Tanfo V12 9 month follow up

[Dan4147]

Posted several months back as an excited new owner of the Gold Team.  I still love the gun in the same respect to why I got one, but, the affair has it’s bumps.  All of the playing and tuning and testing has been fun and yielded even better results than I expected.  Thanks to the members here who share help and experience. Now the main “bump in the road”.

 

The chrome beauty has really let me down in matches.  1. Ejection; even after all known tuning it was eratic and problematic. I had to remove the nice ipsc alex mount and use the eaa mount one side secured.  So now it doesn’t bounce brass off the back of my rts2 and mount, back into the chamber.  2.  And the biggie is, nose dives. I started using Henning +5s and a TF +10 all with grams guts. Nose dives!  When I figured out that 1.145 was too long for the mags liking and changed to 1.135 and 1.125 it got better. But not gone. I switched the springs and followers back to stock (considerable modifications to the followers to get function) and results were successful except for the 27 round mag. It still nose dives every time out, usually happening between the 5th to 10th round.  So I have no big stick. 

 

Observation/overthinking; Yes I know range brass and bullet profile are factors, but on to some mechanics. There are 2 “interior ribs” running the length of the eaa/mecgar mags, down close to the base area. They evidently have to do with bullet movement rolling up the tube.  The extended base pads don’t have these ribs, as well as the bottom 3/8 inch or so of the tubes.  So that entire lower area of the mag is wider than the upper area with ribs.  bullets/springs/followers are misbehaving there.  Of course the area of transition to single stack doesn’t work either.

 

So, let’s get a 27 full length tube, and no, mbx is out.

[Sean_ht]

I have a similar model. It is super nice (look and performance). Have you upgraded the trigger system? For me, it is the only downside part of the gun. However, the whole trigger system will cost some good number of green notes. 

[Dan4147]

7 hours ago, Sean_ht said:

I have a similar model. It is super nice (look and performance). Have you upgraded the trigger system? For me, it is the only downside part of the gun. However, the whole trigger system will cost some good number of green notes. 

 

Sean, yes I have. You can eliminate the downside.  There is plenty of opinions and experience on BE forum to do that.  And yes, it’s just money.  I have 2 open 1911 based guns with ridiculous/perfect triggers, and now my Tanfo is almost as good. 1lb 12oz crisp break and tiny reset.  Here is what it took, and you can search and study the “how to’s” as others have explained better than I can.  From bottom to top:

 

Polish internals

Henning flat trigger

Patriot Defense light springs

Patriot Defense bolo

Patriot Defense Titan hammer

Aftermarket exrended firing pin

possible experiments with sear

 

Think of it like every gun is different.  What may work great in some cases may give you grief, or may be easy the first try.  Good luck!

 

 

[Glk21C]

The nose dives are most likely a problem with the tubes being too wide at the double stack to single stack transition.  Tighten that up some and those problems will most likely go away.   Do some searching, you’ll find posts that more fully explain how to do it.

the space at the bottom of the tubes can be helped by smoothing the control ribs transition at the bottom.   They are not typically “smooth” or “flat “ enough so the follower can get caught there.  File, sand, make it a smoother transition.

good luck 

[Sean_ht]

2 hours ago, Dan4147 said:

 

Sean, yes I have. You can eliminate the downside.  There is plenty of opinions and experience on BE forum to do that.  And yes, it’s just money.  I have 2 open 1911 based guns with ridiculous/perfect triggers, and now my Tanfo is almost as good. 1lb 12oz crisp break and tiny reset.  Here is what it took, and you can search and study the “how to’s” as others have explained better than I can.  From bottom to top:

 

Polish internals

Henning flat trigger

Patriot Defense light springs

Patriot Defense bolo

Patriot Defense Titan hammer

Aftermarket exrended firing pin

possible experiments with sear

 

Think of it like every gun is different.  What may work great in some cases may give you grief, or may be easy the first try.  Good luck!

 

 

Thanks a lot. That list is exactly what I needed  

[Glk21C]

here is some old text from Jim Anglin, explaining what I mentioned.  Below that is a thread with pics, explaining basically the same thing.  Lastly, Atlas has a youtube video about the same context on STI mags, although what they don't show is the need to keep the tube shape "square'd".  Start squeezing the tube too much and you'll ruin it.

 

Ya need to get the second round over under the top round, the second round in the mag supports the top round, if the second round is off to one side the top round will nose dive.

Take to pieces of round plastic 1/4" in dia tape these two pieces into the groove at the top of the mag, then take a small clamp with two pieces of wood cut the same width as the mag and clamp these two pieces of wood to the front and back of the mag. Dont put any more pressure on the clamp than it takes to hold the wood strips in place.

Put the mag with this set up attached to it in a vise and squeeze the top of the mag together while watching the second round(go slow!) when it moves over under the top round some release the pressure and note if the second round has moved more under the top round thanwhen ya started, keep doing this till you have the second round pretty much under the top round, then put three rounds in the mag repeat and then four rounds and repeat. check how your mag feeds now with no recoil spring in the gun, when ya have it right the round should go into battery with just thumb pressure on the back of the slide.  Only do this with a grams follower and spring set up if ya do this with the stock follower you will bend heck out of your

mag and ruin it.

Jim/Pa

Sailors

 

 

[Dan4147]

12 hours ago, Glk21C said:

The nose dives are most likely a problem with the tubes being too wide at the double stack to single stack transition.  Tighten that up some and those problems will most likely go away.   Do some searching, you’ll find posts that more fully explain how to do it.

the space at the bottom of the tubes can be helped by smoothing the control ribs transition at the bottom.   They are not typically “smooth” or “flat “ enough so the follower can get caught there.  File, sand, make it a smoother transition.

good luck 

 

Yep.  Thanks. I made tentative efforts at the sqeezing process for the transition but the mags spring back. Guess I’ll have to be more determined as I am now willing to sacrifice a tube. 

 

The ribs seem to me to be a more permanent cause to non 100% function. The lower part of the tube (stock mag) where there are no ribs is designed to be the area where the spring stacks, not the bullets.  With a +10 base, or maybe plus 5, bullets are in areas with no ribs and who knows what happens.  Here’s hoping MBX will make some more. 

[sean_stw]

I had the tanfo v12 for a little while about a year or two ago and I was also having problems with nose dives and other problems with the rounds getting stuck in the mag. I had a 170mm and 140mm mbx mag and those had very similar issues. I tried all different things to try to fix the issue like squeezing the mag body, springs and followers and it made things a little better but still was having way to many issues. I tried different bullet lengths and profiles but nothing seemed to ever make a huge difference.

 

I really wish that I could have figured out a way to make the mags more reliable because I loved the feel of the gun, the trigger was awesome with all the Henning and Patriot Defense parts. The other issue that I had with the v12 9mm was having to use a crazy amount of powder to make major and was limited to oal because of the short chamber of the tanfo. The 38 super model probably takes care of all or most of the issues that 9mm has but I wasn't willing to spend all that money on 38 super and be scrounging after matches trying to get as much of it as I could get.

[Dan4147]

43 minutes ago, sean_stw said:

I had the tanfo v12 for a little while about a year or two ago and I was also having problems with nose dives and other problems with the rounds getting stuck in the mag. I had a 170mm and 140mm mbx mag and those had very similar issues. I tried all different things to try to fix the issue like squeezing the mag body, springs and followers and it made things a little better but still was having way to many issues. I tried different bullet lengths and profiles but nothing seemed to ever make a huge difference.

 

I really wish that I could have figured out a way to make the mags more reliable because I loved the feel of the gun, the trigger was awesome with all the Henning and Patriot Defense parts. The other issue that I had with the v12 9mm was having to use a crazy amount of powder to make major and was limited to oal because of the short chamber of the tanfo. The 38 super model probably takes care of all or most of the issues that 9mm has but I wasn't willing to spend all that money on 38 super and be scrounging after matches trying to get as much of it as I could get.

 

Sean, same here exactly.  I will download short mags and still have fun, knowing it’s not satisfactory.  On major, I never had any issue with Autocomp, HS6, but Major Pistol and 3n38 were too much hassle.  On mine, I found that getting close to 175pf really flattened it out.  Also, I’m going to sroke it just for grins and giggles to see if anything changes. Nothing to lose. 

 

Where are your mbx mags now?????  Lol.

[arkadi]

The long stick Tanfoglio sold me some 2-3 years ago has no spacer plate while being marked 9mm. It doesn't work with FKK9-13 kit. I ran it with Grams spring and stock follower at 170mm for 26-rounds reloadable with no issues, IIRC. It will hold 25 rounds of 38 Super too. FKK38-13 could be the right kit for such tube.

 

[arkadi]

Never got to the point to make a Major gun out of it, yet shooting hotter Minor loads solved ejection problems with AlexMount.

[sean_stw]

48 minutes ago, Dan4147 said:

 

Sean, same here exactly.  I will download short mags and still have fun, knowing it’s not satisfactory.  On major, I never had any issue with Autocomp, HS6, but Major Pistol and 3n38 were too much hassle.  On mine, I found that getting close to 175pf really flattened it out.  Also, I’m going to sroke it just for grins and giggles to see if anything changes. Nothing to lose. 

 

Where are your mbx mags now?????  Lol.

 

Funny thing you mentioned you where thinking of stroking the tanfo because I did that to the one I had. I took .250" off the slide but to me it didn't really seem to make a noticeable difference. I finally gave up on the tanfo though after fighting with the mag issues for months and could never get them to run even 75% of the time so I traded the tanfo for an akai 2011 limited gun and that got me into 2011's. I now have a 9mm 2011 open gun and have been pretty happy with it, less issues more capacity and a lot more support. I still prefer the feel of the tanfo though lol

[Dan4147]

On 1/1/2020 at 5:06 PM, arkadi said:

The long stick Tanfoglio sold me some 2-3 years ago has no spacer plate while being marked 9mm. It doesn't work with FKK9-13 kit. I ran it with Grams spring and stock follower at 170mm for 26-rounds reloadable with no issues, IIRC. It will hold 25 rounds of 38 Super too. FKK38-13 could be the right kit for such tube.

 

 

Wish we could get that long tube over here. I would take 9 or 38. 

[Dan4147]

On 12/31/2019 at 9:30 PM, Glk21C said:

The nose dives are most likely a problem with the tubes being too wide at the double stack to single stack transition.  Tighten that up some and those problems will most likely go away.   Do some searching, you’ll find posts that more fully explain how to do it.

the space at the bottom of the tubes can be helped by smoothing the control ribs transition at the bottom.   They are not typically “smooth” or “flat “ enough so the follower can get caught there.  File, sand, make it a smoother transition.

good luck 

 

Well your post gave me some inspiration and it paid off. I beveled or eased the end of the control bumps on the inside of the mag so the transition of the bullet from the “flat” area to the ribs is gradual. For testing i only did the front rib on each side of the tube. Then I seriously polished the ground area. Tested with henning 141 and 121 base pads and grams guts was successful. Even better, the TF +10 base even shoots 100% (100 rounds) without nose dives. For the heck of it I did the same grind polish steps on all 4 ribs on a 2nd tube. It tested out and performed the same 100%. I think the henning 121/ipsc bases would probably work with a unmodified tube, but I won’t chance it after blowing matches recently. I am ready!

 

oh, I used a dremel withe a small tapered abrasive tip. Then a small hard fiber tip and polish compound. 

Edited January 10, 2020 by Dan4147