Cherokeewind Posted September 14, 2016 Share Posted September 14, 2016 I am setting up two S&W 629 Classics for DA, mostly for fun shooting in my back yard. I want the lightest DA pull I can get with reliable ignition of Federal primers. Will an aftermarket firing pin help? Is there any real practical difference between the C&S and the Apex? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted September 14, 2016 Share Posted September 14, 2016 I expect strong opinions. I have used both successfully and have never broken either. The only ones I have ever heard of breaking are C&S. A very experienced revolver shooter I know thinks extended pins are a solution to a non-problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian B Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 I am setting up two S&W 629 Classics for DA, mostly for fun shooting in my back yard. I want the lightest DA pull I can get with reliable ignition of Federal primers. Will an aftermarket firing pin help? Is there any real practical difference between the C&S and the Apex? ThanksI use an extended Firing Pin in my S&W 610 using moon clips with .40cal 180 grain FMJ Federal. This makes major power factor in IPSC/USPSA. There was one failure to go bang every 3 to 4 clips. There has been 100% reliability after installing the extended firing pin. The potential variances which could occur with moon clips may cause the failures. The extended firing pin helps bridge that gap. What It Does The Apex Competition Firing Pin Kit is Intended for competition use only. The kit consists of the firing pin (17-4 heat treated stainless steel) and a reduced power firing pin return spring and was designed specifically to reduce the probability of light hits for high performance trigger action work- specifically handloads using Federal primers seated .008"-.010" in depth. Expected Results – Applicable To What Gun(s) Works in current production Smith & Wesson K-Frame, L-Frame and N-Frame revolvers.In The Package 1 ea. Apex Competition Firing Pin 1 ea. Reduced power firing pin return spring (light) https://store.apextactical.com/WebDirect/Products/Details/191695Good shootingBrian B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanMan1961 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) I think the profile of the point of the firing pin makes a bigger difference than standard vs extended length. I did some testing with my 929 with the stock vs C&S extended firing pin. Below is a pic of the two for comparison. The stock 929 firing pin on the left is chamfered to a fairly pointy profile. The C&S extended firing is fairly blunt. I tested various primers (cases resized and primed only - no power or projectile). I gradually increased the trigger pull weight by adjusting the strain screw until I could get 2 full moonclips to fire off. Trigger pull weight measured with a Lyman electronic trigger pull gauge (avg of 5 pulls). The stock S&W firing pin required 7-12oz LESS force. If I get the time and can confirm that the C&S firing pin is through-hardened rather than case hardened, I may try reprofiling the point and do some more testing. Note, the stock S&W firing pin is from their "Performance Center" revolver. The firing pins on some of my other S&W revolvers appear to be more blunt. Edited September 15, 2016 by VanMan1961 I should drink more coffee before I txt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 That is the 929 firing pin right, the hollow one? That is supposedly miculeks design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherokeewind Posted September 15, 2016 Author Share Posted September 15, 2016 Your pic of the S&W stock pin looks very much like the Apex pin that I have. I think I have read someplace that the PC pins are from Apex or they are of very similar design. The weight numbers you gave are helpful. Thanks, Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanMan1961 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 2 hours ago, seanc said: That is the 929 firing pin right, the hollow one? That is supposedly miculeks design. Right, the hollow firing pin comes standard on the 929's. Along with uncle Jerry's signature on the side plate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 The C&S firing pin is made of S-7 tool steel, so is through hardened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanMan1961 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 11 minutes ago, Toolguy said: The C&S firing pin is made of S-7 tool steel, so is through hardened. Thanks, good to know. Maybe I'll try reprofiling it and test it again during the off season. Also itching to install an Apex hammer too, but I'll rerun the firing pin test first so all other parameters are the same. Damn, tinkering with revolvers is addictive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherokeewind Posted September 15, 2016 Author Share Posted September 15, 2016 Addictive and fun..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMM50 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Also consider the side cut in the firing pin. That's how the firing pin is retained in the frame. The location of that cut can move both end stops of the firing pin. Causing more or less travel at both ends. Same shaped pin with different cut location will act differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanMan1961 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 19 minutes ago, GMM50 said: Also consider the side cut in the firing pin. That's how the firing pin is retained in the frame. The location of that cut can move both end stops of the firing pin. Causing more or less travel at both ends. Same shaped pin with different cut location will act differently. good point. Here's the firing pin from my 929 on the left and the C&S extended firing pin on the right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 If your gun has the blunt Ti factory pin that measures .495", you won't improve on it. If you have the newer CA-drop-test version that is pointy and shorter, you'll want something different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanMan1961 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 9 minutes ago, Carmoney said: If your gun has the blunt Ti factory pin that measures .495", you won't improve on it. If you have the newer CA-drop-test version that is pointy and shorter, you'll want something different. Is the " CA-drop-test version" what comes standard in my 929? It's magnetic so I know it's not titanium. I didn't S&W Ti factory firing pin on Brownells. Any idea where I could pick one up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherokeewind Posted September 16, 2016 Author Share Posted September 16, 2016 My pin measures .489 and is pointy but not quite as pointy as the Apex pin. The Apex pin that I have is .495.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 To me, .495 is the shortest you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan454 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 10 hours ago, Cherokeewind said: My pin measures .489 and is pointy but not quite as pointy as the Apex pin. The Apex pin that I have is .495.... This is what I found in my 929 as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherokeewind Posted September 17, 2016 Author Share Posted September 17, 2016 13 hours ago, Toolguy said: To me, .495 is the shortest you want. I expected it to be longer:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanMan1961 Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 14 hours ago, Toolguy said: To me, .495 is the shortest you want. as GMM50 pointed out above, wouldn't the dimensions of the side cut be just as important? You could be .495 OAL, but if your side cut is off by .005, you will have reduced your effective firing pin length by .005", It would be tough to measure without a jig though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherokeewind Posted September 17, 2016 Author Share Posted September 17, 2016 If the hammer contacts the frame, overall pin length (and protrusion) would seem to be the important factors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanMan1961 Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 2 hours ago, Cherokeewind said: If the hammer contacts the frame, overall pin length (and protrusion) would seem to be the important factors. good point. I just checked some of my revolvers, the firing pins all bottom out below the frame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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