ihatepickles Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I'm curious if anyone's perfected getting 20 rounds in a TS magazine with the Taylor baseplates. I'm using the Glock +5 springs that Taylor recommends as well as the steel CZ internal base platform and I only get 19 rounds. Anyone with some tricks? Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 nothing to add but my curiousity... what's the trick??? tricks??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Managed it once with a cut-down SV brand competition follower for the 2011 (the red one). The follower was cut because it was too long, front to back. However, I could not get the follower to either stay on the spring or in the magazine. It would either pop out the top or worse, fly off completely. Solve that problem & you should have 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_Mink Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Here is how I did it, it works so far and I have about 4 people using this setup with no problems so far. Take the mag apart. You won't be needing the stock floorplate or the insert. Take the Taylor basepad and grind the entire rear inside lip of the pad to create a chamfer inside. You are doing this to give the follower the last little bit of movement down the tube and into the pad to get the last round or 2 in. The follower can bind in this area and limit capacity. You also need to grind the outside back corners of the pad to make it fit the magwell better. Also take the follower and chamfer the bottom rear edges of the legs to make it clear the pad a little easier. So you end up using the stock tube, follower and spring, and the Taylor basepad. I didn't need to use the Glock springs, not yet anyway. I am wondering how long the stock spring will work, but so far so good and I know a local guy has shot a few thousand out of his and they are holding up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted February 21, 2006 Author Share Posted February 21, 2006 I'll give this method a shot. The only thing I don't like is removing the insert, that's going to make disassembly and reassembly harder. It seems pretty easy to damage springs during disassembly without that insert. Any idea if the Glock +5 springs will limit capacity vs. the stock springs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I'll give this method a shot. The only thing I don't like is removing the insert, that's going to make disassembly and reassembly harder. It seems pretty easy to damage springs during disassembly without that insert.Any idea if the Glock +5 springs will limit capacity vs. the stock springs? Agree - but an alternative is to take the stock plastic insert (about 2mm thick) and replace it with thin metal insert at <1mm thick. I made my own, but a standard CZ-75B insert could be ground to fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted February 21, 2006 Author Share Posted February 21, 2006 Agree - but an alternative is to take the stock plastic insert (about 2mm thick) and replace it with thin metal insert at <1mm thick. I made my own, but a standard CZ-75B insert could be ground to fit. I know you're probably dealing with IPSC Standard mags, but the stock TS mag insert is already thin steel (not exactly sure, probably about 1mm) with a lip. It sounds like any insert at all is going to limit the capacity but you can bet I'll try every possible configuration after chamfering the baseplate as Matt suggested. Ideally, I'd love to get the Glock +5 spring working with the stock insert and still cram 20 rounds in the mag, but I doubt I'm going to get that working unless I grind the entire inner base of the baseplate down another millimeter. Taylor may have a good reason for not thinning the baseplates more, but if that's the case I guess I'll find out the hard way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_Mink Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I tried using the 170mm Glock mag, but that only let me get 18rds in the mag. I clipped coils til I got 20, and ended up with a mag spring that is close in length to the stock TS spring or 140mm Glock spring. So might as well use the stock spring or the 140mm spring, no clipping required. Removing the insert actually makes disassembly/reassembly 10000 times easier, believe it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted February 21, 2006 Author Share Posted February 21, 2006 Removing the insert actually makes disassembly/reassembly 10000 times easier, believe it or not. You don't find that the spring gets twisted and pinched when you disassemble without the insert? You're right, it seems very counter-intuitive that assembly and disassembly would be easier without the insert. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_Mink Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I was afraid of that at first, but I just slide the basepad off the mag until it just clears the locking tabs and it pops off, no damage to the spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted February 22, 2006 Author Share Posted February 22, 2006 Well, I've done the modification and it works pretty well. First, let me say I'm using TS mags, not IPSC Standard mags, which are roughly the same with slightly different internals, namely the insert. This shoudl work on IPSC mags too, but without the insert. I did all my work with a couple of handfiles in about 1 hour. Once I'm sure the initial work is ok, I'm sure I can do the modfication in about 15 minutes on my remaining unmodified baseplates. Pictures forthcoming, hopefully by the weekend. I'm unable to get the Glock 140mm springs working to 20 rounds. The Glock spring is actually beginning to cause other problems too. The spring is more narrow than the stock springs, so it has a tendency to "lean" inside the mag body. Occasionally, this causes the follower to rotate and jam in the lower part of the magazine. The Glock 140mm spring has 1 extra coil than the stock spring, which would be nice insurance on the last 2-3 rounds in the magazine but the spring demensions don't align perfectly with the mag bodies and I'm having issues as a result. So far the best I've gotten with the Glock 140mm springs is 19 rounds. I don't think the extra coil is causing the problem - I think it's the fact that the spring doesn't quite fit the mag correctly and as the spring compresses, it doesn't follow an orderly pattern. I think I'm going to abandon the Glock 140mm (also called the +5 +10% spring by Taylor Freelance) spring. I'm now able to get 20 rounds in the mag following Matt Mink's advice. I took things half a step further, and squared off the internal rear corners of the baseplate. Freshly stock, these rear corners are machined rounded, by squaring them off it seemed like the follower legs had a much easier path to decend into the baseplate. I also created a small chamfer on the rear edge of the baseplate and on the rear legs of the follower, as Matt described. Regarding the insert. I've tried it both ways and it works (I can load 20 rounds) whether the insert is in or out of the magazine. However, I don't think speed reloads will work well if the insert is included in the magazine. There's not much free spring with the inserts left in. I'm wondering about the gap that's obvious with the new baseplates. At the rear of the baseplate, between the aluminum "Fort Knox" retainer plate and the mag body, is a sizeable gap. This gap is about 2mm in size and the baseplate can shift front to rear as a result. I may create a shim to glue onto the aluminum Fort Knox plate, to prevent the mag body from sliding forwards and backwards in the gap. The reason I care about this gap, is this is likely where the follower rear legs are getting hung up on during the decent into the baseplate, depending on whether the mag body is slid all the way forward or to the rear. Like I said, I'll take some pictures and see what the crowd thinks about the rear inside corners as well as the leaning spring of Pisa (the Glock 140mm spring). The gap will be harder to photograph, maybe a bit of white-out will make things easier to see in a picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew_Mink Posted February 22, 2006 Share Posted February 22, 2006 Yeah I noticed the gap also between the mag body and retainer. I was thinking of being the top of the metal tab in a bit to take that gap out, but haven't tried anything yet. I didn't notice the Glock magsprings bending or anything, but that doesn't mean it wasn't doing it. Matter of fact I seem to remember once I had the follower lean over but I don't remember what spring I was using. I like your idea of squaring out the rear corners of the basepad. Gonna try that tonight and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihatepickles Posted February 22, 2006 Author Share Posted February 22, 2006 The spring leaning is pretty obvious once you take the spring out of the mag. The springs I tested with have a distinct bow shape to them now. I didn't measure, but I'd guess the Glock springs are at least 1/4" narrower (width and depth) than the stock springs. There must be an obvious reason, but since I don't know I guess I'll ask: why not use STI springs? The internal magazine dimensions of the STI seems fairly close to the TS dimensions. No one that I know sells STI parts locally, so I'd have to order some springs to test with. Is the top of the Wolff or ISMI STI spring compatible with the TS follower? It just doesn't feel right using the stock springs with extended baseplates. This has got to eventually cause failures to feed, based on what I've seen with every other extended mag situation I've dealt with (Glocks and Paras). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Middle Man Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 From the CZ TS 2.5 Basepad thread http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...c=46390&hl= Experiment Grams # FKS9-11 kit in a CZ TS .40 with Taylor Freelance 2.5 Basepad Result 21 rounds. No retainer plate. Slide even locks back! Summary So the Grams FKS9-11 arrived and I installed the spring/follower kit in my TS mag with a TF 2.5 basepad (I left out the retainer plate). In short, it worked like a charm. The follower looks odd sitting in the empty mag and it looks even stranger when you load one round and it assumes what I can only term as a "10 & 2" position. However, the Grams follower is securely attached to the spring and I'm not too concerned with it doing anything funny. I was only able to load and hand cycle my CZ. Having run it by hand a few times, as well as, loading and unloading the magazine, spring, follower, base combo I am confident in the setup. A mag with 21 rounds will not reload at speed. It'll be my starter mag, it's a tight fit under the mag catch with the new spring. The setup loaded with 20 should reload well, but I did not think to try that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 what follower are you using? are you using the sti follower? hmm nice experiment i just hope the springs last ....my 21 rnd experiment caused me 2 springs in 2 months and a lot of jams in local matches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfinney Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 (edited) what follower are you using? are you using the sti follower? hmm nice experiment i just hope the springs last ....my 21 rnd experiment caused me 2 springs in 2 months and a lot of jams in local matches The Grams # FKS9-11 kit comes with its own follower, by Grams, made for an SV/STI. Seems to be the popular choice for anyone tuning up EAA/CZ/Caspian or other mags as well.... Edited April 24, 2007 by sfinney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Middle Man Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 what follower are you using? are you using the sti follower? hmm nice experiment i just hope the springs last ....my 21 rnd experiment caused me 2 springs in 2 months and a lot of jams in local matches The Grams # FKS9-11 kit comes with its own follower, by Grams, made for an SV/STI. Seems to be the popular choice for anyone tuning up EAA/CZ/Caspian or other mags as well.... Yep, the Grams 9mm follower may be a little short front to back and look odd, but it has worked like a charm hand cycling the gun. It even locked the slide back. I'm going to run this setup in a match this weekend. When the next batch of mad money comes along, I'm going to get another TF 2.5 basepad and try a Grams kit with the .40 S_I captured follower, it may be a perfect fit in a TS magazine... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 (edited) what follower are you using? are you using the sti follower? hmm nice experiment i just hope the springs last ....my 21 rnd experiment caused me 2 springs in 2 months and a lot of jams in local matches The Grams # FKS9-11 kit comes with its own follower, by Grams, made for an SV/STI. Seems to be the popular choice for anyone tuning up EAA/CZ/Caspian or other mags as well.... Yep, the Grams 9mm follower may be a little short front to back and look odd, but it has worked like a charm hand cycling the gun. It even locked the slide back. I'm going to run this setup in a match this weekend. When the next batch of mad money comes along, I'm going to get another TF 2.5 basepad and try a Grams kit with the .40 S_I captured follower, it may be a perfect fit in a TS magazine... ive tried using the 40sw spring kit and the results really were not that satisfying.. even with heavy dremeling the follower catches the mag catch hole (2 holes in the mag body) and causes the springs to bind and malfunction...ill try the 9mm grams Edited April 24, 2007 by ogiebb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Middle Man Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 Thanks for the heads up, I'll stick with the 9mm kit then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Middle Man Posted May 1, 2007 Share Posted May 1, 2007 From the CZ TS 2.5 Basepad threadhttp://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?...c=46390&hl= Experiment Grams # FKS9-11 kit in a CZ TS .40 with Taylor Freelance 2.5 Basepad Result 21 rounds. No retainer plate. Slide even locks back! Summary So the Grams FKS9-11 arrived and I installed the spring/follower kit in my TS mag with a TF 2.5 basepad (I left out the retainer plate). In short, it worked like a charm. The follower looks odd sitting in the empty mag and it looks even stranger when you load one round and it assumes what I can only term as a "10 & 2" position. However, the Grams follower is securely attached to the spring and I'm not too concerned with it doing anything funny. I was only able to load and hand cycle my CZ. Having run it by hand a few times, as well as, loading and unloading the magazine, spring, follower, base combo I am confident in the setup. A mag with 21 rounds will not reload at speed. It'll be my starter mag, it's a tight fit under the mag catch with the new spring. The setup loaded with 20 should reload well, but I did not think to try that. SUCCESS Setup worked like a charm this past weekend with 21 rounds and 20 rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 i wonder if this follower and spring combo could work with Angus new basepad we might be looking at a 22+1 starter and a reloadable 21 mag...bah!! it hink im pushing it way too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 I've got one magazine with a follower I modified based on discussion from this forum and factory spring with modified Taylor Freelance 2.5+ basepad that will give me 20 and will allow 21 but as Angus says it "swells" the magazine and makes it difficult to fit into my grip frame. I only load it to 20 when the stage may not require a reload (18 & under minimum) and have not chanced it with 21. I'm hoping to get the new base pads & springs from Angus soon but would also like to try the Grams follower and spring with the newer TF basepads. I've tried the 40 Grams and it did not work so well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Middle Man Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 (edited) Just ordered one of Angus' new basepad and spring setups this morning. Check out the photos on Angus' page Edited May 2, 2007 by Middle Man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogiebb Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 i do like the way it looks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neomet Posted May 3, 2007 Share Posted May 3, 2007 Oh YEAH, those look sweet and Angus was saying they run very, very nice. "But Honey, its only $120 for three of them!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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