), but I personally don't see them as a good platform for open.

-rvb

[SimonM]

I'm currently competing in production and I shoot 92 Stock. I wanted to get "a training aid" in a form of an open gun, so I ordered STI SteelMaster.

I doubt it very much that any pistol that Beretta is offering currently would be a good choice for open. My future open gun is not designed to be shot with major ammo and even still the thought of building a Beretta with a dot on it didn't even cross my mind.

People already mentioned the lack of good holsters, aftermarket support etc. concerning the open Beretta. That alone is reason enough to stay from one.

Couple of guys here in Finland built an open 96 Stock with a C-more, comp and all the bells and whistles a couple of years ago. One them shot it for a season and desided to give up. As I recall the pistol worked 100% (as Berettas usually do ), but it just wasn't competitive; capacity, how it handled recoil etc. I don't know how many rounds he shot with it; probably not that much since it was only one season...

[PB92]

Hey RVB. Getting close to finishing my open Beretta....(took longer then I thought). J Point 8 min is mounted, and now the frame is going to be getting a new finish. Have a ghost holster from Germany Speedsec 5 (sweet holster and very fast). This open Beretta I did was not only because I eat, sleep and breath Beretta, but because I was told it can't be done. I say it can.

It's going to be used for steel. If done correctly, the trigger from DA to SA can be scary smooth, at this point I don't even notice it anymore it's that smooth. I had the best in the country do some CNC accurizing to it, steel rail inserts, conical cone barrel bushing, barrel stabilizers, KKM NM barrel, and the list goes on.

Also, this pistol I am building up will be the blueprint for a special pistol from Beretta USA. That's all I can say for now. All that has to get done is refinish the frame, and it's done......(these builds take forever). But, there is not another one like it anywhere, it is custom at almost every point.

Can't wait to post pics of it...............later...........

>PB92

[Nik Habicht]

Dave Olhasso had an open Beretta built (EGW?) back when he was still shooting for Beretta --- so it's been done before.....

[rvb]

Hey RVB. Getting close to finishing my open Beretta....(took longer then I thought). J Point 8 min is mounted, and now the frame is going to be getting a new finish. Have a ghost holster from Germany Speedsec 5 (sweet holster and very fast). This open Beretta I did was not only because I eat, sleep and breath Beretta, but because I was told it can't be done. I say it can.

It's going to be used for steel. If done correctly, the trigger from DA to SA can be scary smooth, at this point I don't even notice it anymore it's that smooth. I had the best in the country do some CNC accurizing to it, steel rail inserts, conical cone barrel bushing, barrel stabilizers, KKM NM barrel, and the list goes on.

Also, this pistol I am building up will be the blueprint for a special pistol from Beretta USA. That's all I can say for now. All that has to get done is refinish the frame, and it's done......(these builds take forever). But, there is not another one like it anywhere, it is custom at almost every point.

Can't wait to post pics of it...............later...........

>PB92

Hi pb,

I've seen your pictures on the beretta forum. There IS a lot of good work there. Did not realize ghost had a holster to fit the 92s, so that rules out one roadblock.

My big concern was using it in uspsa open division at major pf. I really don't think the 92 would stand up well to that. Look at how many guys break frames trying to compete w/ 96s and that's w/o a comp hanging off the end or the other modifications. Since you say you are shooting steel, I assume that means minor pf, so that may not be an issue for you as it is for most of the people here.

I would still be concerned about those rails and screws holding up after a lot of hard practice and matches in a uspsa environment. Aluminum and steel have different thermal expansion coefficients and those fun old 32-round courses or a few practice bill drills or timing drills will put a lot of heat cycles on those joints. Those rails were designed for guys shooting at perry and I can't imagine that putting the same stress on the gun. But again that's looking at it from a practical shooting point of view, not steel with a few rounds and re-holster for another string.

Please note that I'm NOT saying it will not work or that you are wrong for doing it or anything like that. I always think it's neat to see someone doing something "different" (hell, I actually shoot berettas, and that's being "different" enough in uspsa/idpa!). I'm just expressing some thoughts that kept ME from trying anything similar. Please feel free to come back after 10k, 20k, 50k rounds and tell me my thoughts were wrong. (actually, I never would have done the accurazing work, I find a stock 92 plenty accurate for practical shooting).

As far as competing w/ S_I's, even if you end up with a gun that's more reliable and more accurate and flatter shooting, I -personally- still wouldn't choose it. I'd bet you have 2x in that gun what I paid for my STI. And in uspsa terms it still would lack mag capacity, or confidence at 170pf, and it would still be a DA/SA (which while not a handicap 90% of the time, DOES slow my first shot if its tight or long or WHO). So for those reasons I also wouldn't recommend it to someone trying to venture into open.

good on ya for taking on such a project!

-rvb

[ken hebert]

Got a link to this particular Beretta forum? I'd like to see this gun.

[PB92]

Hi Nik, yes I know. Dave Olhasso has designed the magwell I am using on the gun. He has worked with me as the gun was built. He is actually the only other shooter that I know of that used a Beretta in Open.

Ken, the Beretta Forum is here.................

http://berettaforum.net/

There are pics of it without the JPoint 8 min mounted. It's called 92Compgun. The slide should be back next week, and the frame stippiling might be finished next seek also. I told them I don't want it rushed, want it done right. Dave Sams who did the CNC accurizing said the pistol will run fine for many thousands of rounds with ofcourse proper care.

I hear what you are saying RVB, and I welcome any and all comments, good or bad. I like to hear what other people think................

>Bob

[PB92]

Here's a pic with aluminum grips................

And a pick with one of Tom Novaks custom grips...........

And one with black carbon fiber grips...............

Ofcourse, it will look much cooler with the JPoint on it, and everything finished............

[No.343]

Beautiful gun!! Hope it shoots as good as it looks.

[PB92]

Thanks No.343!! Currently the gun is very capable of 1 1/2 inch groups at 50 yards with match ammo. It's insane accurate.

I think I'm going to try some Slide Glide Lite on the topend. I was using Gunbutter. The gun is very tight, so the slide may just push the SG Lite out, I don't know yet. I do know it pushes out most of the Gunbutter................

[Allgoodhits]

Thanks No.343!! Currently the gun is very capable of 1 1/2 inch groups at 50 yards with match ammo. It's insane accurate.

I think I'm going to try some Slide Glide Lite on the topend. I was using Gunbutter. The gun is very tight, so the slide may just push the SG Lite out, I don't know yet. I do know it pushes out most of the Gunbutter................

Have you considered STP? A little dab, work the slide a few times, then wipe off excess. I also apply a dab on the locking block lugs and on teh barrel rails. If gun is tight as you say, STP may be too thick. I find that it works great on most loose guns too. It can cause the gun to sluggish, especially in colder climates.

MJ

[PB92]

Actually I haven't. Before the build ofcourse the Gunbutter was perfect. Its great stuff. But, I might have to look into something thinner. Firepower FP10 was suggested, 50% petroleum based and 50% synthetic lube, and grease on the cone bushing. The SG lite may be too thick, but if it is working on tight STI open guns it should work on my Beretta. Have to play

around with some different lubes..................

>Bob

Thanks No.343!! Currently the gun is very capable of 1 1/2 inch groups at 50 yards with match ammo. It's insane accurate.

I think I'm going to try some Slide Glide Lite on the topend. I was using Gunbutter. The gun is very tight, so the slide may just push the SG Lite out, I don't know yet. I do know it pushes out most of the Gunbutter................

Have you considered STP? A little dab, work the slide a few times, then wipe off excess. I also apply a dab on the locking block lugs and on teh barrel rails. If gun is tight as you say, STP may be too thick. I find that it works great on most loose guns too. It can cause the gun to sluggish, especially in colder climates.

MJ

[PB92]

Schaaazam!!!