ToneSurfer Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 So installed an Apex Competition Action Enhancement Kit (sear, springs, ultimate striker block) in my M&P Pro 9mm in July 2015. Yesterday, about 8000+ rounds later the striker failed a safety check. I took out the striker and noticed it is peened over badly on the striker leg. I had seen other threads on this issue, usually associated with the timing being off. I DO NOT see that I have a timing problem, the striker block is pushed well clear when I reach the "wall" on the trigger pull. I checked the loop on the trigger bar and there is no way to close it more (an not necessary as I think the timing is ok). I contacted Apex for suggestions and they said the striker is a wear item and should be replaced between 7000-10000 rounds? Are others experiencing this issue and having to replace strikers often? I've replaced the striker with a spare and all is well again, but for how long? Photo of striker http://i893.photobucket.com/albums/ac135/tonesurfer/striker.jpg Movie of timing. http://vid893.photobucket.com/albums/ac135/tonesurfer/IMG_1261.mp4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mully383 Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I've got about 8000 on my fss with out a problem or signs of wear. Those numbers seem pretty low. My buddy has close too 100,000 on his vtac with only the changing of some springs. How often do clean and lube. What lube do u use. I'm lazy and just been hosing it out with hornady dry lube and cleaner every couple matches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilkMyDuds Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I have 2 APEX CAEK installed by myself and 1 installed by APEX. The one with the most round count has reached about 20,000 with no issues at all. I did change the striker assembly every 10,000 rounds or so and the striker spring every 8,000 rounds or so, although I visually cannot tell the difference between the new one and the ones being replaced. Yours definitely looks abnormal to me. I'd suggest get a brand new striker assembly and see if that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneSurfer Posted February 3, 2016 Author Share Posted February 3, 2016 I had already replaced the striker to get it working safely again. As an experiment I've put the original striker block back in the slide and will monitor for a few hundred rounds to see if it starts happening again. Honestly, I cannot tell a difference between the APEX or the stock striker block. I may leave it in permanently just so I don't have to fart with that rear sight again (although it did seem to come out a bit easier than I remember). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarkeg Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 I had already replaced the striker to get it working safely again. As an experiment I've put the original striker block back in the slide and will monitor for a few hundred rounds to see if it starts happening again. Honestly, I cannot tell a difference between the APEX or the stock striker block. I may leave it in permanently just so I don't have to fart with that rear sight again (although it did seem to come out a bit easier than I remember). There were some APEX USB's that had some interference with strikers. You may want to contact them, they might replace yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneSurfer Posted February 3, 2016 Author Share Posted February 3, 2016 I had already replaced the striker to get it working safely again. As an experiment I've put the original striker block back in the slide and will monitor for a few hundred rounds to see if it starts happening again. Honestly, I cannot tell a difference between the APEX or the stock striker block. I may leave it in permanently just so I don't have to fart with that rear sight again (although it did seem to come out a bit easier than I remember). There were some APEX USB's that had some interference with strikers. You may want to contact them, they might replace yours. I did contact APEX, via email, they replied as follows: The Striker Assembly, Trigger bar, and Springs are all considered wear items. The location of your striker assembly wear is common as it is the leading edge engaging the USB. If it looks to be seriously worn we suggest replacement. S&W recommends inspecting and refreshing these types of wear parts as needed around 7,000-10,000 rounds. I hope that helps a bit. Call us if you have more questions. We are happy to do a tech support and look it over for you if you like. -- Have a great day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted February 3, 2016 Share Posted February 3, 2016 This type of striker to striker block timing issue isn't a surprise on M&P's with the FSS kit installed. The forward set sear changes when the trigger bar pushes up the striker block verses when the striker is dropped and the S&W trigger bar loops are not consistently manufactured in height or bend radius. Every APEX FSS Kit I have installed required adjusting the trigger bar loop height and ramp angle to ensure that the striker block timing was retained. As much as people think these parts are "Drop In", they are not. They are great kits but they still need to be fitted properly and the timing of things accounted for to function reliably for many thousands of rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USA Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 (edited) How do you adjust the height and angle separately? I just use a flathead screwdriver and rotate it inside the loop to open it. I use needle nose pliers or a hammer to close it. Also, how do you test the trigger bar for proper function? I push the slide down towards the frame so that the sear has the longest way to travel to trip the striker. If it trips the striker without fail, then I figure it's okay. I also check whether the USB is interfering by just sticking a pencil in the barrel and seeing how far it is launched. If the pencil flies up and almost hits my ceiling, I figure that's okay too. I thought the above video showing the USB clearing into the slide before hearing the striker fall as a pretty good way to test timing. I didn't think of that before. Curious how you check proper function and timing. Thanks. Edited February 4, 2016 by USA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 The trigger bar loop is nothing more than a bent piece of steel that can be reformed in height and ramp angle as needed. You need more than a screwdriver to do this. As for validating the timing you can do that both directly and indirectly. I use a cut down striker retainer so I can look into the back of the slide and see what is going on directly. I also use a sharpie marker to black out the safety nub on the striker then dry fire it a bunch of times to see if the marker is wiped off due to invalid timing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneSurfer Posted February 4, 2016 Author Share Posted February 4, 2016 This type of striker to striker block timing issue isn't a surprise on M&P's with the FSS kit installed. The forward set sear changes when the trigger bar pushes up the striker block verses when the striker is dropped and the S&W trigger bar loops are not consistently manufactured in height or bend radius. Every APEX FSS Kit I have installed required adjusting the trigger bar loop height and ramp angle to ensure that the striker block timing was retained. As much as people think these parts are "Drop In", they are not. They are great kits but they still need to be fitted properly and the timing of things accounted for to function reliably for many thousands of rounds. I'm not using the FSS, just the ordinary Competiton AEK (sear, usb, springs). I have seen many posts and complaints about striker damage and timing and was aware to check this carefully during my install. Did you look at the video I posted? The striker block is well clear (in fact invisible) before the sear is anywhere near tripping. Any suggestions for me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 (edited) Check it directly by blacking out the striker block leg and dry firing it 20 - 30 times. Then take the striker out and see if the sharpie marker has been wiped off due to it hitting the striker block. Edited February 4, 2016 by CHA-LEE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneSurfer Posted March 13, 2016 Author Share Posted March 13, 2016 Ok, after replacing the APEX USB with the factory original and replacing the striker with a new factory replacement I'm still getting damage to the striker leg. This is about 1000 rounds now since putting in the new striker. The only APEX parts still in the gun are the sear, USB spring, striker spring, and trigger spring. I can't that any of them would contribute to this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 The sear has a direct correlation to the timing of the break of the striker verses when the Striker block is pushed up. You need to tune the loop on the trigger bar so that the striker drops AFTER the striker block is pushed up out of the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneSurfer Posted March 14, 2016 Author Share Posted March 14, 2016 The sear has a direct correlation to the timing of the break of the striker verses when the Striker block is pushed up. You need to tune the loop on the trigger bar so that the striker drops AFTER the striker block is pushed up out of the way. Check out the video in my very first post. I think the block is out of the way long before the striker is released. At least it looks that way to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 It is obviously not if it keeps getting damaged when you shoot it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swordfish Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 What about that problem some were having with the striker rebounding/bouncing back and forth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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