Bigbadaboom Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 The first video is a dry run w/o the timer. In the second video you can see my feet and if you turn the volume up you can hear my hammer fall right at the 1.1 sec. par beep. I can't seem to get an "A" hit faster than 1.1 sec. in live fire. I can get "C" hits in .90-.95 which is my standard "A" hit draw time w/ hands up or down. While viewing these please keep in mind that I've ruptured C-5 in my neck and it healed strange so snapping my head is out of the question and I've also had surgery at L-5/S1 so I can't spin at the waist too much either. All other suggestions are welcome. T&D #1 T&D #2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Regardless of your surgeries, that looks pretty good, to me In reality, if you can pick up an A in 1.1 on a 10 yard target consistently in live fire - go work on improving other things before you worry about your turn and draw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 (edited) Your head should lead the way...looks like you are turning your body first...turn the head the rest will follow... Oh, and BTW, sorry to have to tell you, but your avatar is lots cuter than you... Edited February 23, 2006 by tightloop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierruiggi Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 (edited) Considering the injuries you describe, I figure this is a pretty fast turn draw time. Work within your physical limitations to see your target as soon as possible, that's paramount. Seeing the target gives you intent, a place to focus, you drive your gun "there", not in a general direction, but exactly to that spot. As far as I see in this video, you have the support arm somewhat "extended" away from your body on the turn. This could perhaps cause your sights to arrive "trembling" or fail to stop "right on the spot", because you are introducing another force vector into the movement, to the side. This mevement could throw your draw to your strong side, or when it clashes with the strong hand, it may cause the strong hand to compensate for it, creating unwarranted tension of opposing forces, leading to a tremble when arriving on target. I would suggest you to keep your weak hand closer to your body and see what happens. Also, I didn't see this on your videos, but check out what your feet are doing, if you end your draw all entangled up, you'll be less relaxed and less stable. All of this, IMHO, of course. Keep up the good work! Edited February 23, 2006 by Pierruiggi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbadaboom Posted February 23, 2006 Author Share Posted February 23, 2006 Your head should lead the way...looks like you are turning your body first...turn the head the rest will follow... As mentioned in my opening post, I have issues with my neck so trying to turn my head to fast causes pain. I can spin my body faster than I can spin my head. Oh, and BTW, sorry to have to tell you, but your avatar is lots cuter than you... I sure as heck hope so. But it's still not as cute as my wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 The biggest thing is that you aren't leading with your head....but since you can't we just have to work around that. I don't like the position of your weakhand during the draw, I personally don't think it gets on the gun fast enough and seems to chase it a little bit. Chasing the gun usually makes for an inconsistent grip. I don't know what your normal stance is, but since we are both right handed I am going to assume ours are the same. When you complete the turn you have your right foot well in front of your left foot. This will really make you fight your index in all shots you make during the string. To any turn and draw there are 2 steps. The first is stepping your right foot back and around (like you do) and the second is moving your left foot to it's natural shooting position. The last thing I see is at the end of the draw stroke your head dips a bit....most likely to find the sights. Remember that we have to bring the gun to our eyes and not the other way around. Hope this helps. Jake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 I go in with the idea of snapping the head around. The reality is that your head seems to be getting around faster than mine (and, I just shot another 100% on the El Prez in a match last weekend). I'm not to concerned with you dropping your head down onto the gun at the end. Many non-Open shooters do. Like Jake mentioned, you want to do your best to get into your "default" shooting position so that you are as close as possible to shooting from your normal position. I don't know that I'd go chasing that too hard, just work on getting it from the start. (you aren't just going for a one shot turn-n-draw, you are starting to shoot a whole stage) As Jake said, your weak-hand is chasing/floating. Looks pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 Looks pretty good Daniel. It takes practice, and it's a start we don't do much anymore. I've never shot a T&D better than 1.25 in a match, and the last El Prez I put up was a 4.51 at St. Aug . Jerry and TJ both stressed staying light on your feet (no, not a Brokeback joke) and getting into your normal shooting stance ASAP, so that appears to be universally accepted advice. If you can't snap your head around, get those eyes on target soonest, then don;t move your head. Bring the gun in line and your off to the races. Still, whatever you're doing is faster than me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbadaboom Posted February 23, 2006 Author Share Posted February 23, 2006 I see what you are saying about the weak hand. Unlike my regular draw it does not come down toward the hoster with me strong hand in order to get on the gun quick. I've never observed myself in this fasion before. This is great stuff. Please, Keep it coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 I've never observed myself in this fasion before. Video is *very* telling - as is the timer (as I'm sure you've found). I don't own either right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted February 23, 2006 Share Posted February 23, 2006 The main thing to look out for in consistency. The only difference between a surrender and a hands at side start is the starting position. After the beep, your hands should move in the exact same place in either draw. We want to do EVERYTHING the same way. That is the only way to truly ingrain consistent form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SA Friday Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 New guy here, go don't make fun Question; why are you using your left leg as the pivot point? Being right handed, wouldn't it be easier to pivot off of the right leg? I would think that would keep the gun in a more consistant place for a better grip on the draw, and it would put your left leg slightly in front after the pivot. I think it would also lesson the chances of a 180 violation. I'm asking because I want to start practicing these occasionally, and I pictured pivoting off of the right leg. If this is bad, I don't want to start bad habits. I am also right handed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbadaboom Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 New guy here, go don't make fun Question; why are you using your left leg as the pivot point? Being right handed, wouldn't it be easier to pivot off of the right leg? I would think that would keep the gun in a more consistant place for a better grip on the draw, and it would put your left leg slightly in front after the pivot. I think it would also lesson the chances of a 180 violation. I'm asking because I want to start practicing these occasionally, and I pictured pivoting off of the right leg. If this is bad, I don't want to start bad habits. I am also right handed. My right hand to handgun relational location doesn't change because I don't spin at the waist. I believe that there is no need to spin at the waist because your feet have to be under you before you can pull an accurate shot anyway. Leading with your head is important but I can't do it due to injuries. I spin to my right because it gets the gun past the 180 faster and doesn't take the gun all the way around my body. If I were left handed I would spin the opposite direction. I spin on my right leg because, again, I don't want to take my leg all the way around my body. I stand in the left rear corner of the box when starting and en up pretty centered in the box after turning. In those videos the camera is catching me at an angle to my left front so my right foot isn't planting as far forward of me as it looks. I'm in a comfortable shooting position at the end of my spin with my right foot leading my left about 1-1/2" to 2" which helps me since I shoot left to right off the turn & draw and I tend to lean into my gun as I transition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 As Jake said, your weak-hand is chasing/floating. I too noticed that little item right away. Jake is right, it's better to keep the head absolutely still and bring the pistol to your eyes. Flex is also right, a lot of shooters have a build/body type that for all practical puposes requires a little dip of the chin. As for your par times, your turning draw is faster than mine. And I me a lot faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbadaboom Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 I've been working on getting my weak hand moving toward the gun in lieu of bringing the gun to my "Floating" hand. After the "Hand Floating" issue was pointed out to me it became so obvious that I noticed it greatly during my practice where I never noticed it before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdragon Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 Like Tightloop said, Sort of. Where your head goes your A$& will follow. Get Jerry Barnharts vids. Ivan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted March 2, 2006 Share Posted March 2, 2006 I don't know if this will help, but I have better success if I drive the gun to my targets with my weakhand. As stated above you are driving it with your right. I dip my head when shooting irons, I don't when shooting open. Don't know it matters at all. Keep at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbadaboom Posted March 2, 2006 Author Share Posted March 2, 2006 Like Tightloop said, Sort of. Where your head goes your A$& will follow. Get Jerry Barnharts vids.Ivan I've got em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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