A newbie classification question

[JusticeOfToren]

Please bear with me as I just started USPSA last December, and I am still trying to make sense of how the scores are included/excluded in the calculations.

Basically, I received A class after my first 6 scores in March, which seemed all working as the rule book says. The strange part came with the July update that just happened last night I think.

Here is all my scores when the July update ran:

According to rule book, the 64% and 48% should be marked as "B", just like the 62% and 63%. I am not sure why they are included as my "most recent 8".

My understanding of the "most recent 8" is the most recent 8 that are within your brackets. For me, it would be the most recent 8 scores >70%. Just out of curiosity, I randomly looked at some other people's classification records, and that seems to be the case for some of them. For example, here is a M class shooter:

However, there are others I noticed where below bracket scores were included for calculation too. Here is another M class shooter where blow brackets score, 78%, was included as his most recent 8.

I know many people don't care about classifications, but for a newbie like me, this is one area that the rule book and the actual thing appear to have a big discrepancy. I feel the need to get a solid and correct understanding of how it works.

Please share your insights and help me. Thanks.

Edited July 16, 2016 by JusticeOfToren

[jakemaul]

"F" means *not* used.

[JusticeOfToren]

"F" means *not* used.

Edited July 16, 2016 by JusticeOfToren

[JusticeOfToren]

I understand F means "not used", but they are not used because they are "lowest 2 among the most recent 8 or 6".

I don't understand why they were included as part of the "most recent 8 or 6" in the first place. That's my question.

If as rule book says, they are marked as B instead of F, then my first ever score of 94% would have been included in my most recent 8

[JusticeOfToren]

OK. I have asked several people, but no one can solve this mystery yet

Asking for the wisdom of the forum here:

When classification calculation happens, should the below-bracket scores be included in the "most recent 8", or should they be excluded?

I am looking at my July 2016 update result, and it puzzles me. I was initially classified as A class in March 2016, and based on the Rule Book, any score below 70% should be marked as "B".

However, some of my below-bracket scores were marked as "B" while some were marked as "F" in the July update.

Here is how my scores look like right now:

09-14 Y 84.9369
99-12 Y 97.6492
08-01 Y 85.031
03-09 B 62.6894
99-07 B 63.3585
03-03 Y 85.6618
06-02 Y 71.6945
99-08 Y 83.8943
08-01 D 72.0588
03-04 F 64.039
08-03 F 48.845
06-03 E 94.0186

Notice the 62% and 63% were marked as "B" correctly, but the 48% and 64% were marked as "F" instead of "B". That effectively pushes the 94% out of most recent 8.

If my understanding of the Rule Book is correct, here is how the scores should look like:

09-14 Y 84.9369
99-12 Y 97.6492
08-01 Y 85.031
03-09 B 62.6894
99-07 B 63.3585
03-03 Y 85.6618
06-02 F 71.6945
99-08 Y 83.8943
08-01 D 72.0588
03-04 B 64.039
08-03 B 48.845
06-03 Y 94.0186

Anyone can help me understand how this works?

Thanks!

[Hi-Power Jack]

An "expert" will be along soon.

Meanwhile, congrats of the 94% 06-03, and 98% 99-12.

[High Lord Gomer]

This score is more than 5% below the minimum score for your current class and cannot be used. Please note that you may have scores from your initial classification that are lower than more recent scores that are flagged B. This is because all scores regardless of percentage are used to determine your initial classification; however, after you have earned your initial classification only scores that are at higher than 5% below the minimum score for your class can be used.

It seems that the only time a score gets flagged with a "B" is if you are already classified and you get a score more than 5% below your classification.

If a score is ever used for your classification it seems to never get flagged as a "B" but rather might get downgraded to a "F" and still count to push your 94 to an "E".

[Sarge]

Are you certain the system has updated?

[JusticeOfToren]

This score is more than 5% below the minimum score for your current class and cannot be used. Please note that you may have scores from your initial classification that are lower than more recent scores that are flagged B. This is because all scores regardless of percentage are used to determine your initial classification; however, after you have earned your initial classification only scores that are at higher than 5% below the minimum score for your class can be used.

It seems that the only time a score gets flagged with a "B" is if you are already classified and you get a score more than 5% below your classification.

If a score is ever used for your classification it seems to never get flagged as a "B" but rather might get downgraded to a "F" and still count to push your 94 to an "E".

Still does not make sense because my initial classification of A class in March looked like this:

06-02 Y 71.6945

99-08 Y 83.8943

08-01 Y 72.0588

03-04 F 64.039

08-03 F 48.845

06-03 Y 94.0186

Did you suggest the 64% and 48% were used for my initial classification, thus they will never become "B"? However, they were not "used" for the average. I guess maybe you meant if they ever have an "F" they will never be marked as "B"?

[JusticeOfToren]

Are you certain the system has updated?

Yes I am positive as the web page shows:

Data On Web Updated: 7/16/16

[jakemaul]

Sorry, I misread your question.

It has to do with the ordering of the checks they make during the classification run. The rulebook doesn't explain this.

I'm trying to duplicate the logic... I have something that mostly works. It gets it right for *me*, but picks the wrong ones for *you*. This is something I've been meaning to do for a long time for my website anyway.

I'll report back when I have something interesting.

[JusticeOfToren]

I think I got an answer that kinda explains the behavior.

Basically, "B", "A" can only appear on "new" scores as they are entered. If a score has ever been "F" or "Y", they will never become "B" or "A".

What this means - scores that were ever included in your most recent 8 or 6 will never be "B". They will only be pushed out by new scores that are within your brackets.

This applies not only to initial classifications, but also class bumps. For example, as A class you have a 71% score listed as one of the two lowest in the most recent 8, e.g. "F". When you reach M class, this score will continue to be "F" until you have enough M class scores to push this one out of the most recent 8.

This explains the behavior, though not making a lot of sense and sounds very complicated. Definitely not documented in the Rule Book!

Edited July 18, 2016 by JusticeOfToren

[High Lord Gomer]

Yeah, I wasn't very clear. Rather than "used" I should have said "considered" in determining the average.

[Mhall]

Like it was said in the other discussion on this topic, they do initial classifications on best 4 of 6 and ongoing best 6 of 8. This was confirmed to me when I shot a classifier match and decided to give revolver a try.

REVOLVER Classifiers Date Number Club F Percent Entered

4/09/16 99-10 METRO AREA PRACTICAL SHOOTING ASSN Y 31.0619 4/11/16

4/09/16 06-05 METRO AREA PRACTICAL SHOOTING ASSN Y 47.3200 4/11/16

4/09/16 99-11 METRO AREA PRACTICAL SHOOTING ASSN Y 45.5000 4/11/16

4/09/16 03-09 METRO AREA PRACTICAL SHOOTING ASSN Y 48.9325 4/11/16

4/09/16 06-03 METRO AREA PRACTICAL SHOOTING ASSN Y 61.7001 4/11/16

4/09/16 08-03 METRO AREA PRACTICAL SHOOTING ASSN Y 77.7900 4/11/16

I classified as a "B" with a percentage of 58.xx. After the next update happened, all scores were used to calculate, even though the 31% shouldn't be considered for a "B" shooter. But since it was "in the mix" it gets used for subsequent calculations even though its below the threshold.

When I classified in LTD the same thing happened I classified "A" and a 55% was used for calculations. It didn't really matter because it expired soon enough.

Justice, just keep shooting those high 90s and you will get the GM card soon enough. Looks like you have the skills to keep it up.

Edited July 19, 2016 by Mhall

[9x45]

You don't want to move up thru classification, only thru match bumps.